http://www.usatoday.com/news/politicselections/2004-09-21-voterreg-block_x.htm?POE=NEWISVA

This article is very interesting. The pentagon is blocking access to their web site where troops can download absentee ballots to persons who use certain ISPs. Denying troops the right to vote is something that is beyond my comprehension. I am stunned. Yes, those troops affected can still get a ballot by applying at a U.S. Embassy. That is not an option for far to many. Lousy security at the governments web site is a lousy excuse. This should be corrected immediately. I worry that what it really means is that top officials at the Defense Department are worried that the troops in the field may vote out the commander in chief who put them there. If anyone deserves the right to vote, the active duty members of the armed forces do. If this is not corrected, and corrected quickly, many U.S. military personnel may be denied the right to vote. For Shame.

dont bring up blocking military votes if you are a democrat, or prepare to get jacked if you are not a democrat, i can see the concern, but, for all the concerned democrats out there concerned about computer voting, is there no way you cans ee that a web site would not be as vulnrable, or even more so, then touch screens? Government computers are getting hacked and broken into all the time, honestly, I cant believe the anti touch screen crowd would even allow a web site like this to exist. Anyway, the entire time I was in the military, I never once saw a ballot of any kind, nor did I hear anything about voting. And dont worry aobut the troops voting bush out, the military is not liberal democrat, they have been attacked and screwed by them far worse over the years then they may have been screwed by being sent to iraq. Besides, Kerry isnt going to pull them out anyway, o is he? I cant remember what his stance is this week.

Once again you miss the point trav, and turn the discussion to blame the democrats. His point is simple: the people serving overseas have every right to vote, and by denying them the means to vote they are denying them a basic democratic right.

I agree that our troops deserve the right to vote, and I would like to say that I would rather not see anybody vote using a method that doesn't generate a paper ballot.

I think also that it is rather embarrassing if our Dept. of Homeland Security can't even protect a website.

BTW, Welcome to Allforums Imagineer. :)

you mean like the democrats who tried to disqualify the military absentee ballots in Florida 200? becasue they didnt get thre in time? the same demcrats who broke deadline after deadline filing lawsuits? At the time of the 2000 election, I was mainly non political. I was conservative, but not really siding with any one party. But being a veteran, and seeing the shame of those sore loser democrats stopping at nothing to try and steal that election, even trying to stop overseas military ballots from counting, changed everything. the uglyness and desperation for power I witnessed form al gore and the dems sickened me, and ever since then I cant stand them.

Wow, your still not getting it trav. You are trying to argue about points that have nothing to do with the original topic. Get a clue.

We're at war. I see no harm in restricting these web sites. I am sorry that as a by product of these restrictions, Americans serving in the military and/or travelling abroad may not be represented come election time. But as the article said, there have been numerous times these sites have been hacked into.

Originally posted by Travh20
you mean like the democrats who tried to disqualify the military absentee ballots in Florida 200? becasue they didnt get thre in time? the same demcrats who broke deadline after deadline filing lawsuits? At the time of the 2000 election, I was mainly non political. I was conservative, but not really siding with any one party. But being a veteran, and seeing the shame of those sore loser democrats stopping at nothing to try and steal that election, even trying to stop overseas military ballots from counting, changed everything. the uglyness and desperation for power I witnessed form al gore and the dems sickened me, and ever since then I cant stand them.

Trav...go start an anti-democrat rant thread...:rolleyes:

the original thread was about how the republicans are trying to stop the military vote becasue the military is going to vote for kerry. he went on to sa its dumb to think the government cant secure a web site so they must be doing it to stop the military vote. I pointed out that that was wrong, in my opinion, and that if he is a democrat, saying such a thing is a slap in the face. I threw in my reasons why. it is not out of line to post what I did. I guess the truth about florida 2000 as it relates to the original thread is to hard for you to swallow

Originally posted by Travh20
the original thread was about how the republicans are trying to stop the military vote becasue the military is going to vote for kerry. he went on to sa its dumb to think the government cant secure a web site so they must be doing it to stop the military vote. I pointed out that that was wrong, in my opinion, and that if he is a democrat, saying such a thing is a slap in the face. I threw in my reasons why. it is not out of line to post what I did. I guess the truth about florida 2000 as it relates to the original thread is to hard for you to swallow

I didn't see the word republican in the first post. Trav - you just can't seem to discuss any issue without making it into a political shooting match. This isn't about R's or D's. It is about allowing our military to vote. PERIOD.

Go start a thread where you can trash talk democrats so the rest of us can have a conversation on this one.

NO everyone, Trav didn't miss the point from the original post. This sentence is from that post:

"I worry that what it really means is that top officials at the Defense Department are worried that the troops in the field may vote out the commander in chief who put them there"

This is the sentence he chose to address. If anyone thinks other parts of the post were more relevant, you are welcome to address those parts.

Millions Blocked from Voting in U.S. Election
By Alan Elsner

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Millions of U.S. citizens, including a disproportionate number of black voters, will be blocked from voting in the Nov. 2 presidential election because of legal barriers, faulty procedures or dirty tricks, according to civil rights and legal experts.

The largest category of those legally disenfranchised consists of almost 5 million former felons who have served prison sentences and been deprived of the right to vote under laws that have roots in the post-Civil War 19th century and were aimed at preventing black Americans from voting.

But millions of other votes in the 2000 presidential election were lost due to clerical and administrative errors while civil rights organizations have cataloged numerous tactics aimed at suppressing black voter turnout. Polls consistently find that black Americans overwhelmingly vote for Democrats.

"There are individuals and officials who are actively trying to stop people from voting who they think will vote against their party and that nearly always means stopping black people from voting Democratic," said Mary Frances Berry, head of the U.S. Commission on Human Rights.

Vicky Beasley, a field officer for People for the American Way, listed some of the ways voters have been "discouraged" from voting.

"In elections in Baltimore in 2002 and in Georgia last year, black voters were sent fliers saying anyone who hadn't paid utility bills or had outstanding parking tickets or were behind on their rent would be arrested at polling stations. It happens in every election cycle," she said.

In a mayoral election in Philadelphia last year, people pretending to be plainclothes police officers stood outside some polling stations asking people to identify themselves. There have also been reports of mysterious people videotaping people waiting in line to vote in black neighborhoods.

Minority voters may be deterred from voting simply by election officials demanding to see drivers' licenses before handing them a ballot, according to Spencer Overton, who teaches law at George Washington University. The federal government does not require people to produce a photo identification unless they are first-time voters who registered by mail.

"African Americans are four to five times less likely than whites to have a photo ID," Overton said at a recent briefing on minority disenfranchisement.

Courtenay Strickland of the Americans Civil Liberties Union testified to the U.S. Commission on Civil Rights last week that at a primary election in Florida last month, many people were wrongly turned away when they could not produce identification.

BLACKS' BALLOTS REJECTED

The commission, in a report earlier this year, said that in Florida, where President Bush (news - web sites) won a bitterly disputed election in 2000 by 537 votes, black voters had been 10 times more likely than non-black voters to have their ballots rejected and were often prevented from voting because their names were erroneously purged from registration lists.

Additionally, Florida is one of 14 states that prohibit ex-felons from voting. Seven percent of the electorate but 16 percent of black voters in that state are disenfranchised.

In other swing states, 4.6 percent of voters in Iowa, but 25 percent of blacks, were disenfranchised in 2000 as ex-felons. In Nevada, it was 4.8 percent of all voters but 17 percent of blacks; in New Mexico, 6.2 percent of all voters but 25 percent of blacks.

In total, 13 percent of all black men are disenfranchised due to a felony conviction, according to the Commission on Civil Rights.

"This has a huge effect on elections but also on black communities which see their political clout diluted. No one has yet explained to me how letting ex-felons who have served their sentences into polling booths hurts anyone," said Jessie Allen of the Brennan Center for Justice at New York University.

Penda Hair, co-director of the Advancement Project, which seeks to ensure fair multiracial elections, recently reported that registrars across the country often claimed not to have received voter registration forms or rejected them for technical reasons that could have been corrected easily before voting day if the applicant had known there was a problem.

Beasley said that many voters who had registered recently in swing states were likely to find their names would not be on the rolls when they showed up on Election Day.

"There is very widespread delay in the swing states because there have been massive registration drives among minorities and those applications are not being processed quickly enough," she said.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&ncid=1963&e=3&u=/nm/20040922/pl_nm/campaign_vote_dc_3

Originally posted by Imagineer
[B I worry that what it really means is that top officials at the Defense Department are worried that the troops in the field may vote out the commander in chief who put them there. [/B]

Echo, again your powers of deduction fail you at the most opportune times. you know damn well what the post was about, but in order to try and show me as what you want me to be you play the clueless card.

Originally posted by Travh20
Echo, again your powers of deduction fail you at the most opportune times. you know damn well what the post was about, but in order to try and show me as what you want me to be you play the clueless card.

If it makes you feel better to think that, you go right ahead. :D LOL.

Originally posted by MakeMoneyWemail
Millions Blocked from Voting in U.S. Election
By Alan Elsner

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Millions of U.S. citizens, including a disproportionate number of black voters, will be blocked from voting in the Nov. 2 presidential election because of legal barriers, faulty procedures or dirty tricks, according to civil rights and legal experts.

The largest category of those legally disenfranchised consists of almost 5 million former felons who have served prison sentences and been deprived of the right to vote under laws that have roots in the post-Civil War 19th century and were aimed at preventing black Americans from voting.

But millions of other votes in the 2000 presidential election were lost due to clerical and administrative errors while civil rights organizations have cataloged numerous tactics aimed at suppressing black voter turnout. Polls consistently find that black Americans overwhelmingly vote for Democrats.

"There are individuals and officials who are actively trying to stop people from voting who they think will vote against their party and that nearly always means stopping black people from voting Democratic," said Mary Frances Berry, head of the U.S. Commission on Human Rights.

Vicky Beasley, a field officer for People for the American Way, listed some of the ways voters have been "discouraged" from voting.

"In elections in Baltimore in 2002 and in Georgia last year, black voters were sent fliers saying anyone who hadn't paid utility bills or had outstanding parking tickets or were behind on their rent would be arrested at polling stations. It happens in every election cycle," she said.

In a mayoral election in Philadelphia last year, people pretending to be plainclothes police officers stood outside some polling stations asking people to identify themselves. There have also been reports of mysterious people videotaping people waiting in line to vote in black neighborhoods.

Minority voters may be deterred from voting simply by election officials demanding to see drivers' licenses before handing them a ballot, according to Spencer Overton, who teaches law at George Washington University. The federal government does not require people to produce a photo identification unless they are first-time voters who registered by mail.

"African Americans are four to five times less likely than whites to have a photo ID," Overton said at a recent briefing on minority disenfranchisement.

Courtenay Strickland of the Americans Civil Liberties Union testified to the U.S. Commission on Civil Rights last week that at a primary election in Florida last month, many people were wrongly turned away when they could not produce identification.

BLACKS' BALLOTS REJECTED

The commission, in a report earlier this year, said that in Florida, where President Bush (news - web sites) won a bitterly disputed election in 2000 by 537 votes, black voters had been 10 times more likely than non-black voters to have their ballots rejected and were often prevented from voting because their names were erroneously purged from registration lists.

Additionally, Florida is one of 14 states that prohibit ex-felons from voting. Seven percent of the electorate but 16 percent of black voters in that state are disenfranchised.

In other swing states, 4.6 percent of voters in Iowa, but 25 percent of blacks, were disenfranchised in 2000 as ex-felons. In Nevada, it was 4.8 percent of all voters but 17 percent of blacks; in New Mexico, 6.2 percent of all voters but 25 percent of blacks.

In total, 13 percent of all black men are disenfranchised due to a felony conviction, according to the Commission on Civil Rights.

"This has a huge effect on elections but also on black communities which see their political clout diluted. No one has yet explained to me how letting ex-felons who have served their sentences into polling booths hurts anyone," said Jessie Allen of the Brennan Center for Justice at New York University.

Penda Hair, co-director of the Advancement Project, which seeks to ensure fair multiracial elections, recently reported that registrars across the country often claimed not to have received voter registration forms or rejected them for technical reasons that could have been corrected easily before voting day if the applicant had known there was a problem.

Beasley said that many voters who had registered recently in swing states were likely to find their names would not be on the rolls when they showed up on Election Day.

"There is very widespread delay in the swing states because there have been massive registration drives among minorities and those applications are not being processed quickly enough," she said.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&ncid=1963&e=3&u=/nm/20040922/pl_nm/campaign_vote_dc_3 Yeah, I get it. Lets fight for convicted felons rights!!!! (That is if we can convince them to vote the way we want them to)

Who really gives a shit if convicted felons cannot vote? Their right to vote was supposed to be lost when they were convicted of the felony in the first place. Or is it only black convicted felons who should have their right to vote restored?

Originally posted by HaVoK
Yeah, I get it. Lets fight for convicted felons rights!!!! (That is if we can convince them to vote the way we want them to)

Who really gives a shit if convicted felons cannot vote? Their right to vote was supposed to be lost when they were convicted of the felony in the first place. Or is it only black convicted felons who should have their right to vote restored?

I completely agree. Someone convicted of a felony should loose their right to vote. I also think that when they get out of jail they should loose their citezenship. We have enough peoblems, let someone else have the rejects that can't/won't live by our laws.

Originally posted by Echo2
If it makes you feel better to think that, you go right ahead. :D LOL.

I will think that way, believe me, becasue if you read taht and saw it as just some defense of miltary voters you really are clueless. the olbigitory shot at the bush adminstration was clear and showed the intention of the post to anyone with hlf a brain, as you like to say. It was saying, correct me if I am wrong, and I am sure you will, that the pentagon, at the behest of the Bush adminstration, is blocking troops in iraq from voting, because they re scared they will all vote for kerry.

My point was intended to be that the troops certainly deserve the right to vote for whomever they decide to support. Historically the military has tended to vote Republican. This may or may not be the case this time. I have no way of knowing what the individuals serving overseas might be thinking but they definitely deserve the right to express their opinions at the ballot box.

I worry that some officials in the defense department might have a better idea how the troops might vote. It would be embarrassing for any president to lose the vote of the troops they command, and an indication of poor morale. The people best in a position to judge whether the war in Iraq is winnable are the troops fighting that war.

When I was in the army and stationed at Fort Lewis in 1972, an order was issued by the base commander. He ordered that all absentee ballots be examined by company commanders, and that all troops were ordered to vote for President Nixon. He stated that to vote for George McGovern was to be considered a violation of orders and treasonous. This order was quickly rescinded a couple of days later after many congressmen complained to the defense department.

I mention this because it tells me that some military officers will attempt to control the vote. I am afraid that this may be such an attempt. I feel very strongly that the soldiers must be allowed to vote freely for the candidate of their choice.

By the way Trav, I agree with you that it was wrong to discount some absentee ballots in Florida. I also believe it was wrong to deny the vote to twenty thousand other citizens of Florida because the had the same last name and race as a person on a list of felons supplied by the office of the Governor of Texas. These individuals had every right to vote, and were denied that right. Most were black, and the list was 95% inaccurate. In my opinion, denying any legally entitled citizen the right to vote is wrong. Even you should be allowed the right to vote Trav, although I am certain that you will vote for candidates that I do not support.

Originally posted by Travh20
I will think that way, believe me, becasue if you read taht and saw it as just some defense of miltary voters you really are clueless. the olbigitory shot at the bush adminstration was clear and showed the intention of the post to anyone with hlf a brain, as you like to say. It was saying, correct me if I am wrong, and I am sure you will, that the pentagon, at the behest of the Bush adminstration, is blocking troops in iraq from voting, because they re scared they will all vote for kerry.

Come on trav, I haven't even mentioned your hero today. I think you are paranoid. Probubly because you have spent the last six months deffending his positions and actions to anyone that would listen.

.........falling asleep from boredom.......

did I say you said anything about bush? No, I was talking about hte original post, you better wake up

I'm not advocating that felons should have the right to vote, just thought it was an interesting article that related to the topic at hand, and wondered what everyones opinions were.

thousands of people in every state are denyed ther right to vote, it seems that since in this case a democrat lost due to it its a big problem. How many republican voters are rejected in other states and in florida? just as many. the only reason its an issue is becuase Al Gore clams to have lost due to it. If he won, I doubt it would be an issue.

Don't felons loose their right to vote while in prison?

It used to be pretty common in some cities to deny certain political parties a place on the ballot. Since actual physical intimidation is no longer on outlet for the crooked politicians, some of them are now refusing to allow the votes to be counted after an election and opting to let the judicial branch of the government to decide.

I have some big questions about these voteing machines too. Without a paper trail - we could end up with the same crap that happened last time.

no matter what happens, there will always be questions about the results

Lets just face the facts guys and gals. None of us have ANY faith whatsoever in our representative's in government anymore. We believe that they can and will do anything they please to help their own selfish agenda's.