To give credit where credit's due, I'm starting this thread as a mirror to Brooks's thread. I have one question for pro-lifers that will show an inconsistency in their thinking:

Do you hold funerals for miscarried fetuses?

To give credit where credit's due, I'm starting this thread as a mirror to Brooks's thread. I have one question for pro-lifers that will show an inconsistency in their thinking:

Do you hold funerals for miscarried fetuses?Hmmm....true.

However, people of faith certainly say prayers for the soul of said fetuses. Holding a funeral gets into as much a monetary issue as any, imo. Why spend money on earthly tributes when prayer can do so much more, would be my way of thinking.

Hmmm....true.

However, people of faith certainly say prayers for the soul of said fetuses. Holding a funeral gets into as much a monetary issue as any, imo. Why spend money on earthly tributes when prayer can do so much more, would be my way of thinking.

Why do we have funerals in the first place then?

Why do we have funerals in the first place then?
For the living, obviously.

Why do we have funerals in the first place then?

Because there was once a living, breathing person who is no longer with us, and we want to pay tribute to his/her life and to remember it..........as opposed to trying to pay tribute to a fetus with an actual ceremony.

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A 3-day-old human embryo is a collection of 150 cells called a blastocyst. In comparison, there are more than 100,000 cells in the brain of a fly. Yet many millions of superstitionists throughout America insist that the collection of 150 cells possesses some sort of "soul". Said "soul" being immortal. What idiocy. No wonder this country is headed over the cliff........

Because there was once a living, breathing person who is no longer with us, and we want to pay tribute to his/her life and to remember it..........as opposed to trying to pay tribute to a fetus with an actual ceremony.

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A 3-day-old human embryo is a collection of 150 cells called a blastocyst. In comparison, there are more than 100,000 cells in the brain of a fly. Yet many millions of superstitionists throughout America insist that the collection of 150 cells possesses some sort of "soul". Said "soul" being immortal. What idiocy. No wonder this country is headed over the cliff........

Soul or no soul....HUMAN embryo as opposed to a fly???? You're pathetic.

If someone that you know has a miscarriage do you just tell them to forget about it, it is only a clump of cells? Or do you show them sympathy for thier loss?

Soul or no soul....HUMAN embryo as opposed to a fly???? You're pathetic.You do realize you're chatting with the same individual that has no idea what friendship is, right? If he cannot understand that simple concept, it follows that every other thought process is flawed.

You're right, he is pathetic.

For the living, obviously.

Wouldn't praying be a better use of time? I didn't understand the point you were making.

You do realize you're chatting with the same individual that has no idea what friendship is, right? If he cannot understand that simple concept, it follows that every other thought process is flawed.

You're right, he is pathetic.

No, I'm not chatting with him, HaVoK...it just felt good to tell him he's pathetic...:)

However, people of faith certainly say prayers for the soul of said fetuses. Holding a funeral gets into as much a monetary issue as any, imo. Why spend money on earthly tributes when prayer can do so much more, would be my way of thinking.

But you can hold a funeral without spending money.

Wouldn't praying be a better use of time? I didn't understand the point you were making.

There are usually prayers at funerals and the services are for the comfort of the ones left behind...for people to show their respect to the families of the dead.

But you can hold a funeral without spending money.


Leper, answer please, if your sister or wife had a misacrriage, would you tell them to forget about it, it is only a clump of cells?

If someone that you know has a miscarriage do you just tell them to forget about it, it is only a clump of cells?

No.

I do not tell them to do anything. I leave that to the Rightwingers and the religious faction (read; superstitionists) who seem to know what's best for everyone else.

You do realize you're chatting with the same individual that has no idea what friendship is, right?

What a childish comment. I'd expect more intelligence from an eight year old.

ROTFLOL.

p.s. ---

You know absolutely nothing about whether or not I have friends, or if I "know what friendship is".

Nothing.

No.

I do not tell them to do anything. I leave that to the Rightwingers and the religious faction (read; superstitionists) who seem to know what's best for everyone else.

I wasn't asking you freethinker, we all know you have about as much sympathy and compassion as a brick wall.

What a childish comment. I'd expect more intelligence from an eight year old.

ROTFLOL.

p.s. ---

You know absolutely nothing about whether or not I have friends, or if I "know what friendship is".

Nothing.

It's just a bit hard to imagine someone who is so angry and hateful having friends...*shrugs*

It's just a bit hard to imagine someone who is so angry and hateful having friends...*shrugs*

I am only angry and hatefilled when it comes to uber-conservative, sanctimonious asses like you and Havok.

or anyone that does not agree with you, which is 98% of the US population. that makes you an angry, bitter old coot.

I am only angry and hatefilled when it comes to uber-conservative, sanctimonious asses like you and Havok.That still says a lot about you FT. I have no hate at all for you. Anger sometimes, but im a hothead. Hate is too much emotion to waste on someone as pitiful as I believe you to be.

Leper, answer please, if your sister or wife had a misacrriage, would you tell them to forget about it, it is only a clump of cells?
Good question. I wonder how anyone pro choice would answer this one. Any takers?

Good question. I wonder how anyone pro choice would answer this one. Any takers?
Of course I wouldn't tell them that unless I knew that was how they felt. Obviously it would depend on the person. If someone who was planning on getting an abortion anyways had a miscarriage before their abortion, then I certainly wouldn't act all sad and sympathetic towards them. If it was someone that really wanted to have a baby, maybe was having trouble getting pregnant, then I would certainly feel sorry for their loss because it was a chance that got their hopes up and then dashed them.

Soul or no soul....HUMAN embryo as opposed to a fly????

Actually it is a blastocyst and I would hardly call a clump of 150 cells a "human".

Actually it is a blastocyst and I would hardly call a clump of 150 cells a "human".

So you say that you were not human at a point in your life? what were you? A jackass?

if your sister or wife had a misacrriage, would you tell them to forget about it, it is only a clump of cells?

I would certainly not word it that way, but then again look who I am talking to - someone with the bedside manners of Dr. Strangelove.

My mother had 5 miscarriages between one of my brothers and sisters and she never felt the need to have a funeral for any of them. My sister in law had a miscarriage last year and in her words it was "no big deal".

So you say that you were not human at a point in your life?

I was not a human being until I was born.

But what would you know about that? You were probably hatched. :rolleyes:

So what were you before you were born? Nothing?

So what were you before you were born?

Biology 101 - Its called a "Fetus" before birth.

Leper, answer please, if your sister or wife had a misacrriage, would you tell them to forget about it, it is only a clump of cells?

No, I would sympathize - but my sympathy would be for my wife or sister, not for the fetus.

Now, answer my original question - why don't you have a funeral for a miscarriage?

There is no law against it is there? So I guess the only reason there is no "funeral" is becasue they dont sell caskets that small. Perhaps a small memorial service in the familys home is not insane is it? Does it have to be a funerla with a burial plot and pallbearers and all?

they dont sell caskets that small.

And why is that?
Seems like they would be cheap to make.

Well sounds like you got yourself a good buisness venture there bum.

I was not a human being until I was born.

But what would you know about that? You were probably hatched. :rolleyes:
But if you were born one day or one month earlier you would have been human.

So in your estimation, humanity is determined by location.

There is no law against it is there? So I guess the only reason there is no "funeral" is becasue they dont sell caskets that small. Perhaps a small memorial service in the familys home is not insane is it? Does it have to be a funerla with a burial plot and pallbearers and all?


I don't see the need for a full blown funeral for a miscarriage. I also don't think the idea of a small prayer service amongst close family as insane. Something like this should always be left to the family to decide. And so what if a family decides to hold a funeral for a baby that was miscarried? Who are any of us to look down on them or judge someone for doing that?
None of us can say how we'll feel or what we'd do until or if this happens to us.

But if you were born one day or one month earlier you would have been human.

So in your estimation, humanity is determined by location.

The law generally looks at it that way at any rate.

Typically, the law says you are a human when you are born alive.

To answer Trav's question, I offered my sister condolences on her miscarriage many years ago. It was to comfort her for her sense of loss, but it wasn't a statement about the humanity of the embryo.

It was to comfort her for her sense of loss, but it wasn't a statement about the humanity of the embryo.
But her own unstatable sense of loss shows that on some level she felt the humanity.

But her own unstatable sense of loss shows that on some level she felt the humanity.

Or the potential.

My mother had 5 miscarriages between one of my brothers and sisters and she never felt the need to have a funeral for any of them. My sister in law had a miscarriage last year and in her words it was "no big deal".

Same thing happened to my mother - five miscarriages and not a funeral among them. The closest thing was her saying a prayer before she flushed one of them (that particular miscarriage was a result of her sneezing while sitting on the john). Not very pretty, but life and death rarely are.