Do we really want a First Lady who has never, in her adult life, been proud of her country until her husband ran for the office of President?

Wasn't she proud when she graduated from Harvard?

Wasn't she proud when she had a very well paying job?

Wasn't she proud when her husband first won his seat in Congress?

Just what does it take to make this woman proud?


http://hotair.com/archives/2008/02/18/michelle-obama-hasnt-been-proud-of-america-in-at-least-26-years/

I haven't ever been proud of my country, or at least not its government. What good has the federal government done in the last forty years?

You and your crusade against the Federal Government. Jeeesh.

You and your crusade against the Federal Government. Jeeesh.
I repeat. What good has the federal government done in the past forty years?

Isn't pride one of the "Seven Deadly Sins"?

I repeat. What good has the federal government done in the past forty years?

That's a very telling statement, Borg.

Sad.

Wasn't she proud when she graduated from Harvard?

Probably. But that really has little to do with being 'proud of' one's country.

Wasn't she proud when she had a very well paying job?

Probably. But that really has little to do with being 'proud of' one's country.

Wasn't she proud when her husband first won his seat in Congress?

Probably. But that really had more to do with her husband and his accomplishments that it did her.

Just what does it take to make this woman proud?

I don't know.

Maybe for it to stop being such a imperialist nation and a global bully. Maybe for it to stop the unfortunate practice of killing countless people around the world who happen to stand in the way of profits for American corporations.

Just a guess.

Maybe she for some reason failed to be indoctrinated with the God-and-Country, My-Country-Right-Or-Wrong ideology that the vast majority of the citizenry is brainwashed with.

Maybe she realizes that to be *a Proud American* is to be a spoiled rich child. Maybe she realizes that *Proud Americans* feel entitled to whatever they want, and that they have no sense of responsibility to the world community. Maybe she realizes that they are not evil by their own design, but are willfully blind to evil so long as it does not interfere with their comfortable existence. Maybe she realizes that *Proud Americans* do not seek out the truth, but instead accept the Corporate propaganda stream that is drummed into their heads 365 days a year.....and that they accept it because it is easy and because it tells them what they want to hear, which is that they are the victims --the righteous, godly victims-- of a terrible outside evil. If they will just surrender their individual rights, their money, their children and their freedoms, then the government will make them safe to go on with their empty lives of mass consumption.

I haven't ever been proud of my country, or at least not its government.
Hear Hear!

[QUOTE=Frogger]Do we really want a First Lady who has never, in her adult life, been proud of her country until her husband ran for the office of President?

Wasn't she proud when she graduated from Harvard?

Wasn't she proud when she had a very well paying job?

Wasn't she proud when her husband first won his seat in Congress?

Just what does it take to make this woman proud?



She Slipped Up BiG Time.May cost her Change agent Hubby the
Presidency.There's no way she can be misunderstood or try
parsing.She got .... - " Too Cute by Half " - which was bound to
happen to someone,somewhere,somehow.
It's how Life is Lived.

That's a very telling statement, Borg.

Sad.
I agree with you. It's sad that the federal government does not represent the people.

I'm proud of the country (as in the people as a whole) but certainly not so much of the government. They could do worse, but they could certainly do much better.

I haven't ever been proud of my country, or at least not its government. What good has the federal government done in the last forty years?

How cute.I guess that explains how many Ballparks you've been
in and stood to attention for The National Anthem.
In fact,the more I know about you,the more I can say,you
have NO favorite Ball club or team.
Yer not a team player.
You'd ruther bee a Canadian...righto.?

I agree with you. It's sad that the federal government does not represent the people.

Who Pray tell do they represent,thar Mr.Whipple.?
The Fed represents You in a Limited yet dynamic role.
They are NOT to Babysit you or yer ilk from cradle to grave.

I'm certainly not going to vote for Obama now! Can't have a first lady who isn't proud of her country!

It's sad that the federal government does not represent the people.

True.

The U.S. government is a government of the Corporation, by the Corporation and for the Corporation.

Period.

______________________________

We in America live under a predatory corporate capitalist economy in an imperialist state - a system that values the concentration of wealth and power, and devalues people. In other words, we're on an unsustainable course in cultural, political, economic, and ecological terms.

[QUOTE=Freethinker]True.

The U.S. government is a government of the Corporation, by the Corporation and for the Corporation.


Well,Maybe you ought ta git with the program,Danny.
I think you grew up with a Canadians Viewpoint about what a
Country is for.
Our Country is For those who wanna succeed and are willing to
work and sacrifice to attain.
Sadfully,because of the L.B.J. Types,That Great Society lasted far
to long to the detriment of most americans.
If you want Government to stroke you and give you free stuff than
go to Cuba.You won't git mush,but it is Comp.

I haven't ever been proud of my country, or at least not its government. What good has the federal government done in the last forty years?
you ever think that maybe you're just expecting too much?

the interstate hwy system itself is enough to make me proud of the Feds and my country.

heck, i'm proud that poor ppl have cable tv! :p

you can get food gas and lodging 24/7 from coast to coast.

I can be proud of our government. It's successfully resisted violent overthrow for two hundred years, maintained a similar period of near constant economic growth, and successfully defended it's territory, even expanding it by orders of magnitude, dealing with the indigenous population as well as it could given circumstances.

That's a pretty good track record, considering what other nations with comparable surface area and populations have done. Our government just works. It's not fantastic, but it isn't overthrown every twenty years, either. That's enough to be proud of.

I can be proud of our government. It's successfully resisted violent overthrow for two hundred years, maintained a similar period of near constant economic growth, and successfully defended it's territory, even expanding it by orders of magnitude, dealing with the indigenous population as well as it could given circumstances.

That's a pretty good track record, considering what other nations with comparable surface area and populations have done. Our government just works. It's not fantastic, but it isn't overthrown every twenty years, either. That's enough to be proud of.

I think you just posted that to go with the flow.
You really wanna be a Minature Anarchist,like many the rest,herein.
It's kitschy poplar,is all.
Admit.

How cute.I guess that explains how many Ballparks you've been
in and stood to attention for The National Anthem.
In fact,the more I know about you,the more I can say,you
have NO favorite Ball club or team.
Yer not a team player.
You'd ruther bee a Canadian...righto.?
I have proudly stood for national anthems in three baseball stadiums. Two major league and one minor league. Wrigley Field, Tropicana Field, and Al Lang Field. (We can toss a football stadium, Raymond James Stadium, in there too if you want.) Even though I despise what the federal government does does not mean I disagree with the country's ideals. Merely that I believe that those ideals have become awfully perverted over the years, and it started with the wrong side winning in the Civil War. (But that's another topic for another debate.)

Who Pray tell do they represent,thar Mr.Whipple.?
The Fed represents You in a Limited yet dynamic role.
They are NOT to Babysit you or yer ilk from cradle to grave.
Jeez, you really aren't paying attention if that's what you think I believe. Take a look at the last quotation in my signature there, bud, and get back to me.

I have proudly stood for national anthems in three baseball stadiums. Two major league and one minor league. Wrigley Field, Tropicana Field, and Al Lang Field. (We can toss a football stadium, Raymond James Stadium, in there too if you want.) Even though I despise what the federal government does does not mean I disagree with the country's ideals. Merely that I believe that those ideals have become awfully perverted over the years, and it started with the wrong side winning in the Civil War. (But that's another topic for another debate.)

Jeez, you really aren't paying attention if that's what you think I believe. Take a look at the last quotation in my signature there, bud, and get back to me.

There's No way on God's Green Earth,that yer own words don't
defeat the credibility you aspire.
You can't have it both ways.
Despise this Government,yet have heartstrings for the very
stuff that Most Americans stand for.
You're a very troubled,impressionistic lad.
You can't talk yerself into a Utopian Nirvana.
Particularly in this Life.Ya takes the good with the bad,bear
yer crosses in private and gracefully co-exist.
That's THE Grown-up way.
That is why Dimocrats are little spoiled brats.

There's No way on God's Green Earth,that yer own words don't
defeat the credibility you aspire.
You can't have it both ways.
Despise this Government,yet have heartstrings for the very
stuff that Most Americans stand for.
You're a very troubled,impressionistic lad.
You can't talk yerself into a Utopian Nirvana.
Particularly in this Life.Ya takes the good with the bad,bear
yer crosses in private and gracefully co-exist.
That's THE Grown-up way.
That is why Dimocrats are little spoiled brats.
Ah, no, you don't understand. There's theory, then there's practice. In theory, America is great. The U.S. Constitution is the best constitution in the world, and I firmly believe that. The people here are also, often, great. Many of the institutions in this country, such as the aforementioned baseball, are awesome. We're the most capitalist nation in the world and that, too, is great.

What's not great is how things actually work. Rich, incompetent, power-hungry politicians. Expensive, pointless wars. Elections where it's Big Government Dipshit A (R) v. Big Government Dipshit B (D). If you can't separate the theory from the practical workings in your mind, that's a problem you should work on.

Ah, no, you don't understand. There's theory, then there's practice. In theory, America is great. The U.S. Constitution is the best constitution in the world, and I firmly believe that. The people here are also, often, great. Many of the institutions in this country, such as the aforementioned baseball, are awesome. We're the most capitalist nation in the world and that, too, is great.

What's not great is how things actually work. Rich, incompetent, power-hungry politicians. Expensive, pointless wars. Elections where it's Big Government Dipshit A (R) v. Big Government Dipshit B (D). If you can't separate the theory from the practical workings in your mind, that's a problem you should work on.

Clinton wasn't a problem as a pres.He got credit for a Booming new
Wall Street.The advent of the tech and Internet sectors.
But he stood for virtally Nothing.Like his wife.
Carter WAS a problem.Long lines at the gas punp and gas shortages.
Stagflation,double-digit interest rates,inaffordable housing market
and a willy-nilly,paper tiger Foreign Policy.

But whether in theory or in practice,Ours is and will always be the
Greatest place to live and have differences.
No one President is big enough,powerfull enough and willfull enough
to topple The Great American Spirit and camaraderie that indelibly
marks this Country as unique,singular and yes,constantly being
tested.But when Tragedy occurs,most Americanns Rally round the
Flag.
That's what matters most.
Anyone tells ya differunt,is out to lunch.
There is nothing wrong with the Rich,or waging War,if it's
about the continuation of our standard of Living,which is right
atop the World,and will remain so.

I think both the possible first lady's and first hubby don't come off that well. McCain's wife is stiff, stares too much, and doesn't really say much. Maybe she will speak more. Obama's wife comes off a little slow, and as my wife puts it, "She looks like a lesbian." Bill Clinton just looks like an old drunk.

So maybe none of the candidates will be punished in this election for what they're spouses are, except maybe Hillary. Kerry's wife was, I think, one big reason to blame for him losing... She's nuts, Bush's wife is just boring. Boring is better than nuts.

Anyway, rock on.

Do we really want a First Lady who has never, in her adult life, been proud of her country until her husband ran for the office of President?

Do you really believe that that's what she meant to say? Considering that her husband has been in politics for over a decade, I suspect she knows not to intentionally say something like that.

Any U.S. citizen who has never been proud of their country is just plain spoiled and unappreciative.

Any U.S. citizen who has never been proud of their country is just plain spoiled and unappreciative.
I think there's a legitimate semantic issue here, that being what it means to be proud of one's country. I can say I've been proud of my country as in the people, but not necessarily the government. It's a little vague as to what that means.

I think there's a legitimate semantic issue here, that being what it means to be proud of one's country. I can say I've been proud of my country as in the people, but not necessarily the government. It's a little vague as to what that means.

I don't know about you but I think "my country" and "my government" are entirely different terms. Even so, I would make the same statement about the U.S. government - understand the Constitution and the Bill of Rights are part of our government.

If you can't appreciate what the Bill of Rights did for our country, then you've got problems.

I don't know about you but I think "my country" and "my government" are entirely different terms. Even so, I would make the same statement about the U.S. government - understand the Constitution and the Bill of Rights are part of our government.

If you can't appreciate what the Bill of Rights did for our country, then you've got problems.
Ah, but that's a whole different issue entirely. There's a lot of good the federal government did, and the Constitution is one of them. However, I honestly can't think of a good thing the federal government has done for me in my lifetime. A sitting president called me a non-citizen, however!

Don't get me wrong, I think the United States, while flawed, is great. I doubt I'd want to live anywhere else. But I have never felt, in my lifetime, that the government represents me.

I repeat. What good has the federal government done in the past forty years?

They created the Internet.

Any U.S. citizen who has never been proud of their country is just plain spoiled and unappreciative.

Any U.S. citizen who doesn't feel a mixture of pride and shame for their country is just plain in denial.

They created the Internet.
Good point, but that happened before I was born.

Good point, but that happened before I was born.

You were born after 1994?

You were born after 1994?
Arpanet was created in the 70s. The Internet itself, I believe, started in the late 80s.

I haven't ever been proud of my country, or at least not its government. What good has the federal government done in the last forty years?

Is your cynicism limited to the US or is there any country of which you could be proud?

Any U.S. citizen who doesn't feel a mixture of pride and shame for their country is just plain in denial.

I never said the U.S. is flawless - I simply agree with Frogger's point that its offensive to hear a U.S. citizen say they have never been proud of their country.

Ah, but that's a whole different issue entirely. There's a lot of good the federal government did, and the Constitution is one of them. However, I honestly can't think of a good thing the federal government has done for me in my lifetime. A sitting president called me a non-citizen, however!

Don't get me wrong, I think the United States, while flawed, is great. I doubt I'd want to live anywhere else. But I have never felt, in my lifetime, that the government represents me.

At the very least, the federal government still respects and upholds the Constitution - I guess one can argue about the Patriot Act and a handful of other debatably unconstitutional issues, but there can be little doubt that the Constitution is still held in high esteem.

Can you not think of one Supreme Court decision that made you proud during your lifetime?

The liberation of Kuwait?

Tsunami relief effort? Or any of a number of relief efforts?

Our juggernaut economy, even in so-called "recession" periods?

I mean, seriously, you can't think of a single thing the federal government has done to make you proud? You're making a monumentally pessimistic claim.

At the very least, the federal government still respects and upholds the Constitution - I guess one can argue about the Patriot Act and a handful of other debatably unconstitutional issues, but there can be little doubt that the Constitution is still held in high esteem.

Can you not think of one Supreme Court decision that made you proud during your lifetime?
Okay, I'll grant you a few Supreme Court decisions. But some others, like Kelo, are just plain terrible.
The liberation of Kuwait?
I'm not very knowledgeable about the Gulf War, to be honest.
Tsunami relief effort? Or any of a number of relief efforts?
I don't think it's the federal government's place to do that. And they screwed up big time during Katrina.
Our juggernaut economy, even in so-called "recession" periods?
That makes me proud of the people here, but I don't think the federal government deserves too much credit for the economy.
I mean, seriously, you can't think of a single thing the federal government has done to make you proud? You're making a monumentally pessimistic claim.
Alright, you caught me, I was being a little hyperbolic. But I'm a libertarian; I'm supposed to be monumentally pessimistic about the government. ;)
Is your cynicism limited to the US or is there any country of which you could be proud?
Undoubtedly you're asking me this so you can have cause to yell "Anti-American!" "Blame America First!" Et cetera. However, I think the American government certainly has the best Constitution, and in many cases the best policy, out of any other country. I don't think I'd be any happier in another country, though I often desire to get out of Illinois and into a sensible state, like New Hampshire. Sure some countries have better policies on things than others (The Netherlands has a more sensible drug policy, and lets gays be married), but they're often balanced on the negative scale by being socialist or pseudosocialist.

Arpanet was created in the 70s. The Internet itself, I believe, started in the late 80s.

However... Like Butt .... Atheists Don't Believe.
Please try again.

However... Like Butt .... Atheists Don't Believe.
Please try again.
I love it when you make nonsensical claims, Foolie. Please, tell me more about how we atheists are incapable of forming opinions. After that, you can explain again your theory of how sheep's bladders can be employed to prevent earthquakes.

I love it when you make nonsensical claims, Foolie. Please, tell me more about how we atheists are incapable of forming opinions. After that, you can explain again your theory of how sheep's bladders can be employed to prevent earthquakes.

Then,show me a Sheep or herd of Sheep that are Atheists.?
Gotcha.

Then,show me a Sheep or herd of Sheep that are Atheists.?
Gotcha.
Really! You must be right; all those sheep aren't atheists, they're Christians! How silly of me. It was so obvious! All animals are Christians!

Really! You must be right; all those sheep aren't atheists, they're Christians! How silly of me. It was so obvious! All animals are Christians!

Sheep are Happy and content.
Many a Christian are likewise.
Show me a Happy and content Atheist,and I'll show you a
failed wet dream.
DOUBLE ... Gotcha.

Geesh... wonder which one his 16 years outta diapers Borg became so enlightened that he feels qualified to spread his wisdom across America today?

When was it Borg? In 2000 when you were 11? Or does it go way back to 1994 when you were in kindergarten?

What an arrogant little punk you are.

And BTW, I've got news for you, dear... your country ain't all that proud of you either. Why don't you join the military and become a MAN?

SMW

[QUOTE=smartmouthwoman]Geesh... wonder which one his 16 years outta diapers Borg became so enlightened that he feels qualified to spread his wisdom across America today?

When was it Borg? In 2000 when you were 11? Or does it go way back to 1994 when you were in kindergarten?

What an arrogant little punk you are.

And BTW, I've got news for you, dear... your country ain't all that proud of you either. Why don't you join the military and become a MAN?


yeah...Like Lon Chaney Jr. in :

- Manfish - {1956}
Based on TWO Edgar Allen Poe Shorts and characters like " Swede "
and a cunning Professor { Victor Jory } and a mean,unlikeable Captain.
We'll let Professor Borg play all 3 parts.
Of course that means makeup,and Wigs and makin his face look like
he spent the better part of a century drinkin and smokin and makin faces
like Lon.

Do you really believe that that's what she meant to say? Considering that her husband has been in politics for over a decade, I suspect she knows not to intentionally say something like that.

Yes, I really believe that's what she meant to say. She was playing to her audience. Of course now the spin will start and they will try to lessen the sting of what she said by saying she meant the federal government or something else but she was quite clear. She said that in her entire adult life this was the first time she had been proud of her country.

Even if I dislike much of wht the federal government has done over the years I can think of so many times I have been proud of my country.


I was proud of my country when we took part in massive relief efforts for the tsunami victims. I was proud of my country when we passed the Equal Rights Act. I was proud of my country when I raised my right hand and enlisted in the army. I feel an enormous feeling of pride in my country whenever I hear the National Anthem. I share Napsterbater's feelings of pride for the same reasons he does.

It is very telling that Michelle Obama has never before felt pride in her country, not in certin aspects of the government but in her country.

At one time I considered voting for Obama instead of McCain but as it stands now I would vote for Hillary Clinton before Barack Obama. I don't like her but I am pretty sure that both she and Bill are proud of their country.

Yes, I really believe that's what she meant to say. She was playing to her audience. Of course now the spin will start and they will try to lessen the sting of what she said by saying she meant the federal government or something else but she was quite clear. She said that in her entire adult life this was the first time she had been proud of her country.

Even if I dislike much of wht the federal government has done over the years I can think of so many times I have been proud of my country.


I was proud of my country when we took part in massive relief efforts for the tsunami victims. I was proud of my country when we passed the Equal Rights Act. I was proud of my country when I raised my right hand and enlisted in the army. I feel an enormous feeling of pride in my country whenever I hear the National Anthem. I share Napsterbater's feelings of pride for the same reasons he does.

It is very telling that Michelle Obama has never before felt pride in her country, not in certin aspects of the government but in her country.

At one time I considered voting for Obama instead of McCain but as it stands now I would vote for Hillary Clinton before Barack Obama. I don't like her but I am pretty sure that both she and Bill are proud of their country.

Her and her Hubby { Barack } went to THE Finest University's this
Country has to offer.I doubt they even needed student loans.
Probably got free rides on some grant {s}.The Obama's are in the
Top 1% of earners in this Country.
I also doubt they ever had to as much sweat over a grill at McD's.
They're typical Dimocrats.They'r whiny,spoiled brats.

Geesh... wonder which one his 16 years outta diapers Borg became so enlightened that he feels qualified to spread his wisdom across America today?

When was it Borg? In 2000 when you were 11? Or does it go way back to 1994 when you were in kindergarten?

What an arrogant little punk you are.

And BTW, I've got news for you, dear... your country ain't all that proud of you either. Why don't you join the military and become a MAN?

SMW

You're getting awfully upset over something as silly as pride.

You're getting awfully upset over something as silly as pride.

Tell that to a Young man upon entering the Marines.
If'n he'll let ya.

You're getting awfully upset over something as silly as pride.

It's nice of you to be concerned... but I'm far from upset. Just happens this was the second dumbest thing I've heard Borg spout off lately and felt the need to call him on it. (The first dumbest was his slam at Mother Teresa. Must've made him feel like a REAL MAN to diss a dead nun, eh?)

Nah, Borg reminds me of a bad little kid who tries to say the most outrageous things possible to call attention to him self. It's just a shame nobody cared enough about him when he was growing up to teach him manners and respect for his fellow human beings. They don't teach that in college and besides... he's too old to learn that lesson now. Next stops in his life... miserable young adult, disillusioned middle-aged man, grumpy old codger. The writing's on the wall.

*tsk tsk*

;)
SMW

Geesh... wonder which one his 16 years outta diapers Borg became so enlightened that he feels qualified to spread his wisdom across America today?

When was it Borg? In 2000 when you were 11? Or does it go way back to 1994 when you were in kindergarten?

What an arrogant little punk you are.

And BTW, I've got news for you, dear... your country ain't all that proud of you either. Why don't you join the military and become a MAN?

SMW
LOL. You're pretty hilarious, SMW, I've got to give you that much.
Nah, Borg reminds me of a bad little kid who tries to say the most outrageous things possible to call attention to him self. It's just a shame nobody cared enough about him when he was growing up to teach him manners and respect for his fellow human beings. They don't teach that in college and besides... he's too old to learn that lesson now. Next stops in his life... miserable young adult, disillusioned middle-aged man, grumpy old codger. The writing's on the wall.
Nah, I don't care if people pay attention to me or not, though I think it's very telling that that's the first thing you'd think of. I just have very unusual opinions. If that means I'm "calling attention to myself", so be it.

At one time I considered voting for Obama instead of McCain but as it stands now I would vote for Hillary Clinton before Barack Obama. I don't like her but I am pretty sure that both she and Bill are proud of their country.
It is really amazing how one minor comment can change your opinion so drastically. But it doesn't shock me. Conservatives tend to take any comment, that might not be 100% Pro-United States, blow it out of proportion, and then base their entire opinion on that. Typical, yet sad.

Furthermore, I don’t believe Frogger actually considered voting for Obama -– he's just using that as a way to drive his point home in showing that Mrs. Obama's comment was “so bad” it has caused him to be of the opinion that Hillary (the evil witch) would be better than Obama. Wow, that must mean her comment was REALLY, REALLY, super, super bad!! :rolleyes:

According to Frogger,

Let's decide to vote for someone based on their spouse, not the candidate themselves.

Let's decide to vote for someone based on a comment, not their policies.

Let's decide to vote for someone based on a comment about the past, a comment that won't have any affect on what they do for America in the future -- which is what this election is primarily about.

LOL. You're pretty hilarious, SMW, I've got to give you that much.

Nah, I don't care if people pay attention to me or not, though I think it's very telling that that's the first thing you'd think of. I just have very unusual opinions. If that means I'm "calling attention to myself", so be it.

Yeah... you do crave attention, Borg. You're as obvious as hell. Otherwise, why would you act like you KNOW so much about EVERY subject (up to and including which choice of car to drive makes people dickheads or not)?

You just like to run around and stir the pot. It's actually kinda funny since you seem to think you're so MATURE and yet act like such a silly little boy.

Unfortunately, you don't have 'very unusual opinions.' You have very childish opinions, based on close to NO life experience, yet you command quite an audience with your tantrums. A wannabe bad boy. What is it your profile says, "I'm a liberal atheist student?" That's an oxymoron for 'I'm too stupid to think for myself, so I'll just follow popular trends with my classmates'. With any luck, you'll grow out of it... with our luck, we're stuck with you until you do.

;)
SMW

Yes, I really believe that's what she meant to say. She was playing to her audience. Of course now the spin will start and they will try to lessen the sting of what she said by saying she meant the federal government or something else but she was quite clear. She said that in her entire adult life this was the first time she had been proud of her country.
People misspeak all the time. If they didn't, we would have to believe that the current president thinks that people put food on their families and that humans and fish are at war. It's not always as obvious or humorous but it still happens. And the fact that a presidential candidate's wife would never say something like that publicly (regardless of if she really felt that way) is a good indicator that Michelle Obama misspoke.

As for playing to her audience, I doubt that her audience was made up of Freethinkers and Mr. Shamans. Also, I'm sure she knew that the media was present and her audience was therefore the entire country.

Borg,
If you want to know what good the federal government has done, just think about what things would be like if it wasn't there.

Alright, you caught me, I was being a little hyperbolic. But I'm a libertarian; I'm supposed to be monumentally pessimistic about the government. ;)

Lol, ok, I'll drop it then. Any reasonable person will be able to see both good things and bad things about the U.S. IMO.

With that said, if you were a potential First Lady in an international spotlight, I'd find it borderline unforgiveable to make statements like that in a speech without offering any sort of apology or retraction.

"I'm a liberal atheist student?" That's an oxymoron for 'I'm too stupid to think for myself, so I'll just follow popular trends with my classmates'.
Whenever liberal/progressive ideas become mainstream, conservatives claim they are a "popular trend" and that people are just "followers" -- as to try and discredit whatever progressive idea is being pushed. But who is getting the last laugh? Us, the liberals.

When recycling became big in liberal cities, conservatives claimed it was a "fad". When the health craze started in the west coast, they claimed it was "trendy". But who, in these situations, is getting the last laugh? We are. Because we'll live in a healthier environment and our bodies will be healthier too. Why are you guys so afraid of change and new information that might change old way?

Anyway, call it "trendy" or a "fad" all you want -- because that doesn't discredit the ideas or concepts themselves.

And if it's "trendy" to do these things, I'll gladly be "trendy", because I’d rather be that, then living in a backwards, un-healthy way of life.

Conservatives would have said saying the earth wasn't flat was a "fad", because new information that supports progressive concepts and ideas (like the Earth being round) is just nonsense and “trendy” to believe in. :rolleyes:

Tell that to a Young man upon entering the Marines.
If'n he'll let ya.

Oh yeah? Well he can tell it to my dad! If he'll let him.

Whenever liberal/progressive ideas become mainstream, conservatives claim they are a "popular trend" and that people are just "followers" -- as to try and discredit whatever progressive idea is being pushed. But who is getting the last laugh? Us, the liberals.

When recycling became big in liberal cities, conservatives claimed it was a "fad". When the health craze started in the west coast, they claimed it was "trendy". But who, in these situations, is getting the last laugh? We are. Because we'll live in a healthier environment and our bodies will be healthier too. Why are you guys so afraid of change and new information that might change old way?

Anyway, call it "trendy" or a "fad" all you want -- because that doesn't discredit the ideas or concepts themselves.

And if it's "trendy" to do these things, I'll gladly be "trendy", because I’d rather be that, then living in a backwards, un-healthy way of life.

Conservatives would have said saying the earth wasn't flat was a "fad", because new information that supports progressive concepts and ideas (like the Earth being round) is just nonsense and “trendy” to believe in. :rolleyes:

Wait, OD... you have one upped Borg in the POPULARITY category... you can say you're a GAY, LIBERAL, ATHEIST STUDENT!

WOO HOO!! That's nearly as unheard of as getting a tattoo these days!

*walks off singing*

"They are rebels 'cuz they'll never be any good....
They are rebels 'cuz they never, never do what they should!"

:banana:

Wait, OD... you have one upped Borg in the POPULARITY category... you can say you're a GAY, LIBERAL, ATHEIST STUDENT!

WOO HOO!! That's nearly as unheard of as getting a tattoo these days!

*walks off singing*

"They are rebels 'cuz they'll never be any good....
They are rebels 'cuz they never, never do what they should!"

:banana:
--Looks at signature-- Yes, I'm an atheist. :rolleyes:

SMW, you've shown yet again that when you cannot actually discredit liberal, progressive ideas, you resort to trying to discredit them by making them seem like a "fad" or "trendy". That doesn't discredit them, it simply shows your desperation.

Face it, we're getting the last laugh with recycling, health promotion, cutting back on global warming by building green buildings, and promoting many of the other progressive ideas that conservatives laugh at, when really, we'll be getting the last laugh. :)

Continue keeping your head in the sand, and please, believe the earth is flat, because new information that disproves old beliefs is EVILLLLLLL and trendy!!!

--Looks at signature-- Yes, I'm an atheist. :rolleyes:

SMW, you've shown yet again that when you cannot actually discredit liberal, progressive ideas, you resort to trying to discredit them by making them seem like a "fad" or "trendy". That doesn't discredit them, it simply shows your desperation.

Face it, we're getting the last laugh with recycling, health promotion, cutting back on global warming by building green buildings, and promoting many of the other progressive ideas that conservatives laugh at, when really, we'll be getting the last laugh. :)

Continue keeping your head in the sand, and please, believe the earth is flat, because new information that disproves old beliefs is EVILLLLLLL and trendy!!!

LOL, honey I'm not trying to discredit anything except the validity of <20 year old opinions when it comes to being KNOW-IT-ALLS. My generation invented recycling, health promotion, green buildings and every other progressive idea you seem to think was born when you were. While your generation can't take credit for those ideas, you are responsible for carrying them forward, so be sure to carry your load.

Believe me... there's nothing NEW about 'raging against the machine.' It's been done to death now. Mostly by atheist liberal students for the last 100 years or so... but still.

;)
SMW

My generation invented recycling, health promotion, green buildings and every other progressive idea you seem to think was born when you were. While your generation can't take credit for those ideas, you are responsible for carrying them forward, so be sure to carry your load.
You mean the LIBERAL, COLLEGE-EDUCATED portion of your generation invented those things.

I'm excited to see what the LIBERAL, COLLEGE-EDUCATED portion of my generation comes up with.

But we can be assured that the CONSERVATIVE PORTION of my generation will fight against it, like you and your conservative porition did years ago. We'll hear the same attacks we've heard for decades, "it's trendy", "it's a fad", "what a waste of money!", "it's a myth!"...but again, we'll get the last laugh. :)

I didn't know all college educated kids were liberal.. I'm college educated, and i'm a conservative... WHOA!! BRAIN OVERLOAD!!!

Undoubtedly you're asking me this so you can have cause to yell "Anti-American!" "Blame America First!" Et cetera. However, I think the American government certainly has the best Constitution, and in many cases the best policy, out of any other country. I don't think I'd be any happier in another country, though I often desire to get out of Illinois and into a sensible state, like New Hampshire. Sure some countries have better policies on things than others (The Netherlands has a more sensible drug policy, and lets gays be married), but they're often balanced on the negative scale by being socialist or pseudosocialist.

Don't give up your day job as a mind reader.

It was merely a gauge of your degree of cynicism. Apparently nothing would satisfy you. And that's OK i was merely curious as to what box you fit in.

I didn't know all college educated kids were liberal.. I'm college educated, and i'm a conservative... WHOA!! BRAIN OVERLOAD!!!
I didn't say that. I said the college educated liberals came up with those ideas.

But be assured, the college educated conservatives fought against those ideas, just like the non-college educated conservative did.

Shut up, Overdose. You are a pain in the ass when you talk about Madonna or Britney Spears. You are even more a pain in the ass when you try to talk politics.

Shut up, Overdose. You are a pain in the ass when you talk about Madonna or Britney Spears. You are even more a pain in the ass when you try to talk politics.
You are very much in-line with how conservatives debate:

::LA LA LA LA LA LA LA--I CANT HEAR YOU, SO YOU ARE WRONG--LA LA LA LA LA LA LA::

Keep your head in the sand, it's too late in your life for you to leave.

My god, you're a fuckin' pain in the ass. I'll be glad when you have to start going to classes and studying again so that you stop posting so much.

Why don't you go to a rave or something. Just go away.

My god, you're a fuckin' pain in the ass. I'll be glad when you have to start going to classes and studying again so that you stop posting so much.

Why don't you go to a rave or something. Just go away.
Wahhh wahhh wahhh.

God you complain a lot.

Does someone wear adult-dipers these days? Because I've noticed more and more that you've been acting like a baby who shits himself.

Okay, you're now on ignore. How can people take your incessant crap?

Ouch. I'm depressed Frogger put me on ignore. I respected him so much!

Goddamn, can't you people shut the fuck up about the "Liberals are this" and the "Oh yeah, well conservatives are that!" crap? Talk about something that actually has meaning.

Unfortunately, you don't have 'very unusual opinions.' You have very childish opinions, based on close to NO life experience, yet you command quite an audience with your tantrums. A wannabe bad boy. What is it your profile says, "I'm a liberal atheist student?"
No, because I'm not a liberal. Sorry to disappoint you.
That's an oxymoron for 'I'm too stupid to think for myself, so I'll just follow popular trends with my classmates'.
"Oxymoron" is not the term you were looking for, I'm afraid. And while libertarianism seems to be gaining steam as a movement, it is still not yet popular. A quick glance on my university's Facebook network shows 132 self-identified libertarians, 321 conservatives, "over 500" (presumably it won't display any more than 500 in any given search) moderates, over 500 liberals, and 336 "other". Kind of blows your theory all to shit, doesn't it?

EDIT: Found some better stats to show you about my school's demographics:

56% None Listed
11% Liberal
11% Moderate
6% Other
6% Conservative
4% Very Liberal
3% Apathetic
2% Libertarian
1% Very Conservative

I'm a moderate... Damn, looks like I ain't such a rebel after all. :rolleyes:

I honestly feel being moderate or independent is the "cool thing" to do at college.

I honestly feel being moderate or independent is the "cool thing" to do at college.
I feel that the "cool thing" to do is not care about politics at all. Most people I know don't give a fuck. The few that do are extremely liberal. If I mention the issues on which I lean right, like gun control, I get dirty looks and gasps.

I feel that the "cool thing" to do is not care about politics at all. Most people I know don't give a fuck. The few that do are extremely liberal. If I mention the issues on which I lean right, like gun control, I get dirty looks and gasps.
Weird. Maybe kids are different in Oregon.

[QUOTE=smartmouthwoman]Yeah... you do crave attention, Borg. You're as obvious as hell. Otherwise, why would you act like you KNOW so much about EVERY subject (up to and including which choice of car to drive makes people dickheads or not)?

You just like to run around and stir the pot. It's actually kinda funny since you seem to think you're so MATURE and yet act like such a silly little boy.

Unfortunately, you don't have 'very unusual opinions.' You have very childish opinions, based on close to NO life experience, yet you command quite an audience with your tantrums. A wannabe bad boy. What is it your profile says, "I'm a liberal atheist student?" That's an oxymoron for 'I'm too stupid to think for myself, so I'll just follow popular trends with my classmates'. With any luck, you'll grow out of it... with our luck, we're stuck with you until you do.

************************************************
Yeah...yeah ! Right On.
The only problem IS,that little stump speech {comment} was originally
used for me.Almost exclusively,for a wiles.
Oh ! The Good Old Days.
I bet if you go back you had even more thought out criticism fer the
Likes of Me,me,me,me ... Meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!.
On account I'm Mr.Crave-it all.
Master Know-it-all.
If i have a weakness,let some church mice bring it up at their
weekly hootenanny,I say.
As far as this Borg,personage,He's way too youngish to grab what
rightfully belongs ta Me,me,me,me ... Meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.

What is it your profile says, "I'm a liberal atheist student?" That's an oxymoron for 'I'm too stupid to think for myself, so I'll just follow popular trends with my classmates'.While calling Borg stupid SMW proves she has no idea what an 'oxymoron' is.

Hilarious irony!

Perhaps she was looking for 'euphemism'. :)

While calling Borg stupid SMW proves she has no idea what an 'oxymoron' is.

Hilarious irony!

Perhaps she was looking for 'euphemism'. :)

No... YOU the one always lookin fer an " ism ".
If it T'weren't fer ism's you probably babble for bubble gum
on broadway in broad .... Beowulf !

Wyrd oft nereth
Unfaegne eorl

It is really amazing how one minor comment can change your opinion so drastically. But it doesn't shock me. Conservatives tend to take any comment, that might not be 100% Pro-United States, blow it out of proportion, and then base their entire opinion on that. Typical, yet sad.

Furthermore, I don’t believe Frogger actually considered voting for Obama -– he's just using that as a way to drive his point home in showing that Mrs. Obama's comment was “so bad” it has caused him to be of the opinion that Hillary (the evil witch) would be better than Obama. Wow, that must mean her comment was REALLY, REALLY, super, super bad!! :rolleyes:

According to Frogger,

Let's decide to vote for someone based on their spouse, not the candidate themselves.

Let's decide to vote for someone based on a comment, not their policies.

Let's decide to vote for someone based on a comment about the past, a comment that won't have any affect on what they do for America in the future -- which is what this election is primarily about.Previously, it was Obama's supposed sensitivity to remarks about his big ears that disqualified him:Barack Obama has shown a bit of his personality by whining and in a way threatening Maureen Dowd by putting her on notice to not mention his big ears. He has shown that he does not have the temperment necessary to be President of The United States.

http://www.allforums.net/showthread.php?p=254086&#post254086

That's a very telling statement, Borg.

Sad.
You could start a new thread..
name 5 things that make you proud about the US..
or name 5 things that would make you proud of the US ..

pick one or make one of your own..
one progressive.. looking for improvements..
or..
for example..Mitt.. America is perfect.. pffftttt:confused:

You could start a new thread..
name 5 things that make you proud about the US..
or name 5 things that would make you proud of the US ..
Why should I start a thread? I only commented that Borg didn't feel there was anything he was proud of over the last 40 years that the federal government had done. It's more a commentary on our educational system and current "theme" of America bashing than a accusation directed at Borg. If one cannot think of anything positive that has been formented by the US in that time frame... I feel quite sad. I happen to consider Borg a decent guy (most of the time... LOL) and have enjoyed both reading and posting with him on these forums.

pick one or make one of your own..
one progressive.. looking for improvements..

I would suggest YOU start the thread. I would be all ears to hear all the improvements that you will make to the United States. Like I have said before, I can teach a monkey to point out problems... I just can't teach the monkey to offer rational solutions.

Is the US government perfectly despicable in all that it does? No. Is the govenment perfectly wonderful in all that it does? Again, no. Are there times you should be "ashamed" of the US? Yes there are. Are there times you should be "proud" of the US? Yes, there are those times also.

or..
for example..Mitt.. America is perfect.. pffftttt:confused:
Your point here?

Weird. Maybe kids are different in Oregon.

Either that, or you don't know what you're talking about...

Geesh... wonder which one his 16 years outta diapers Borg became so enlightened that he feels qualified to spread his wisdom across America today?
When was it Borg? In 2000 when you were 11? Or does it go way back to 1994 when you were in kindergarten?
What an arrogant little punk you are.
backatche
SMW

Ok I'l be the first to admit.. my first impression of borg was (imagined) 4eyed tech geek ,fat boy, $300 office chair in mom's basement screamin' for proactiv... but hey my 1st impression of shaman was of mr monk..hehe..
for all I know smw is a lonely 400lb redneck w/a yeast infection scratchin' that itch w/a crowbar.. but I don't want to presume..

btw.. mother teresa was no saint..that is unless you are a fan of mythology (which feigned w/her later years)..

just pokin' fun.. you folks get sooooo serious some times..

oh damn... ot
what happened to michelle obama?.. yes we can??

was that so wrong...;)

Ok I'l be the first to admit.. my first impression of borg was (imagined) 4eyed tech geek ,fat boy, $300 office chair in mom's basement screamin' for proactiv...
Well he's not fat, he lives by himself, and I can't imagine him being caught dead in a $300 chair. :p

Why should I start a thread? I only commented that Borg didn't feel there was anything he was proud of over the last 40 years that the federal government had done. It's more a commentary on our educational system and current "theme" of America bashing than a accusation directed at Borg. If one cannot think of anything positive that has been formented by the US in that time frame... I feel quite sad. I happen to consider Borg a decent guy (most of the time... LOL) and have enjoyed both reading and posting with him on these forums.


I would suggest YOU start the thread. I would be all ears to hear all the improvements that you will make to the United States. Like I have said before, I can teach a monkey to point out problems... I just can't teach the monkey to offer rational solutions.

Is the US government perfectly despicable in all that it does? No. Is the govenment perfectly wonderful in all that it does? Again, no. Are there times you should be "ashamed" of the US? Yes there are. Are there times you should be "proud" of the US? Yes, there are those times also.


Your point here?
hey I was just makin' fun because the tread got too serious and everyone was takin' potshots at each other rather than makin' suggestions toward a new and better way.. excuse me.. my strange sense of humor at work..

and to underline your one of your best points..
"I can teach a monkey to point out problems... I just can't teach the monkey to offer rational solutions."

I'll make a list and get back to ya..;)

[QUOTE=jim's op/ed]Ok I'l be the first to admit.. my first impression of borg was (imagined) 4eyed tech geek ,fat boy, $300 office chair in mom's basement screamin' for proactiv... but hey my 1st impression of shaman was of mr monk..hehe..
for all I know smw is a lonely 400lb redneck w/a yeast infection scratchin' that itch w/a crowbar.. but I don't want to presume..

btw.. mother teresa was no saint.. ?

I beg your Ignurnce.Unless you bespeak based solely on a lifetime
of hatred of all things Saintly like Kingfish Atheist ... :
Chrstopher Hitchens.

Well he's not fat, he lives by himself, and I can't imagine him being caught dead in a $300 chair. :p
again in my MY mind .. first impressions( from years ago)..
right or wrong.. it's not as if he makes a response to anything I've said...
I'm probably on his ignore..I get it..

[QUOTE=jim's op/ed]Ok I'l be the first to admit.. my first impression of borg was (imagined) 4eyed tech geek ,fat boy, $300 office chair in mom's basement screamin' for proactiv... but hey my 1st impression of shaman was of mr monk..hehe..
for all I know smw is a lonely 400lb redneck w/a yeast infection scratchin' that itch w/a crowbar.. but I don't want to presume..

btw.. mother teresa was no saint.. ?

I beg your Ignurnce.Unless you bespeak based solely on a lifetime
of hatred of all things Saintly like Kingfish Atheist ... :
Chrstopher Hitchens.
if you are reading hitchen's then you know where I'm coming from..

btw are you aka Odder? the similarities are significant..

Ok I'l be the first to admit.. my first impression of borg was (imagined) 4eyed tech geek ,fat boy, $300 office chair in mom's basement screamin' for proactiv...
Hey! I bought my chair on clearance, I'll have you know!

Hey! I bought my chair on clearance, I'll have you know!
mesh or leather?

i was using a $900 leather recliner, but that was mostly for medical reasons...i'm kinda embarrased about what i'm using now.:o

You mean the LIBERAL, COLLEGE-EDUCATED portion of your generation invented those things.

I'm excited to see what the LIBERAL, COLLEGE-EDUCATED portion of my generation comes up with.

But we can be assured that the CONSERVATIVE PORTION of my generation will fight against it, like you and your conservative porition did years ago. We'll hear the same attacks we've heard for decades, "it's trendy", "it's a fad", "what a waste of money!", "it's a myth!"...but again, we'll get the last laugh. :)

So, tell me OD... do you think people are BORN into liberalism... or conservativism and never change? Going to college is now and has always been most people's first exposure to liberal attitudes and students have always bought into the liberal spiel in droves. Why? Because 90% of the instructors are liberals and because you do as you're told at that age. You also believe everything you're taught and most of what you read on the 'net and very little, if anything, old codgers like your parents and grandparents say. In other words, you're gullible as hell during this time of your life and cling to the opinions of strangers like they're some kinda gods who know secrets you're just now hearing. That's not all bad... it gives you the chance to look at the world from a semi-adult viewpoint, which you've never experienced before.

But trust me... once you get out on your own and pay your own way for a few years and sign up for a 30 year mortgage and experience life away from mammy and pappy, your political views will probably change. That's the way life happens. You're born... you're schooled... you work, you die. What you learn in school is important, but it's far from the most important thing you'll ever experience.

20-something liberals are the norm... 30-something liberals are holding on to their youthful ideals nearly as furiously as they're trying to hold onto their hair... 40+ liberals are just plain whiney ole misfits who never figured out the purpose of their lives. I can give you an example of each age group from Allforums alone... but for the sake of congeniality, I'll refrain.

;)
SMW

[QUOTE=smartmouthwoman]So, tell me OD... do you think people are BORN into liberalism... or conservativism and never change? Going to college is now and has always been most people's first exposure to liberal attitudes and students have always bought into the liberal spiel in droves. Why? Because 90% of the instructors are liberals and because you do as you're told at that age. You also believe everything you're taught and most of what you read on the 'net and very little, if anything, old codgers like your parents and grandparents say. In other words, you're gullible as hell during this time of your life and cling to the opinions of strangers like they're some kinda gods who know secrets you're just now hearing. That's not all bad... it gives you the chance to look at the world from a semi-adult viewpoint, which you've never experienced before.

But trust me... once you get out on your own and pay your own way for a few years and sign up for a 30 year mortgage and experience life away from mammy and pappy, your political views will probably change. That's the way life happens. You're born... you're schooled... you work, you die. What you learn in school is important, but it's far from the most important thing you'll ever experience.

20-something liberals are the norm... 30-something liberals are holding on to their youthful ideals nearly as furiously as they're trying to hold onto their hair... 40+ liberals are just plain whiney ole misfits who never figured out the purpose of their lives. I can give you an example of each age group from Allforums alone... but for the sake of congeniality, I'll refrain.

********************************

Um,Sounds like advice Ann Landers gave Abigail Van Buren ford her
dotter ran off to Brandeis and sang hippy songs at Cholmomdeley's
Coffeehouse to usher in a career as Advice Columnist for the Lustfully
forlorn.

to touch on SMW's post, i'm doing a research paper on some convincing evidence of adolescent and young adult body image being influenced by the media. I would say this is proof that they indeed.. do what they are told, whether it be directly or indirectly.

So, tell me OD... do you think people are BORN into liberalism... or conservativism and never change?
No, I do not think people are born as either conservative or liberal. Do you?

Going to college is now and has always been most people's first exposure to liberal attitudes and students have always bought into the liberal spiel in droves. Why? Because 90% of the instructors are liberals and because you do as you're told at that age.
If you live on the West and East coast, College is hardly your first "exposure" to liberal attitudes. And if I'm not mistaken, most of the states on the West and East coast are more populated than the states in Middle America.

Plus, the big cities in Middle America tend to be liberal, and are also the most heavily populated areas in those states. So no, it is not most people's first “exposure” to liberal attitudes.

Furthermore, if 90% of instructors are liberal that says something very good about liberalism. College professors have to be up-to-date on current information, are challenged by colleagues, and put under a very large microscope. Plus, they are educated and many are experts in their field. So if we have experts from all different aspects of academia (math, English, science, art etc.) who all believe in liberal ideas, I'd say that's a pretty good indication that liberal view-points are far more researched and supported with fact.

In other words, you're gullible as hell during this time of your life and cling to the opinions of strangers like they're some kinda gods who know secrets you're just now hearing. That's not all bad... it gives you the chance to look at the world from a semi-adult viewpoint, which you've never experienced before.
I challenge you to find the average age of the Democratic senators – because what I think you’ll find is that most Democratic senators are middle-aged or older, meaning liberal attitudes don’t suddenly disappear when you grow older.

But trust me... once you get out on your own and pay your own way for a few years and sign up for a 30 year mortgage and experience life away from mammy and pappy, your political views will probably change. That's the way life happens. You're born... you're schooled... you work, you die. What you learn in school is important, but it's far from the most important thing you'll ever experience.

20-something liberals are the norm... 30-something liberals are holding on to their youthful ideals nearly as furiously as they're trying to hold onto their hair... 40+ liberals are just plain whiney ole misfits who never figured out the purpose of their lives. I can give you an example of each age group from Allforums alone... but for the sake of congeniality, I'll refrain.

;)
SMW
Conservatives also have another method of trying to discredit liberalism -- without actually having to factually discredit it. But who can blame them when the facts and academic world doesn't support their viewpoints?

Anyway, they say you become "conservative" as you get older, as to try and discredit liberalism as another “fad” and “phase” you have with being young.

Well that may be true with your ACTIONS as you age, but not with your BELIEFS. Conservatives tend to confuse the two. For instance, you can be Pro-Choice (IE: your attitude/mentality), but would never actually get an abortion (IE: your personal actions).

So yes, our actions change as we get older. For instance, you don’t party as much, or take as many risks, and you may become more religious and settle down in your home. But your beliefs on political issues don’t change.

The bottom line is that the mentality stays, the actions don’t. BTW, I know plenty of middle aged and older people who are for raising taxes. And they’ve worked for decades, have a mortgage, and bills to pay.

And sure, there are more young people who align themselves with the Democratic party. But there are more registered Democrats than Republicans TOTAL. Meaning both parties probably have the same amount of middle-aged and senior citizens who are registered with them, it just so happens Republicans don’t have the youth base the Democrats have.

to touch on SMW's post, i'm doing a research paper on some convincing evidence of adolescent and young adult body image being influenced by the media. I would say this is proof that they indeed.. do what they are told, whether it be directly or indirectly.
That's bullshit. Or rather, it's bullshit to say that young people are MORE influenced by the media than "grown-ups". Everyone is influenced by the media. However, I really resent the condescending tone in which I'm told over and over that I, along with other young people, "do what I'm told" to do by the media. Adults' body images are also affected by the media. I can't tell you how many times my step-mom has seen a skinny celebrity on TV and announced that she needed to lose weight, or how many times my dad has vowed to quit eating ice cream after seeing a Bowflex commercial.

Sorry if you become offended, DarkFantasy but young people are more affected by the media than older people. Just look at how so many young people dress alike. Not all young people are influenced by the media but enough are so that an entire industry has arisen just to play to that influence.

Sorry if you become offended, DarkFantasy but young people are more affected by the media than older people. Just look at how so many young people dress alike. Not all young people are influenced by the media but enough are so that an entire industry has arisen just to play to that influence.
Maybe we dress alike because we buy mass manufactured clothing... Sorry I can't afford to buy clothes that 100,000 other people haven't also bought. :rolleyes:

Nah! You dress alike because you are sheep. Baaaaaaaa!:banana: