Now would be a good time to start......

....Paying Attention!!!! (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A13558-2003Dec18.html)

<The fresh-troops, heading-into the Iraqi shooting-gallery, at the end-of-this-year, would (probably) appreciate it.>

"Donald H. Rumsfeld went to Baghdad in March 1984 with instructions to deliver a private message about weapons of mass destruction: that the United States' public criticism of Iraq for using chemical weapons would not derail Washington's attempts to forge a better relationship, according to newly declassified documents."

Thank you for bringing in this information, but you don't write anything about it. Your opinion and response should be the first when you start a new thread, rather than a newspaper article. I read through the article, but for me it's 3:30 AM so its a little hard to concentrate. I'll get back to you tomarrow.

Shaman has no opinions, he's only a parrot.

Here's a pretty good older article about the Rummy handshake and how we fully backed their use of wmd's. Funny how so many people have conveniently forgotten about this.

http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB82/press.htm

'Nudder thing -- heard this morning from some soldiers that are privy to certain information that the draft is coming *SOON*.

Dop

wait wait, we said they could use weapons of mass destruction? and now we can't find any? hm... who in the liberal media can put two and two together?

and don't tell me mr. upstanding international citizen hussein actually voluntarily got rid of them.

Originally posted by Lungdop Philing
Here's a pretty good older article about the Rummy handshake and how we fully backed their use of wmd's. Funny how so many people have conveniently forgotten about this.

http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB82/press.htm

'Nudder thing -- heard this morning from some soldiers that are privy to certain information that the draft is coming *SOON*.

Dop Yes, the draft is coming soon, and the sky is falling as well. Start spreading rumors about the draft, if a soldier said it it must be true. stop with the fucking lies already, can you just not help yourself from lying and spreading rumors? "some soldiers" told you the draft was coming soon. Unless they were brgadier general or above, dont believe it. LOL

As far as this handshake thing, get over it already, your obsessed. why cant you just get it through your thick skull that it was a neccesasry thing at the time. Of course looking back it was bad, and has bit us in the ass, but so did supporting the soviets in WW2, learn some history of the world please. I am so sick of all these idiot liberals thinking they are so smart looking back on things. Just shut up. we did what we thought was right at the time. DO we regret it>? yes. we cant read the future. and to say reagan "supproted" saddams use of WMD on his people is just wrong. If you would read your own artil you would see this is not true. do i have to rehash it all for you, you posted the damn thing. I think the better the war goes, the better bush gets, the more hysterical and reckless the left becomes. The are so scared of another bush term they will stop at nothing.

Originally posted by Lungdop Philing
'Nudder thing -- heard this morning from some soldiers that are privy to certain information that the draft is coming *SOON*.

BS. Those rumors start flying around every time there's military action. Those rumors were going around during the first gulf war. Besides, if they were gong to draft soldiers they'd do it before military action, not after.

Trav

Chill out dude ... you don't have to be a general to be privy to info. How do you think stuff leaks out of the white house and pentagon? It's done by low level clerks and 3rd tier assistants to assistants ... just ask Alexander Butterfield. LMAO

OH, to answer your question on the other post -- *YES* I proudly served for 10 years so never question my patriotism again and I won't question yours.

I'd love to stay and chat but gotta go -- moving today.

Dop

well excuse me all to hell , I wont dare question anything you say herr director! What did you serve 10 years in anyway?

As far as believing rumors in the military, I figure if you were there 10 years you would know what a rumor factory the military is. Never believe anything you hear until you are already there. adn maybe you know now why all the stuff that leaks out of the pentagon and white housee is a bunch of crap usually. dan rather and hs boys always say " a un named source in the whitehouse", ya, its probably the janitor going through rubish cans.

Originally posted by WindWip
Thank you for bringing in this information, but you don't write anything about it.
That's some kind o' problem?

You limit your newspaper-reading to the editorials?

Originally posted by Mr. Shaman
That's some kind o' problem?

You limit your newspaper-reading to the editorials?

ya, becasue reading your posted articles is like reading anewspaper, whatever. yo posted a link to a forum topic in Billmaher.com, LOL

Originally posted by Lungdop Philing
Here's a pretty good older article about the Rummy handshake and how we fully backed their use of wmd's.
I've used that site (as reference), as well......BUT.....what the Washington Post is referring-to, are newly-declassified U.S.-GOVERNMENT FILES......facts that the NeoCons can't possibly dispute!!!!!!!!!!

When Saddam Hussein was gassing his own people, the REAGAN/BUSH ADMINISTRATION SAID ZERO!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Originally posted by LionelHutz
Besides, if they were gong to draft soldiers they'd do it before military action, not after.
Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.........

Lil' Dumbya pulled-the-pin, on this war, with soooooooooooooooooo much prep-work done!!!!!!!

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Originally posted by Mr. Shaman
I've used that site (as reference), as well......BUT.....what the Washington Post is referring-to, are newly-declassified U.S.-GOVERNMENT FILES......facts that the NeoCons can't possibly dispute!!!!!!!!!!

When Saddam Hussein was gassing his own people, the REAGAN/BUSH ADMINISTRATION SAID ZERO!!!!!!!!!!!!!

When the USS Cole was bombed by Al Queada terrorists, Clinton did nothing. Which is worse, not interfering in another nations genocide, or doing nothing when your own troops are murdered by terrorists? everyones got dirty laundry. its funny how you only see W's dirty laundy though.

As far as the draft, I think Shaman has little faith in the abilitys of our armed forces, this is the same country that sngle handidly defeated the Japs and helped defeat the german at the same time. We had a draft then becasue it was needed, we were battling millions of enemy soldiers spread out all over the globe and losing hundreds of men killed and hundreds wounded every day. A few insurgents in Iraq killing a guy here and there is nothing compared to that.

Originally posted by Travh20
yo posted a link to a forum topic in Billmaher.com, LOL
Hmmmmmmmmmm........maybe you should try.......

.....Reading It, Again. (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A13558-2003Dec18.html)

"When details of Rumsfeld's December trip came to light last year, the defense secretary told CNN that he had "cautioned" Saddam Hussein about the use of chemical weapons, an account that was at odds with the declassified State Department notes of his 90-minute meeting, which did not mention such a caution."

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

How 'bout 'SMORE??????????

Australia!!!! (http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,8218982%255E1702,00.html)

" The cable for Rumsfeld's party sent by then secretary of state George Shultz reopens debate over US support for the regime of Saddam Hussein during Iraq's war with Iran, at a time when Washington knew it was using chemical weapons.

The perceived threat of Iraq's chemical arms and other weapons of mass destruction was the primary justification given by Rumsfeld and President George W Bush for this year's US-led invasion of Iraq."

<Our good-buddy>Pakistan!!!!! (http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=story_20-12-2003_pg4_5)

"Rumsfeld met with Aziz in March 1984 for 90 minutes. It followed an earlier visit in December 1983 when Rumsfeld was instructed to persuade Iraq to resume diplomatic relations with the United States. Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein at the time was waging war on neighboring Iran and was using chemical weapons against enemy troops and also against the independence-seeking Kurdish population in northern Iraq. The United States at the time supported Saddam, fearing an expansion of Iran’s Islamic regime into Iraq and other Middle East countries."

Seattle??????? (http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2001819146_rumsfeld19.html)

" Throughout the 1980s, while Iraq was fighting a prolonged war with Iran, the United States saw Saddam's regime as an important ally and bulwark against the militant Shiite extremism seen in the 1979 revolution in Iran.

Publicly, the United States maintained neutrality during the eight-year Iran-Iraq war, which began in 1980.

Privately, however, the administrations of Reagan and the first President Bush sold military goods to Iraq, including poisonous chemicals and deadly biological agents, worked to stop the flow of weapons to Iran, and undertook discreet diplomatic initiatives, such as two Rumsfeld trips to Baghdad, to improve relations with Saddam. "

ReRon Reagan & Daddy Bush gave Saddam the GREEN LIGHT!!!!!!!!!

what is your point in all this? Who is denying we supported Iraq in their fight against Iran

" Throughout the 1980s, while Iraq was fighting a prolonged war with Iran, the United States saw Saddam's regime as an important ally and bulwark against the militant Shiite extremism seen in the 1979 revolution in Iran."


I have posted at least ten times about this, you always seem to ignore it and post this same thing again in another thread. I even started a whole new thread about it. go there and read it and reply about it, stop bringing up this same subject in every thread. If you are afraid to face the reality of why we suported Saddam, and would rather live in the fantasy that we used Iraq to test our chemical weapons on innocent Kurds becasue republicans are evil that your deal.

Originally posted by Travh20
I have posted at least ten times about this, you always seem to ignore

And even more irritatingly he puts "LOL!!!!!!!!!!" at the end of all of his posts, which isn't exactly intelligent debate.

Originally posted by LionelHutz
And even more irritatingly he puts "LOL!!!!!!!!!!" at the end of all of his posts, which isn't exactly intelligent debate.
Are you sure? Maybe this is just the way other people do this.

Yeah!!!!!! (http://www.fark.com)

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Originally posted by Travh20
If you are afraid to face the reality of why we suported Saddam......
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhh........so, it was totally acceptable when he was only gassing Iranians........but, it was different when he was gassing folks in the Northern oil-fields, huh??

Do you ever confuse yourself???????

So what if Rumsfield visited Hussain in 83 - so what if the US supported Iraq in the 80's

Why is that at all relevant???

That was 20 years ago - the world was a very different place, the US had very different policies, the cold war was very much alive.

Raising that issue as if it means anything is like saying - a while back black people couldn't vote and now look - we have equal rights - what hypocrites we are. The point being that - times change and smart people adjust based on reality.

Originally posted by DrewM
The point being that - times change and smart people adjust based on reality.
Isn't that the truth......

....Especially Within Our Justice-Department!! (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A16465-2003Dec19.html)