I’m sure you’ve all heard about the story from NYC concerning someone getting arrested for not paying an 18% gratuity on their restaurant tab; they had a party of six people. Later the charges were dropped.

But this tipping issue has always made me feel uncomfortable. You’re supposed to tip hair dressers, food servers, taxi cab drivers, boat captains, bartenders, blackjack dealers...

Where does it end?

I never received a tip at work although I thought about putting a jar in my cubicle.
:alien:

18%? I thought it was 10! I tip waiters and usually cab drivers, but only if they stop... talking... Where I grew up you only tipped if they deserved it. Now you kinda have to, which sucks because I never liked percentages... :)

I don't mind tipping people at all, at least when they do a halfway decent job. My thing is that I don't know when I'm supposed to and when I'm not. I feel like a jerk if I'm expected to and don't, and I feel like an idiot if I try and it's not expected.

Like I never tipped the guy that drives the shuttle bus from the hotel to the airport, but then I saw a few people do it? What about the pump jockey at the full-service gas stations?

Some of these people dont have the advantage of having successful careers where they are making comfortable annual salaries. Whatever the reason for their misfortune, some consideration should be given to hard working people who are doing menial jobs. If a food server does a good job keeping my glass filled at dinner then he/she deserves a little something extra for giving a little something extra in their thankless job.

It has always amazed me that normally nice people go so strictly by the percentages expected when tipping or do not tip at all in a restaraunt. And then these very same people will go out to the clubs and every damn time they get a drink tip the bartender as much as the drink cost. It doesnt make sense to me.

Show these people you appreciate their effort and usually you will get good service. Also, some of these people need the tips just to make ends meet.

Originally posted by HaVoK
Some of these people dont have the advantage of having successful careers where they are making comfortable annual salaries.
(…)
Show these people you appreciate their effort and usually you will get good service. Also, some of these people need the tips just to make ends meet.

I absolutely agree with you. Working in a bar or restaurant is very hard. These people deserve every cent of their tips.

I tip waiters 15% with change. More only when the service is superb. But I think the gratuity charge is despicable--it's added on your bill automatically therefore you still have to tip them. The gratuity + tip will come out to be 30+% of your actual meal. Just because there is more people on one table doesn't make it more difficult to service them than, say, service the same number of people who all sit on different tables! It's not clear why there needs to be a gratuity charge.

On a mannerism book I read, it says if the service is very unsatisfactory, you should still give the tip. But talk to the manager afterward and demand some reparation or apology.

I give hair dressers very good tip, unless it's so abysmally bad and I know I won't be coming back again. If a cab driver deliberately takes longer route, or is not knowledgeable you should demand free ride--it's part of most cab companies' regulations. Otherwise I give 15+% tips. $1 to $5 will usually be sufficient for situations where you are not sure whether to tip or not.

You are bound to tip a lot in gentlemen's clubs. I sincerely hope there is no complaint about that.

Lastly. I would NOT give tip to that person who hands out tissues when u wash your hands in a nightclub bathroom. Why, I can't grab a tissue myself?

The thing about tipping in this country...waiters and waitresses earn some $2/hr. wages, and they are expected to make the rest up in tips. They need tips to earn their living. It's an unfortunate thing in this country that the managers of restaurants force their customers to pay their wait staff. Really, the managers should pay their own damned staff and the customers should tip only for exceptional service.

That said, I usually tip 20%...

Originally posted by Dio Seijuro
But I think the gratuity charge is despicable--it's added on your bill automatically therefore you still have to tip them. The gratuity + tip will come out to be 30+% of your actual meal.

If it's added on to the bill automatically, you don't have to tip on top of that. That is the tip. Most of the restaurants I've seen make a point of saying that you can adjust the 18% up or down based on the service.

Then it's not so unreasonable. I've done the 30+% many times...how stupid.

When we dine out, tipping is based upon the quality of service, not some formula. Rather than walk out without tipping for inattentive & inept service, we'll leave a pittance ... a penny or a nickle, for example, to silently voice our displeasure. On the other hand, when service is good, we can be most generous.

Having never paid for a meal at a restaurant other than places like McDonald's, I obviously don't have experience with this kind of thing myself....

I did hear about that guy that got arrested though. Apparently the restaurant had a rule that if you had more than 6 people (he had 9) in your party, you were required to tip at least 18%. It said so on the menu, but he apparently didn't read it. I think that's a pretty stupid rule, but it is a rule, so it must be followed. With that said, I think everyone agrees that the punishment was rather, er, severe. I'm sure that if the guy was informed of the rule and asked to pay the rest of the required money, he would. Honestly, it's no wonder so many criminals are on the loose when the cops are called because someone didn't tip enough in a restaurant:rolleyes:

The sign said "mandatory gratuity". That's an oxymoron. It's either "a mandatory fee to pay our wait staff because we're cheap bastards" or it's a "gratuity added on your bill as a service to you". Since it says "gratuity", the man was right to walk out without leaving a tip (though very inconsiderate). It's his prerogative to be an ass.

Originally posted by Dio Seijuro
Then it's not so unreasonable. I've done the 30+% many times...how stupid.

There have been a few times when I'm with a group and no one noticed that they added on the gratuity, so there's been a double-tip.

I'd have been happpy to have you folks sit at my table any time!!!

Here in Canada, the servers wage is actually $2.00 lower than standard minimum wage. This means that they expect us to live off our tips. Which in my experience, means you have to be a good actor.

(or actually enjoy waiting on people, taking their crap, and cleaning up after them)

Still I managed pretty well, and in most upscale places I worked, I would average about $20/hr in tips alone, on top of my wage. Cash money in my pocket. But this is because I'm cute, not because i was a great server........;)

Oooh what restaurant do you wait at?

Haha, it's called "Chez Creetwins"........

(i wait on my family at home for free lol)

I haven't worked since I had the girls.

I don't think a person should have to tip.I feel that the person owning the place should pay his people what they are worth.I go on cruises and the day befor the ship arrives in port they have a man telling us what we should tip.The tips amount to almost the price of the vacation.Tips should be included in the price.It will come a time when you will have to worry about the tip before you go out to eat.

I've had people like you at my tables..........FUN!:rolleyes:

You've obviously never had to feed yourself pay your rent, or live off tips. We bend over backwards to ensure you have a pleasant visit, and the common courtesy would be to acknowledge that. THere is plenty of crappy service out there and the ones who do a good job should be rewarded.

Originally posted by creetwins
I've had people like you at my tables..........FUN!:rolleyes:

You've obviously never had to feed yourself pay your rent, or live off tips. We bend over backwards to ensure you have a pleasant visit, and the common courtesy would be to acknowledge that. THere is plenty of crappy service out there and the ones who do a good job should be rewarded. Yes ma'am, I concur.

Originally posted by goldy
I don't think a person should have to tip.I feel that the person owning the place should pay his people what they are worth.

Perhaps, but they don't. Besides, if they did, your meal would cost 15% more, so what's the difference?

I can stay home.I don't need someone else to cook for me to make me happy.I worked for 30years at a low paying job and never ask or got a tip.If my job could not pay for my pleasures I got a second job.No one is responsible for my living arrangements but me.Guess I'ii get a cup next week and sit on the corner and wait till you come by with my sad story.A fool is born each day.Don't you know why they live off of Tips?It's just like being paid under the table.And you are helping them in their deceptions.

Originally posted by goldy
I can stay home.I don't need someone else to cook for me to make me happy.I worked for 30years at a low paying job and never ask or got a tip.If my job could not pay for my pleasures I got a second job.No one is responsible for my living arrangements but me.Guess I'ii get a cup next week and sit on the corner and wait till you come by with my sad story.A fool is born each day.Don't you know why they live off of Tips?It's just like being paid under the table.And you are helping them in their deceptions.
Wait staff get paid FAR less than minimum wage. It's legal, because the tips are part of their income.

I can stay home.I don't need someone else to cook for me to make me happy.I worked for 30years at a low paying job and never ask or got a tip.If my job could not pay for my pleasures I got a second job.No one is responsible for my living arrangements but me.Guess I'ii get a cup next week and sit on the corner and wait till you come by with my sad story.A fool is born each day.Don't you know why they live off of Tips?It's just like being paid under the table.And you are helping them in their deceptions.

Haha have fun at home! I am a believer in "what goes around comes around" so you better believe when I eat out i tip FAT!!!

I tip according to the service I receive.
Sometimes better.

I worked for 30years at a low paying job and never ask or got a tip.

Pity to think all that time you could have been waiting tables! :p

No one has to wait on tables.Most people who do have a second job.This is America land of plenty.Stay in school and you can demand a better paying job.Is it our fault you decided to drop out of school?I dropped out and I took the only job I was qualified for But I lived within my means and made it.You can't drive a Jag and expect to pay it in tips.

Originally posted by goldy
No one has to wait on tables.Most people who do have a second job.This is America land of plenty.Stay in school and you can demand a better paying job.Is it our fault you decided to drop out of school?I dropped out and I took the only job I was qualified for But I lived within my means and made it.You can't drive a Jag and expect to pay it in tips. Good grief. Its not as if waiters or waitresses are not working to earn their money. You make it seem as if they are beggars. As long as i have been on this earth it has been understood that waiters/waitresses made a less than minimum wage going on the assumption that their tips would augment the low salary they are paid. It is probably a good thing you do not go out to eat with your attitude, because im sure you would never recieve good service anywhere you eat after your first visit.

Goldy, if you are so irked about loosening the purse strings for service, there are plenty of all you can eat buffets, where you can get up and get it yourself, and the gratuity is included in the price.

Some of us like the luxury of being waited on, when funds warrent such things.

ahigh quality resturant should be able to pay it's help what they are worth.When I go out to eat I don't think I should be made to feel like the "help" is my problem.Next thing you know I will have to tip the car salesman when I buy a car.

In most states, wait staff are not paid even minimum wage. Tips are taxable income for those individuals, and their "minimum wage" is basically pittance + tips.

Everyone should stop eating out.If the help is paid so poorly do you think they are handling your food be for washing their hands? You would be surprised at what's going on behind closed doors.And you tip for this?I know what I speak of .I have a few friends who put them selves through collage working tables.They had fun dropping your food on the floors.And don't send anything back to cook over.Guess what the chef does with it?I could go on and on but I don't want to get BANNED.

You have made yourself very clear on the type of people you think take these kind of Jobs. The term "help" is pretty derogitory, and I resent that. I also resent the fact that you imply we work under unsanitary conditions.

Stop eating out, we don't want crotchety old customers like you anyway, you think you are better?

I was perfectly happy bringing home $200 tending bar in a busy bar on Wednesday nights, and there were plenty of happy customers returning religiously just to hear what I'd have to say the next time they came in.

Tip well, get good service. It's as easy as that, if you want it honey, you are gonna have to pay for it

:p

So you say pay for your drink and tip to get good service?I thought it was a package deal.No one has to come in your joint.There was a time people just gave good service because they wanted your bussiness.Now I got to tip for you to give me good service.I don't think so!!

Originally posted by goldy
So you say pay for your drink and tip to get good service?I thought it was a package deal.No one has to come in your joint.There was a time people just gave good service because they wanted your bussiness.Now I got to tip for you to give me good service.I don't think so!!
Be warned, waitresses and bartenders don't take too kindly to being stiffed, as they must survive on tips almost exclusively. Expect to have your food/drink spit on/in...

Originally posted by BorgHunter
Be warned, waitresses and bartenders don't take too kindly to being stiffed, as they must survive on tips almost exclusively. Expect to have your food/drink spit on/in...

That is precisly why I do not tip. Anyone willing to endanger my health over a couple dollars is going to get nothing from me. People who think they "DESERVE" a tip are lieing to themselves. Tipping is optional.

Working as a waiter/waitress is optional too. If you don't like the wages - get a different job.

Wow, if I was your waiter, I think I would take special care to personally spill an entire tray off food and drinks right into your hair and lap.

Originally posted by Echo2
That is precisly why I do not tip. Anyone willing to endanger my health over a couple dollars is going to get nothing from me. People who think they "DESERVE" a tip are lieing to themselves. Tipping is optional.
Anyone willing to be an asshole for a couple dollars gets no respect from me. Leave the poor guy/gal 15%...it's their only paycheck...

Originally posted by Echo2
That is precisly why I do not tip. Anyone willing to endanger my health over a couple dollars is going to get nothing from me. People who think they "DESERVE" a tip are lieing to themselves. Tipping is optional.

Working as a waiter/waitress is optional too. If you don't like the wages - get a different job. Looks like you may be the one with the stick up their butt today Echo. :D

Originally posted by HaVoK
Looks like you may be the one with the stick up their butt today Echo. :D

Yep, I have this stick way up there.

Tipping is OPTIONAL. For a waitperson to EXPECT it is wrong.

KEEP TIPPING........... My daily take-home average is $150.00. I need you guys to keep tipping!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If you were in an industry where tipping is your income you would be making this post instead of me.

That is precisly why I do not tip. Anyone willing to endanger my health over a couple dollars is going to get nothing from me. People who think they "DESERVE" a tip are lieing to themselves. Tipping is optional.

In the 15 years I have worked in the business, I have never seen anyone do this. It is an urban myth that wait staff are a vindictive disgusting sort.

ANd for the odd person like you who never tips, there are plenty appreciative patrons who more than make up for your frugality.

Plus, if you were to walk into my establishment, as a known non-tipper, this tells me that you don't mind waiting. I will serve a known tipper well before you. Cause With you I got nothing to lose. No tips=you don't mind waiting.

TIPS=To Insure Prompt Service.

For a person to never tip is wrong, and your friends and family dining with you are probably tired of picking up your slack.

Also, in my experience, regular tippers get excellent service. My mother always got great service when she went to Bennigan's because of this, e.g. always greeted by name, extra attention, etc. Am I right, cree?

Originally posted by creetwins
ANd for the odd person like you who never tips, there are plenty appreciative patrons who more than make up for your frugality.

Actually, I do tip and quite well. It just pissed me off for someone to make a half assed threat about spitting in a customers food.

And it pisses me off that waitpersons EXPECT a tip even when they give crappy service.

Gratuity - from the word Gratitude.

Originally posted by Echo2
Actually, I do tip and quite well. It just pissed me off for someone to make a half assed threat about spitting in a customers food.

And it pisses me off that waitpersons EXPECT a tip even when they give crappy service.

Gratuity - from the word Gratitude. Now see, i can dig that comment. :thumbs:

Actually I do tip. I just didn’t know you could be arrested for not tipping.

I have a thirteen-year-old big screen; I finally got it fixed by the only man in town who could fix it; he recently underwent bypass surgery; I tipped him and he didn’t even request it.

And before that I tipped a young man that hauled off my trash; I may need him to come back.

But shouldn’t it be my idea?

And as far as food servers, I know that the government taxes them on a certain percentage of what they are supposed to earn.

Not fair.

Keep in mind I no longer tend bar or waitress, but having done so dsince highschool, i feel I have to represent.....


Actually, I do tip and quite well. It just pissed me off for someone to make a half assed threat about spitting in a customers food.

And it pisses me off that waitpersons EXPECT a tip even when they give crappy service.

Gratuity - from the word Gratitude.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

This I can agree with. THe possibilty for disaster is always there. If you do not have a tough skin going into this business, you will by the time you leave it. SO many things can go wrong, orders getting mixed up, forgetting to punch in on time so they are late, something wrong in the kitchen....etc. When things go wrong the tips definately represent that, and it's understandable. But when things run smooth, and you are left nothing, you can't help but wonder "what was wrong, was it me, maybe they just didn't like me". It's hard not to take it personal sometimes, but you take the good with the bad.

It may not seem fair that if the cooks do something wrong, That I shouldn't get a tip, but here's the little known fact I will share with you. While the waitstaff is the front face of the business, and we take most of the abuse, the entire functioning ability of the restaurant shows in the tips.

It is mandatory to tip out your support staff.
If I sell $800 in a lunch shift, I tip out my barstaff 1% of my sales NOT MY TIPS.
I tip out the bussers .5% and the kitchen gets 1%.
So, when things run smoothly, we do expect it to show in the tips, and if things do not EVERYONE suffers.

And if things go terribly wrong I run the risk of having to comp someone's meal OUT OF MY POCKET!

So yes it is a risky business, I know in retail if some have a fault in a garment the clerk does not have to pay for it. BUt these are the stakes we deal with , and if you are very consistent and good it can be very lucrative.

Many people do no know this little fact.


Also, in my experience, regular tippers get excellent service. My mother always got great service when she went to Bennigan's because of this, e.g. always greeted by name, extra attention, etc. Am I right, cree?

This is absolutely right, and if you are good, and have a photographic memory like me, you will have many happy repeat customers.

Who doesn't like having their drink ready when the staff sees your car pull in?

To tip or not to tip.The only way I will tip if I feel a person has done a job no one else could do .I tipped my comcast man because he hook up my V.C.R. and had it running.This was not his job.His job was to install my internet service.When a person goes outside of the job he is required to do that is another question.But when you do a job you are supposed to do and you do it right that's what you were hired to do.

Goldy, I think you'd be in shock if you actually knew the copious amounts of cash people are willing to dish out for a fine dining experience. They are paying for the presentation, as it were an art form. They pay for the atmosphere, the presentation and the experience.


I worked in one place owned by an Italian "family" who would host private functions where there would be Baccarat games going on, with stacks of money on the tables, and these guys thought nothing of tossing me a $20 bill for fetching them an espresso. Each time. I went home with over $400.00 that night.

since no1s really posted anything for awhile i thought i'd refresh things up abit and put some closure on the topic of tipping.
restaurant owners make servers tip out to the support staff (cooks, bussers, bartenders and hostess') a certain amount (usually about 3 percent of everything they put into the computer. so say you meal was 80 bucks, and some1 elses meal was 80 bucks, and thats all the tables the server had, then 160 x .3 would equal about 5 bucks outta the servers pocket to the support staff, but usually a server has more tables resulting in larger sales) for 1 reason and 1 reason only, it lowers the amount of money they have to pay the support staff. a cook that makes 7 bucks an hour will get about 1 doller extra just in tips added to his hourly wage from servers. so the cook will look at it as 8 dollers an hour instead of 7, plus its untaxable money, and the main point is it saves the owner of the restaurant that 1 doller by leeching it from his servers. now multiply that by the amount of support staff and the amount of hours and you have alot of money saved. unfair to servers? probably. but theres that famous saying, nothing personal, its just business. so technically, if you tip a server 10% on a bill, the servers only getting about 7. so now you know abit more about tipping, back to the main debat. owners wouldnt do this to servers if most people didnt tip, but most people do, and another famous sying out there is the actions of many outweigh the actions of few. so is tipping mandatory? in a restaurant i say yes. if you dont tip a server and your bills 100 bucks, the server just paid 3 dollers out of thier pocket to serve you cause they tip out assuming 3% to the support staff. remember, its everything they punch in the computer, not 3% on the tips they make. the restaurant takes servers money regardless if they make tips cause they assume most people tip, nothing personal, its just business. should you tip your hairdresser or tailor etc etc? if the service is good, go ahead. is it mandatory? no. why? those people dont tip out to the owners because if the owners were to do that, there would be no hairdressers, cause MOST people dont tip. conclusion? if you dont have enough money to tip, dont eat out. you should include it in your meals bill, or go to mcdonalds. if the service was bad, consider many things out of the servers control. if the kicthen messed up, not the servers fault. if the servers obviously busy, give the server some slack, a server is only human, not god. if you're going to be so crutical on wether or not to tip, it usually means your cheap, so again, dont eat out. whatsa good percentage to tip? i usually say 15% is a good bet. people may say if the servers main source of income is on tips, the restaurant should make up for it but paying them more like what godly said. well.... the owners dont and wont, so this is how the industry is made. if it upsets you, dont eat out. you dont have to tip your car salesmen cause he doesnt tip out. how u dont have to go into some1s establishment true, but you do, so you tip, or dont go in. i think i pretty much diffused all your naive comments on tipping godly. you might think you shouldnt have to tip, but in this day and age you should, and if you dont want to, go to mcdonalds. i'm probably bias cause i'm a server myself, but these are the facts, like them or not. just a side note, i would never, EVER do ANYTHING to anyones food, it is wrong, it can get you fired, and its illegal.

Originally posted by creetwins
Goldy, I think you'd be in shock if you actually knew the copious amounts of cash people are willing to dish out for a fine dining experience. They are paying for the presentation, as it were an art form. They pay for the atmosphere, the presentation and the experience.


This statement is absolutely 100% factual on all fronts. Speaking from experience. In my present line of work, if you opt not to tip, you have absoulutely no business being there. We have nice men in white dress shirts and ties more than willing to escort you towards the door. But the line about presentation and art form....especially true.

Jaselle

box 19, r u fucking kidding me dude 10%. u must be fuckin jewish cheap mother fucker. We abolished slavery during the civil war man, people dont come greet you with a smile a bring you all of your food and have a positive attitude the whole time and expect a 10% tip. THATS BULLSHIT! u need to go back to school and learn math if doing percentages is that hard.

if i had my way (and my own restaurant) i would not allow niggers in. I THINK YOU ALL KNOW WHY, they are cheap mother fuckers. I had a party of almost 25 guests, didn't write any of there orders down, said there order back to them, and didnt studder once doin it. U MUST SAY THATS PRETTY IMPRESSIVE! On top of that they kept running me to keep getting them drinks. I tended to there every need and gave them excellent service. I brought them their bill with a 18% gratuity on it which came out to be like 35$ because you know how black people can eat hot wings right? am i right? im right. anyways...... they complained about the grat. and they told my manager they were gonna give me 5 dollars as if it was somthing special! FUCK YOU YOU FUCKIN NIGGER. NIGGERS SHOULD NOT EVER BE ALLOWED TO EAT IN RESTAURANTS. remember..........black people and niggers are 2 different things.

Dude, your trolling skills suck. You're too transparent. Sharpen your skills and come back later...

I work in a restaurant myself. I used to wait tables, but I dont anymore, because it was a really stressful job. Now, I do to-go orders and deliveries at the same job. I make a little more than minimum wage. At our restaurant, 15% is what they are supposed to tip. Gratuity is added for parties over 8 people because a lot of times, they dont tip as much as the gratuity should be, and also, some of those big parties really make you work, so I dont think they should have a problem paying gratuity. It's not required where I work, it's up to the server if they want to add it or not. Some people tip better than the grat, but some dont. I really respect servers because I know what it's like. For someone not to tip is really rude. Servers depend on those tips to get by. A server's paycheck, even working 40 hours a week, might be about $80, and that's before taxes. Servers have to pay tipshare out of their tips, too, that goes to the bussers and hostesses. If you dont want to tip, dont eat in restaurants. If goldy was in your shoes, cree, she wouldnt be so small minded about it. I always make sure and tip more than 15%, because I know how much they make.

I work in a restaurant. I FUCKN HATE IT!!!!! People dont tip worth a shit anymore. Black people are the worst! They want water and extra lemons! They ask the prices of everything, how much for this or that. If they have a party of lets say 8, all of them NEVER show up. They have 2 or 3 tables pulled together for about 3 people! You know exaclty what i'm talking about!!! They run you crazy, extra this and extra that. More dressing more sauce etc. You know all that free stuff!!! Then naturally they complain about the bill, their GOAL is to get something for free and more times than usual they do. After sitting there, for ohhh 3 hours , they throw a dollar on the chicken wing , virgin strawberry daq. , plates of lemons and dirty napkins table!!! Even black servers HATE waiting on black people! This is true.
CutiJudi

Oh joy, racism...

Originally posted by bandersen85
if i had my way (and my own restaurant) i would not allow niggers in. I THINK YOU ALL KNOW WHY, they are cheap mother fuckers. I had a party of almost 25 guests, didn't write any of there orders down, said there order back to them, and didnt studder once doin it. U MUST SAY THATS PRETTY IMPRESSIVE! On top of that they kept running me to keep getting them drinks. I tended to there every need and gave them excellent service. I brought them their bill with a 18% gratuity on it which came out to be like 35$ because you know how black people can eat hot wings right? am i right? im right. anyways...... they complained about the grat. and they told my manager they were gonna give me 5 dollars as if it was somthing special! FUCK YOU YOU FUCKIN NIGGER. NIGGERS SHOULD NOT EVER BE ALLOWED TO EAT IN RESTAURANTS. remember..........black people and niggers are 2 different things.

You are so right!!!

looks like we've got a couple people here who need to join club ugababe

Wow, this is an extremely hostile thread, and I wasn't even part of it. :)

On the subject of race and tipping, I've dated several servers who used to freely admit that blacks were notorious for poorly tipping, but I can't definitively argue either way - I've never waited tables. Don't call me a racist; I'm just relaying what I've heard from girls I've dated - nothing more.

Anyway, that mandatory tipping "law" is purely nonsense. Have any of you ever been duped into paying on top of it, because I have. I went to Morton’s (special occasion) with my girlfriend and six of our good friends. I booked a private room, we all had a few bottles of Chateanuf-du-pape replete with few glasses of 12 year old Glenlivet, and when I got the 650 dollar bill, I gave the server my credit card, and when she brought the copies back - I signed and tipped 15% on top of a 20% tip that had already been applied. When my ass sobered up, I realized I signed an almost 900 dollar restaurant tab. I didn't feel like an asshole at all when I went back the next day and demanded my tip back. I had to fight for it, but I got it…

Originally posted by The Praetorian
Wow, this is an extremely hostile thread, and I wasn't even part of it. :)

On the subject of race and tipping, I've dated several servers who used to freely admit that blacks were notorious for poorly tipping, but I can't definitively argue either way - I've never waited tables. Don't call me a racist; I'm just relaying what I've heard from girls I've dated - nothing more.


Well of course I am going to call you a racist pig-fucker.

We have all heard all kinds of shit that we are generally not rude enough to repeat in mixed company. Those other two assheads are obviosly uneducated, but I thought most regulars were cultured enough to keep their predjudices to themselves.

I am Black and I always tip over 15% no matter what.

Originally posted by Ed Blank
I am Black and I always tip over 15% no matter what.
Then from what I've heard, you're in the minority. Good for you.

Who was it that said racism was dieing out? This thread should prove that there are still low-life racists that are more than willing to spout their hatred and contempt for people who are different.

Wanna take a guess at what their political affiliations are?

Ed Blank - "racist pig fucker" and "assheads" LMFAO! I nearly pissed my pants with these. ::mentally squirrels them away::

Originally posted by Echo2
Wanna take a guess at what their political affiliations are?
CutieJudi and Bandersen85 told you what political affiliation they were???

That's what I thought.

Hey, I found an interesting study done on the tipping habits of Blacks, which was conducted by graduate student attending Cornell University with a masters in psychology, but it was summed up fairly well by the NPR people.

Read it and weep, rocket man (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=1329241)

Originally posted by The Praetorian
Hey, I found an interesting study done on the tipping habits of Blacks, which was conducted by graduate student attending Cornell University with a masters in psychology, but it was summed up fairly well by the NPR people.

Read it and weep, rocket man (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=1329241)
Saying that the average black person tips less than the average white person (which may, in fact, be true, for various reasons) is a hell of a lot different than "Black people are the worst! They want water and extra lemons! They ask the prices of everything, how much for this or that. If they have a party of lets say 8, all of them NEVER show up. They have 2 or 3 tables pulled together for about 3 people!". There is a major, major difference between "statistically, blacks tend to tip less than whites" and "Black people are the worst!" The latter is "The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability", i.e. racism, while the former is not, and in fact is simply relating a statistical average. This is exactly the same deal as the Harvard dude who said something along the lines of "men and women's brains are wired differently, and women, on average, tend to score lower on math tests." There are plenty of female mathematicians who know a hell of a lot more math than I do, and there are plenty of blacks who tip a hell of a lot more than I do.

See the difference?

Originally posted by The Praetorian
CutieJudi and Bandersen85 told you what political affiliation they were???

That's what I thought.

Hey, I found an interesting study done on the tipping habits of Blacks, which was conducted by graduate student attending Cornell University with a masters in psychology, but it was summed up fairly well by the NPR people.

Read it and weep, rocket man (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=1329241)

"The average tip from a black customer is about 13 percent of the bill. The average tip from a white customer is about 16.5 percent of the bill," says Dr. Michael Lynn, the study's author"

That's from your article. Hardly Earth shattering.

Maybe the difference is between the tipping habits of poor people and middle class. Did anybody do a study on how poor people tip vs middle class? (No. Americans will ALWAYS look at race first).

50% of black people are poor. 10% of white people are poor. If you see a Black person on the street he is very likely to be poor. You will seldom see a poor white person (just judging by the raw percentages).

That means you are highly likely to be pitting the tipping habits of poor Blacks angainst middle class Whites. I guarantee you if you adjust for income you will find that the 3.5% differential vanishes.

(The discussion of why half of Black people are poor involves the word "Slavery" and the phrase "we have only been free for one generation")

Prae, you are a racist.

Originally posted by Ed Blank
Maybe the difference is between the tipping habits of poor people and middle class. Did anybody do a study on how poor people tip vs middle class?
I was thinking exactly the same thing as well. It's not black vs. white, it's all about the money. People without money tip less, because they have less to spend. That's just common sense.

It's ironic, Prae, that you didn't immediately think of that...

Look, Borg, I never said blacks were the worst, wanted lemons with their water, liked horse racing, or were good at balancing their checkbooks. All I said was I've dated several servers who used to freely admit that blacks were notorious for tipping poorly, but I can't definitively argue either way - I've never waited tables.

And then Ed went all "Rock it" on me, and claimed I was nothing short of a "racist pig fucker", and Echo agreed with him by claiming, falsely, that everyone who made those statements were nothing more than racist rightwingers - of which, she didn't even know everyones political stance. :@@:

I wasn't chalking it up to socioeconomic factors, I was chiming in, PERIOD.

All I did was make a statement - nothing more, and if you don't like it, then kiss my ass, all of you.

:upyours:

Originally posted by The Praetorian
Look, Borg, I never said blacks were the worst, wanted lemons with their water, liked horse racing, or were good at balancing their checkbooks. All I said was I've dated several servers who used to freely admit that blacks were notorious for tipping poorly, but I can't definitively argue either way - I've never waited tables.
I know that...in fact, my statement was meant to imply that you're not racist...
I wasn't chalking it up to socioeconomic factors, I was chiming in, PERIOD.
You really should have chalked it up to socioeconomic factors. That makes a lot more sense than saying that black people tip less because they're black, as a couple others have claimed.

Why would you hop on that bandwagon?

You pulled out some heresay shit that a judge would have stricken from the record just to join in with Ma and Pa Kettle.

Okay fuck it. You are not a pig-fucker. I take it all back.

Originally posted by BorgHunter
I know that...in fact, my statement was meant to imply that you're not racist...
Thank you, Borg, I appreciate the clarification. :)

Originally posted by The Praetorian
Echo agreed with him by claiming, falsely, that everyone who made those statements were nothing more than racist rightwingers - of which, she didn't even know everyones political stance.

Please show us where I claimed "everyone who made those statements were nothing more than racist rightwingers".

You read into things what you want to and then twist it around and post it like it was a quote. Shame on you for lieing.

Originally posted by Ed Blank
Okay fuck it. You are not a pig-fucker. I take it all back.
Okay, so I'm a racist - have it your way, dickhead. If that's the case, and you won't back down from calling me one, then things are going to get pretty rough in "mixed company" as you so delicately put it.
Originally posted by Ed Blank
(The discussion of why half of Black people are poor involves the word "Slavery" and the phrase "we have only been free for one generation")
Free for one generation, my ass - slavery ended in 1865. That's 140 years by my count, but I suppose you'll play the same card "next generation", or more aptly, when your telling your sons about the injustices black people suffered just 280 years ago.

Hey, I totally understand - these things take time…

Originally posted by Echo2
Please show us where I claimed "everyone who made those statements were nothing more than racist rightwingers".

You read into things what you want to and then twist it around and post it like it was a quote. Shame on you for lieing.
Jesus, Echo, you're worse than OD.

Explain what you meant by this, and who you were referring to:

Who was it that said racism was dieing out? This thread should prove that there are still low-life racists that are more than willing to spout their hatred and contempt for people who are different.

Wanna take a guess at what their political affiliations are?

Originally posted by seawater
I’m sure you’ve all heard about the story from NYC concerning someone getting arrested for not paying an 18% gratuity on their restaurant tab; they had a party of six people. Later the charges were dropped.

But this tipping issue has always made me feel uncomfortable. You’re supposed to tip hair dressers, food servers, taxi cab drivers, boat captains, bartenders, blackjack dealers...

Where does it end?

I never received a tip at work although I thought about putting a jar in my cubicle.
:alien:

most people who are allowed to receive tips are paid a fairly low wage. many of those waitresses out there receive $2.19 an hour. they need the tips. i always tip well. they DO remember you. i have worked 2 jobs in the past that tipping was allowed. remember WE DO remember you. besides, less chances of spit in yer food.

Blacks and other minorities were second class citizens until 40 years ago.

many of those waitresses out there receive $2.19 an hour. they need the tips. i always tip well. they DO remember you. i have worked 2 jobs in the past that tipping was allowed. remember WE DO remember you. besides, less chances of spit in yer food. see you should tip because even though they may spit in your food the first time they sure wont do it the second time...

Tips should not be expected just because your employer is fucking you. Maybe you should take that up with your boss.

That being said I normally tip quite well. Usually around 20-25%. I didn't used to tip as much until I had a job where I relied on such. Generally the more expensive the food the lower the percentage of tip. I'm not made of money but I do what I can.

Quite a subject. Forgive me if I am repeating someone elses thoughts.

First of all, I tip when I go out to eat. It's my choice.

If there are more people in my group, I don't feel it's right that I get penalized for bringing more business to the establishment. Pre-emptive adding charges to the bill is horseshit. It makes me want to have everyone sit in groups of 4, so we fill the entire room and end up costing the establishment money in lost volume.

Restaurant wage (2-3 dollars per hour) is MAJOR horseshit. Do not expect the patrons to pay your employees. If minimum wage is set, the employer should pay it. Not get a discount because of the business they are in. I really don't know the origins of the special pay scale for food service, but I have never agreed with it. My sisters first jobs were like that, I would never work under those arrangements. If the employee is not worth minimum wage, don't hire them, hire someone who is good enough for amount set.

The employee should never expect to be tipped or act like it. I was an auto technician for fifteen years. Think about it, my competence (or incompetence) could be the difference between you getting home safely, or crashing into a busload of homeless nuns and all of ending up as crispy critters. That's not to say I deserve to extra compensation, I was paid my worth for what I did, I think some people need a little touch of reality.

However, I have seem some of the meanest, death looks from people who only brought a refill once and acted like I was an inconvience for asking. Tipping is fine, I enjoy it. There have been times when the guys and myself have left a tip equal to the bill (if not higher), just because there were four of us and we had a good time and the service was good. There have also been times when I leave a buck or just change to hope that someone will get the hint. But most are too self centered to understand my little ray of sarcasm.

007. :cool:

Originally posted by 007


The employee should never expect to be tipped or act like it. I was an auto technician for fifteen years. Think about it, my competence (or incompetence) could be the difference between you getting home safely, or crashing into a busload of homeless nuns and all of ending up as crispy critters. That's not to say I deserve to extra compensation, I was paid my worth for what I did, I think some people need a little touch of reality.



and some lowly restaurant employee may just have a fuck it attitude because he is being paid very low wage and not getting any tips because people THINK his/her job is not important, and then you or a bunch of people get hepatitis after he dropped food on the floor and put it back on your plate. ya never know.
of course the one job i had there was a lawyer who came in EVERYDAY with an attitude, acted like his shit didn't stink, NEVER tipped, and one day his little ol blackened tuna had a nice loogie as a side flavor.

Originally posted by The Praetorian
Okay, so I'm a racist - have it your way, dickhead. If that's the case, and you won't back down from calling me one, then things are going to get pretty rough in "mixed company" as you so delicately put it.

Free for one generation, my ass - slavery ended in 1865. That's 140 years by my count, but I suppose you'll play the same card "next generation", or more aptly, when your telling your sons about the injustices black people suffered just 280 years ago.

Hey, I totally understand - these things take time…

I wouldn't have called you a racist if I didn't mean it sweetheart.

Anyway:

"Free" in my book equals being able to vote, piss in a public bathroom, and go to college (any college I want).

It's been 40 years, in ten years it will have been two generations.

Originally posted by Ed Blank
I wouldn't have called you a racist if I didn't mean it sweetheart.
Thanks for the term of endearment.

An explanation for those with limited reading comprehension....

Who was it that said racism was dieing out? This thread should prove that there are still low-life racists that are more than willing to spout their hatred and contempt for people who are different.

This means that from reading this thread it is pretty obvious that racism is alive and well. It also states my oppinion that racists are low life.

Wanna take a guess at what their political affiliations are?

I asked if anyone wanted to try and guess what political leaning the obviously racist posters had.

If you jumped to the conclusion that this was some sort of putdown for conservatives then you must think that conservatives are more likely to be racist.

Originally posted by ivan
and some lowly restaurant employee may just have a fuck it attitude because he is being paid very low wage and not getting any tips because people THINK his/her job is not important, and then you or a bunch of people get hepatitis after he dropped food on the floor and put it back on your plate. ya never know.
of course the one job i had there was a lawyer who came in EVERYDAY with an attitude, acted like his shit didn't stink, NEVER tipped, and one day his little ol blackened tuna had a nice loogie as a side flavor.

A 'fuck it' attitude from the start is a sure way to get what they deserve, which would be very little. If I come in and have done nothing to offend, I deserve no special sauce or floor prepared food. The tip is for a job performed well, not just because they have a job serving. It's not that I THINK the servers job is not important, I do. Hell, if the server isn't there, I starve. I show everyone as much respect as they show me. I think that's fair. I tip because I know they get paid shit and they did a good job anyway. If they got paid like laywers or auto technicians, I wouldn't tip because they wouldn't need it.

Even if a customer totally pissed me off, I never did a less than acceptable job on the their car. It wouldn't be right or safe no more than introducing material into their food that doesn't belong there. That would make me just as much of an ass as the offender.

Lastly, I worked in a Pizza place back in high school. I do speak from experience. I feel everyone should have a food service or retail job at some point in their lives to know what it is to be on the other side of the apron.

007. :cool:

If you don't like what your employer is paying you then get another job. It is wrong to EXPECT your customers to voluntarily help support you and your family.

Originally posted by 007
A 'fuck it' attitude from the start is a sure way to get what they deserve, which would be very little.
Lastly, I worked in a Pizza place back in high school. I do speak from experience. I feel everyone should have a food service or retail job at some point in their lives to know what it is to be on the other side of the apron.

007. :cool:

i always gave/give 100% in my job/s. so i deserve my pay, but when some uppity yuppie thinks he can do whatever he wants well......
sometimes i get back at them by being even nicer to them. it erks them for some reason.
agreed with that everyone should have an apron job in their lives at some point, even those spoiled little rich kids.

Originally posted by Echo2
An explanation for those with limited reading comprehension....
And I suppose this wouldn't be directed at me, even though I asked the question originally...

Don't worry, Echo, I'm already well aware of the fact that you find solace in playing word games, and so are several others.

If you want to come out and say something, then just say it, you milquetoast.

Originally posted by Echo2
Wanna take a guess at what their political affiliations are?

I asked if anyone wanted to try and guess what political leaning the obviously racist posters had.

If you jumped to the conclusion that this was some sort of putdown for conservatives then you must think that conservatives are more likely to be racist.
Prime example, asshole, and a pathetic attempt too boot.

Originally posted by Echo2
I asked if anyone wanted to try and guess what political leaning the obviously racist posters had.
With the obvious insinuation that they must be from the party you don't agree with, i.e. conservative.
If you jumped to the conclusion that this was some sort of putdown for conservatives then you must think that conservatives are more likely to be racist.
Forgive me if I'm wrong, Echo, but don't you think conservatives are more likely to be racist?

Originally posted by BorgHunter
With the obvious insinuation that they must be from the party you don't agree with, i.e. conservative.

Forgive me if I'm wrong, Echo, but don't you think conservatives are more likely to be racist?

I did not mention any political leanings in that post. Whatever you THOUGHT was obvious insinuation came from your thoughts not mine. What you assume I am thinking is only an assumption. If you jump to a conclusion in your head, don't try and blame me for what your thought process's come up with. The mere fact that you jump to the conclusion that people who post those kind of racial remarks are (as you put it) "conservative" is interesting.

Prae- Thanks for ther compliment. :)

Originally posted by Echo2
I did not mention any political leanings in that post. Whatever you THOUGHT was obvious insinuation came from your thoughts not mine. What you assume I am thinking is only an assumption. If you jump to a conclusion in your head, don't try and blame me for what your thought process's come up with.

Oh please. :rolleyes: Why would you even ask the question then? It didn't have anything to do with the issue.

Originally posted by Echo2
The mere fact that you jump to the conclusion that people who post those kind of racial remarks are (as you put it) "conservative" is interesting.


Yeah, but it doesn't indicate that we naturally assume that conservatives are racist. It indicates that we naturally assume that you assume conservatives are more likely to be racist.

i know it seems like a pain to some of you, but remember that some of these people (i.e. wait staff) only get paid a portion of minimum wage. when i was a waitress and bartender, we got between $2.13 and $3.30 an hour, depending on advancement. the rest of our income came from tips that were EARNED. patrons are tipping for being served. when you go out to eat, all you have to do is sit back, relax, and let the serving staff wait on you hand and foot.

Originally posted by jennygadling
i know it seems like a pain to some of you, but remember that some of these people (i.e. wait staff) only get paid a portion of minimum wage. when i was a waitress and bartender, we got between $2.13 and $3.30 an hour, depending on advancement. the rest of our income came from tips that were EARNED. patrons are tipping for being served. when you go out to eat, all you have to do is sit back, relax, and let the serving staff wait on you hand and foot.

bingo, so be nice, and tip well. or (how do you spell a loogey making sound?) hhhhhhhawwwchhhhhh.............

Originally posted by Echo2
If you don't like what your employer is paying you then get another job. It is wrong to EXPECT your customers to voluntarily help support you and your family.

Perhaps all the waitresses left, to find other jobs. Who then would serve you. And they would be taking jobs that other people may have, it puts less jobs on the market, more people in unemployment and on welfare, which guess what, we all support them involuntarily.

This thread actually shocked me... yeah I know... get over it but honestly...

To think that someone would actually lower themselves to spit in another person's food or drop it on the floor and think that is okay and feel good about themselves for doing it, well frankly that shocks the crap out of me.

Talk about money grubbing... over a customer's attitude or the lack of a tip... yep...great self esteem and personal integrity...

The restaurants we frequent, we tip well... we frequent them because they are CLEAN, the food is great, and we love the atmosphere, and the staff are amazing. Often they will bring our beverages to the table with them before we order because they remember what we like.

Others we try out... I head to the washroom first... if it is not spotless we are are gone....

If the service and attitude suck, so does my tip...period. And if someone has spit on my plate...well... rest assured what goes around comes around... it is the way the energy of the world works.