What do you guys make of McClellan's "tell all book" and the scathing criticism of Bush admin?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080530/ap_on_go_pr_wh/white_house_loyalty

One really interesting thing is that his father did the same thing to LBJ.

Laura Ingraham's predictions: he will get at least two segments on 60 Minutes and will become a contributor on MSNBC, CNBC or CNN.

.....will become a contributor on MSNBC, CNBC or CNN.

Yeah Fox would never take anyone who speaks against the Bush admin...

Yeah Fox would never take anyone who speaks against the Bush admin...
Besides Mara Liasson, Juan Williams, Alan Colmes, Bob Beckel, Geraldine Ferraro, Geraldo, etc.

It's hard to know what to make of it. It all sounds pretty plausible, even likely, based on the way the administration seems to work. But then again, the more he complains, the richer he gets from the book and speaking engagements, so there's that too.

I think the timing is good for his book sales, but it is a shame he didn't grow a conscience about this stuff until 5 years too late.

What do you guys make of McClellan's "tell all book" and the scathing criticism of Bush admin?

Excerpts like this from the news article are straight out of Bizarro World--

If a presidential spokesman finds the White House policy so distasteful, he should quit, not package it up in bundles of notes and then write a tell-all book, said Sheila Tate, who was press secretary to Nancy Reagan and to George H.W. Bush during his presidential campaign.

IOW, Ms Tate, just because the sitting president lies the country into a disastrous war, it does not give anyone the right to actually speak up about it, eh? Better to just keep it all swept neatly under the rug, I guess.

McClellan defends his decision not to speak out during the run-up or early days of the war in Iraq. "I very much gave the benefit of the doubt to the president and his foreign policy team," McClellan said.

Riiiight. He gave him the "benefit of the doubt".

As did the majority of the dimwitted, unthinking electorate in this country.............to what has now become their everlasting regret.

What McClellan is saying (admitting) in so many words was that he and his president sold the American People on what is (along with things like the sinking of the Lusitania, the blowing up of the Maine, the Gulf of Tonkin Incident and Pearl Harbor) one of the most immense, damnable, despicable lies in the history of the planet; that Saddam Hussein was somehow connected with the 9/11 attacks, (or that he had tons and tons of WMDs, or that he needed his country democratized, or whatever the latest baldfaced goddamned lie is) and as such had to have a war waged against him.

McClellan was ordered to say that White House aides Karl Rove and I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby were not involved in leaking Plame's identity. Later, a criminal investigation revealed that they were.

IOW, it is now being admitted what millions of people knew or suspected at the time; that operatives in the highest positions of power in the incredibly crooked B*sh Administration were involved in the outing of a CIA agent for revenge. An act of treason, that deserved to have all the guilty parties imprisoned for it. Yet all they got was one little underling to throw under the bus and take the heat --- such as it was.


This immense lie is NOW being admitted to......publicly.......and the American People barely bat an eye.

Such is the state of affairs that we have sunk to under this band of liars, warmongers and traitors.

FT, yes I agree. But why isn't there any outrage or action? What are common citizens to do? go to the streets? Everyone is helpless.

FT, yes I agree. But why isn't there any outrage or action? What are common citizens to do? go to the streets?

Yes. That is precisely what we need to do en masse. The government should fear the people, the people should not fear the government.
Unfortunately as FT is constantly pointing out too many Americans are just too complacent and/or brainwashed to be bothered standing up for their rights. (which is the same thing that happened in Germany in the 1930s, as Milton Meyer showed us.)


Everyone is helpless.

Only because so many people believe that and thinking it makes it so.


.

FT, yes I agree. But why isn't there any outrage or action?

Because the masses have been, for many decades, systematically dumbed down and trained to pay no attention to the man behind the curtain. They are --collectively-- incapable of critical thought and thus incapable of action.

What are common citizens to do?

Get up every morning like the wage slaves that they are, and show up to work on time and for fuck's sake, keep telling themselves that nothing is wrong.....that everything is as it should be, that those in power know best.......

........and anyway --provided that we have been dependable, complacent little cogs in the machine-- when we die, we all get a free trip to the Big Forever HappyLand in the Sky.

go to the streets?

If you could get them all to act in accordance, they could wield tremendous power. But it cannot happen. The Public at large is too fragmented, too conformist, too afraid to confront the will and the direction of the status quo. Besides which, a great number of them are so brainwashed as to think that what is going on is just peachy.

Everyone is helpless.

The boat is being rowed directly toward the rapids. Most of the people on the boat are too stupid to be aware that the rapids are there,and the ones that are aware and who are screaming out a warning cannot counteract the power of the overwhelming majority.

So, yep. We're screwed.

McClellan was ordered to say that White House aides Karl Rove and I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby were not involved in leaking Plame's identity. Later, a criminal investigation revealed that they were.

I could be wrong but I don't recall that.

A quote from David Axelrod about Scotty's book.


“We are talking on a day where the president’s press secretary released a book where they frankly acknowledged that they engaged in deception and propaganda to essentially lead America to war. Senator Obama saw through that and raised the appropriate questions. Sen. McCain didn’t,” he said.

I could be wrong but I don't recall that.

I don't know about the part where he was "ordered" to say that, but he did in fact say it. It's been replayed on the radio a few times in the last few days.

McClellan's book was vetted by white house lawyers in Dec 2007. They saw nothing wrong with letting him go forward with the book. Actually there is nothing in the book that most dems and particularily the anti-war dems didn't already know.

Give it a month and people will be saying "McClellan who ???"

Give it a month and people will be saying "McClellan who ???"

sad no?

Give it a month and people will be saying "McClellan who ???"People were already saying that which might be another motivation for writing the book.

It's been replayed on the radio a few times in the last few days.
I was referring to the part about Libby and Rove being involved in leaking Superspy's identity.

This is how the key points of this story are being perverted. Conveniently left out will be the fact that Joe Wilson repeatedly told people what she was, that Fitzgerald knew on day one that the leaker was Richard Armitage, that Colin Powell also knew this, and that she was so out of the loop at that point that she would drop her kids off at school everyday on the way to her dangerous job at the CIA (taking the same route everyday at the same time).


In the end, Libby was charged with nothing more than Martha Stewart-like charges.

Would anyone with an objective, agenda free story to tell hawk their book on Keith Olbermann's show?

In the end, Libby was charged with nothing more than Martha Stewart-like charges.

"Scooter" Libby was convicted of four counts of lying under oath and obstruction of justice.

Do you actually believe that calling the conviction "Martha Stewart-like" actually diminishes the severity?

:rolleyes:

Would anyone with an objective, agenda free story to tell hawk their book on Keith Olbermann's show?

Of course he would.
There is no such thing as objective, agenda-free corporate media in America anymore.
He is going to get a far less hostile reception from Olbermann then he would from Hannity.

"Scooter" Libby was convicted of four counts of lying under oath and obstruction of justice.

Do you actually believe that calling the conviction "Martha Stewart-like" actually diminishes the severity?

I am not diminishing the severity of "four counts of lying under oath and obstruction of justice".

But this story is being retold in a way that suggests that he was convicted of leaking the story.

Which isn't true.

He is going to get a far less hostile reception from Olbermann then he would from Hannity.
"Far less hostile" is an understatement.

He'll be worshipped a la David Brock.

With Pelosi and Reid in charge, there is little to no chance there will ever be an investigation into the Bush admin behaviour.

They're too busy trying to force Hillary out of the dem primary so Obama can be the president which guarantees no investigations .... you know ... can't we all get along and make nicey-nicey.

The democratic party is in shambles.

Maybe 4 years of President John McCain coupled with the loss of the senate and possibly the loss of the house will wake them up ... er ... forget that ... there's no waking them.

Maybe 4 years of President John McCain coupled with the loss of the senate and possibly the loss of the house will wake them up ...

It is not the Democrats who must awaken, it is the People of this country.

But then, again, that is never going to happen.

Any electorate who could go through what this country went through during the first four years of the B*sh Administration, and go to the polls and willingly ask for more of the same is not simply asleep.

They are in a coma.

"Far less hostile" is an understatement.

He'll be worshipped a la David Brock.

Send me a postcard from whatever Fantasy Land you are currently inhabiting. :rolleyes:

I am not diminishing the severity of "four counts of lying under oath and obstruction of justice".
I agree you are not succeeding, but you sure are trying. :rolleyes:



But this story is being retold in a way that suggests that he was convicted of leaking the story.


By whom? Can you cite a link?

By whom? Can you cite a link?
No link, a quote from "Free"thinker:
"McClellan was ordered to say that White House aides Karl Rove and I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby were not involved in leaking Plame's identity. Later, a criminal investigation revealed that they were."

No link, a quote from "Free"thinker:
"McClellan was ordered to say that White House aides Karl Rove and I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby were not involved in leaking Plame's identity. Later, a criminal investigation revealed that they were."

That only says the investigation revealed he was involved, not that he was convicted of the leak.

Try again.

No link, a quote from "Free"thinker:
"McClellan was ordered to say that White House aides Karl Rove and I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby were not involved in leaking Plame's identity. Later, a criminal investigation revealed that they were."

Can you answer me 2 very simple and rational questions.

1.) Why wasn't the real leaker { Richard Armitage } ever
put before a Grand Jury,like Scooter.?
2.) Why did Fitzpatrick,knowing before he ever started his investigation,
continue on,when he had the first leaker,Richard Armitage.?

Can you answer me 2 very simple and rational questions.

1.) Why wasn't the real leaker { Richard Armitage } ever
put before a Grand Jury,like Scooter.?
2.) Why did Fitzpatrick,knowing before he ever started his investigation,
continue on,when he had the first leaker,Richard Armitage.?

[no pun intended] would mess with people that have wiretap powers, rendidtion addiction and torture chambers.

That's why Fitz (and the dems in general) back off every investigation.

[no pun intended] would mess with people that have wiretap powers, rendidtion addiction and torture chambers.

That's why Fitz (and the dems in general) back off every investigation.

What are you saying or inferring.?

[no pun intended] would mess with people that have wiretap powers, rendidtion addiction and torture chambers.

That's why Fitz (and the dems in general) back off every investigation.
I rarely agree with you but at least, prior to this anyway, you haven't been ridiculous.

He "backed off" because, as I told you many times before, he had nothing.

Or actually, as we found out later, he had something but intentionally pursued something else.

That only says the investigation revealed he was involved, not that he was convicted of the leak.

Try again.
That quote by Freethinker does imply that Rove and Libby were found guilty of the leak.
It totally leaves out the real story of the leak.

You know, like when you're in court and you swear to the "whole" truth.

Anyway, beyond the implication, I don't even think what he said is true.

He also said some good things about Bush in his book.
(You probably won't hear the good on CNN, MSNBC, Exc.)


Yeah Fox would never take anyone who speaks against the Bush admin...

I rarely agree with you but at least, prior to this anyway, you haven't been ridiculous.

He "backed off" because, as I told you many times before, he had nothing.

Or actually, as we found out later, he had something but intentionally pursued something else.

So then,appointment of a Special Prosecutor,in lieu of the
the lessons of a Ken Starr,should in the least merit close scrutiny,
before any formal undergoing.
Why was the Wilson's claim,to be taken so seriously.?
Outing of a CIA Agent is one thing,but the Fitz never referred
to Valerie Plame as Covert,but rather undercover.
And she wasn't outed,as a pic in - Vanity Fair - with hubby
little Lyin Joe,proved.Why did the Wilson's have that Pic taken to
show to the world.?

[QUOTE=Brooks]That quote by Freethinker does imply that Rove and Libby were found guilty of the leak.
It totally leaves out the real story of the leak.

I beg your Karl.
Rove was found guilty of no such thing.
MSNBC is still,as of Tonight,and Chris Matthews - Hardball -
interview with Scott McClallan still asserting that Cheney was
behind the whole thing and Bush/Cheney knew all about Plame.
BTW... If McClellan wasn't such a little snitch,desperate for
approval and makin some coin,on the side,he wouldn't go
on - Hardball - and basically have Matthews try feverishly to entrapp
him with pointed questions.

He also said some good things about Bush in his book.
(You probably won't hear the good on CNN, MSNBC, Exc.)
Exc.?? Are you serious?!

Exc.?? Are you serious?!

O'Reilly just brought out the best.{Hellman's}
The best of a snitch in the White House.

That quote by Freethinker does imply that Rove and Libby were found guilty of the leak.
It totally leaves out the real story of the leak.

The quote in question was from the Associated Press news article about the McClellan book.

Here it is again.....

""Fleischer said it would have been more "honorable" if McClellan had stepped down, for instance, after the incident involving the leaking of CIA operative Valerie Plame's identity to the news media. McClellan was ordered to say that White House aides Karl Rove and I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby were not involved in leaking Plame's identity. Later, a criminal investigation revealed that they were.""

I somehow think that a B*sh insider of the first order-- McClellan-- knows far more than you about whether or not he was ordered to say that White House aides Karl Rove and I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby were not involved in leaking Plame's identity...........and that the Associated Press reporter and the editors of that paper did a bit of digging before commenting on (in print) what the underlying factors were in Libby's conviction.

I somehow think




yeah...yeah...yeah... butts that's yer problem in a nutshell.
You don't THINK.Somehow or otherwise.
You juts find enthrall with blurbing out the latest leftist
talking pts.,as if they were personally handed down to Moses.
Via,a burning bush.

The quote in question was from the Associated Press news article about the McClellan book.

Here it is again.....

""Fleischer said it would have been more "honorable" if McClellan had stepped down, for instance, after the incident involving the leaking of CIA operative Valerie Plame's identity to the news media. McClellan was ordered to say that White House aides Karl Rove and I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby were not involved in leaking Plame's identity. Later, a criminal investigation revealed that they were.""

I somehow think that a B*sh insider of the first order-- McClellan-- knows far more than you about whether or not he was ordered to say that White House aides Karl Rove and I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby were not involved in leaking Plame's identity...........and that the Associated Press reporter and the editors of that paper did a bit of digging before commenting on (in print) what the underlying factors were in Libby's conviction.

oh...when you repeat a lie you thought was true, you're not at fault, but if GW does, he's a war criminal?:rolleyes:

oh...when you repeat a lie you thought was true, you're not at fault, but if GW does, he's a war criminal?:rolleyes:

Yup.Boggles the mind sometimes this ulterior degree of hysteria over
what virtually every Democrat Senator,once stated and believed,
That Saddam HAD WMD and was a threat.
Now McClellan comes out and reinforces those Bush haters
till the Cows come home.
BTW ... When do Liberals Cows come home.?
Whe the supper bell ring-a-dinghy !

oh...when you repeat a lie you thought was true, you're not at fault, but if GW does, he's a war criminal?:rolleyes:

If you think it was "a lie", I invite you to contact the Associated Press, and accuse them of it. I'm sure they will be mightily impressed by what a great intellect like you thinks. You know....with your vast knowledge of the case. :rolleyes:

If you think it was "a lie", I invite you to contact the Associated Press, and accuse them of it. I'm sure they will be mightily impressed by what a great intellect like you thinks. You know....with your vast knowledge of the case. :rolleyes:
it's a matter of public record:slap:

it's a matter of public record:slap:

Then by all means, I invite you to contact the Associated Press, and accuse them of printing a falsehood.

(not holding my breath)

Then by all means, I invite you to contact the Associated Press, and accuse them of printing a falsehood.

(not holding my breath)

The AP is renown for breaking news First.
Therefore their renown also extends to Retractions.
Like ... Gobs.
Googles upon googles worth.
How many is a *Google ...anywho.?





* googol or 10 to the 100th power.
or 1 followed by 100 zeros.

I rarely agree with you but at least, prior to this anyway, you haven't been ridiculous.

He "backed off" because, as I told you many times before, he had nothing.

Or actually, as we found out later, he had something but intentionally pursued something else.

I'm not being ridiculous ... facts are facts regardless of how hard it is to swallow them ...

Clifford Baxter, the DC madam, Russ Feingold et al.

That's how this admin plays ... plain and simple.

That quote by Freethinker does imply that Rove and Libby were found guilty of the leak.

No, it doesn't. You are being ridiculous.
That "implication" is entirely in your imagination.


Anyway, beyond the implication, I don't even think what he said is true.

Well, there's a shocker. :rolleyes:

Well, there's a shocker. :rolleyes:
You tell me then. Is that true?

[Only a fool] would mess with people that have wiretap powers, rendidtion addiction and torture chambers.

That's why Fitz (and the dems in general) back off every investigation.
That's how this admin plays ... plain and simple.
This is what I wrote to you, in reference to the Plame case, about three years ago:

"Anticipointment - The feeling resulting from filling in the blanks in a story with speculative, desired fantasy and, when it fails to come to fruition, blaming a conspiracy to explain away why you were wrong.

You'll see."

DAMN I'm good!

You tell me then. Is that true?

That Rove and Libby were involved? Of course. Libby would have had no reason to lie under oath unless he was covering up their involvement.

Are you denying Libby lied under oath?

DAMN I'm good!

At taking partisan hackery to new lows? Yeah, I agree.
:slap:

That Rove and Libby were involved? Of course.
No. If Freethinker's statement is true. Specifically: "[McClellan said] Lewis "Scooter" Libby were not involved in leaking Plame's identity. Later, a criminal investigation revealed that they were."

At taking partisan hackery to new lows? Yeah, I agree.
:slap:
More of your "I know you are but what am I" juvenality.

1. If Freethinker's statement is true.

2. Specifically: "[McClellan said] Lewis "Scooter" Libby were not involved in leaking Plame's identity. Later, a criminal investigation revealed that they were."

1. FT was quoting an AP article.

2. What are you denying, exactly?

Then by all means, I invite you to contact the Associated Press, and accuse them of printing a falsehood.

(not holding my breath)
why would i? i'm not responsible for your fact checking, you are. the rest of us get stuck with enough of it.

why would i?

Because you are making the unsubstantiated claim it is a "lie".

Are you denying Libby lied under oath?
Never made that claim.

Because you are making the unsubstantiated claim it is a "lie".
it's common knowledge and a public record that Rove and Libby had nothing to do with superspy Val.

it's common knowledge and a public record that Rove and Libby had nothing to do with superspy Val.
Then why did Libby feel it necessary to lie under oath?

Then why did Libby feel it necessary to lie under oath?
he got the answers wrong, and they were proven wrong-that's all it takes for perjury.

he got the answers wrong, and they were proven wrong-that's all it takes for perjury.

That's right.Who's to say his recollections are wrong.
A ballbustin Special Prosecutor,who knows not when to
release a headlock.Geez,even the WWF knows dat mush.

it's common knowledge and a public record that Rove and Libby had nothing to do with superspy Val.

Are you actually asserting here that you believe that Rove and Libby had nothing to do with the Valerie Plame affair......?

Are you actually asserting here that you believe that Rove and Libby had nothing to do with the Valerie Plame affair......?
Obviously they were part of the story, but the original leakers were Richard Armitage first and Joe Wilson at countless cocktail parties.
Those involved in the cover up were Colin Powell and Fitzgerald himself.

he got the answers wrong, and they were proven wrong-that's all it takes for perjury.

I think it also has to be shown that you knew the answers were false when you uttered them.

Obviously they were part of the story, but the original leakers were Richard Armitage first and Joe Wilson at countless cocktail parties.

Robert Novak was blurting her status to everyone who would listen months before Artitage said anything.

he got the answers wrong, and they were proven wrong-that's all it takes for perjury.

No, it isn't. He also has to know he is giving wrong answers.

FYI - he was also convicted of obstructing the investigation.

Robert Novak was blurting her status to everyone who would listen months before Artitage said anything.
That's pretty amazing considering Armitage was Novak's source. Geeze.

Your memory of this story reads like a Dop inspired fantasy.
I knew once this didn't pan out the left would attempt to re-write it.

Here are some important points from Novak's article which are being intentionally forgotten:
"When Richard Armitage finally acknowledged last week that he was my source three years ago..."

"The news that he, and not Karl Rove, was the leaker was devastating for the left."

"When Armitage now says he was mute because of special prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald's request....." (why would Fitzgerald do this)

"Armitage's silence for the next 2 1/2 years caused intense pain for his colleagues in government and enabled partisan Democrats in Congress to falsely accuse Rove of being my primary source." (maybe that's why)


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/09/13/AR2006091301572.html