Want to stay married? Go Atheist.

U.S. divorce rates: for various faith groups, age groups and geographical areas (http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_dira.htm) — This sort of discovery should irk a few people but should not surprise the religious who often say, “only sinners go to church.”

Barna’s results verified findings of earlier polls: that conservative Protestant Christians, on average, have the highest divorce rate, while mainline Christians have a much lower rate. They found some new information as well: that atheists and agnostics have the lowest divorce rate of all. George Barna commented that the results raise “questions regarding the effectiveness of how churches minister to families.” The data challenge “the idea that churches provide truly practical and life-changing support for marriage.”

Donald Hughes, author of The Divorce Reality, said: “In the churches, people have a superstitious view that Christianity will keep them from divorce, but they are subject to the same problems as everyone else, and they include a lack of relationship skills. …Just being born again is not a rabbit’s foot.”

Hughes claim that 90% of divorces among born-again couples occur after they have been “saved.”

Link (http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=10851)

Hughes claim that 90% of divorces among born-again couples occur after they have been “saved.”Maybe one is more "saved" than the other. :)

Considering that there are far more Christians in the U.S. than any other faith, and especially more than atheists/agnostics, I wonder if the results are actually accurate. Perhaps atheists/agnostics just tend to be more educated and more willing to work through their problems (maybe by seeing a therapist) due to their more "sophisticated" upbringing. Or something like that. :p

Considering that there are far more Christians in the U.S. than any other faith, and especially more than atheists/agnostics, I wonder if the results are actually accurate. Perhaps atheists/agnostics just tend to be more educated and more willing to work through their problems (maybe by seeing a therapist) due to their more "sophisticated" upbringing. Or something like that. :pI don't have the stats to hand but I understand that divorce (as well as drug use and teenage pregnancy) is lower in the generally non-religious countries of Western Europe than in the largely Christian USA.

Possible reasons that occur to me are:
the non-religious often live together for a few years and make sure they are compatible before tying the knot. Strict Christians, however, might get married in a heated rush so that they can have sex
the non-religious do not believe in authorative morality handed down from on high. Instead they author their own morals and so have more ownership of them
religious people have stronger communities and so are exposed to more temptation

Maybe Americans are just dumb. :p

Also, as far as drug use, I think our strict drug laws contribute to the high rates of drug use... Although I think that there's something cultural about our high rates of alcoholism and drug use, and more lax laws about them might not change anything.

And teen pregnancy, yeah we can blame that on Christianity. Not that the teens who get pregnant are especially devout, just that the sex education in this country is horrible. Many states teach abstinence-only sex ed (advocated by Christian parents and legislators), and therefore millions of teens are never given any knowledge about condoms or birth control.

The divorce rate, however, I believe is more cultural than religious. There's something about Americans... :p

the non-religious often live together for a few years and make sure they are compatible before tying the knot. Strict Christians, however, might get married in a heated rush so that they can have sex

Was gonna suggest that, I'd say its a pretty obvious reason. Know many Christians who are just too eager to get married. Abstinence teaching has many downsides, this is definitely one. Teenage pregnancy is another.

Meh, religion does so much weird stuff to people...

Was gonna suggest that, I'd say its a pretty obvious reason. Know many Christians who are just too eager to get married. Abstinence teaching has many downsides, this is definitely one. Teenage pregnancy is another.

Meh, religion does so much weird stuff to people...
My boyfriend is a fairly devout Episcopalian, but we are planning to move in together before getting married. We both assumed that we would do so, no discussion was even needed. Although Episcopalians are far more reasonable than members of many other religions. They have female ministers and many congregations have allowed gay wedding ceremonies. I'd also be willing to bet that they're not the ones advocated abstinence-only sex ed either...

My boyfriend is a fairly devout Episcopalian, but we are planning to move in together before getting married. We both assumed that we would do so, no discussion was even needed. Although Episcopalians are far more reasonable than members of many other religions. They have female ministers and many congregations have allowed gay wedding ceremonies. I'd also be willing to bet that they're not the ones advocated abstinence-only sex ed either...

I thought abstinence education was government funded in many states...
Maybe Penn & Teller isn't the most reliable of sources :)
They are funny tho...

I thought abstinence education was government funded in many states...
You thought right. Everything taught in schools is funded by the government. Abstinence education is a pretty big controversy over here.

You thought right. Everything taught in schools is funded by the government. Abstinence education is a pretty big controversy over here.

Yeah, kinda picked up on that. Seen some statistics showing it has the opposite effect.

Yeah, kinda picked up on that. Seen some statistics showing it has the opposite effect.
Oh definitely. Abstinence education is completely ineffective... States that implement it tend to be those with the highest teen pregnancy rates.

Oh definitely. Abstinence education is completely ineffective... States that implement it tend to be those with the highest teen pregnancy rates.

Which, as a former teenager, makes perfectly sense :)

marriage is a religious institution, why would any atheist bother?

what is the marriage rate among atheists compared to conservative Christians?:matrix:

marriage is a religious institution
No, it's very clearly a legal institution. People are married in courthouses all the time.

No, it's very clearly a legal institution. People are married in courthouses all the time.

We should keep marriage out of the court house. Just sign some paperwork, that should do the trick.

A simple piece of paper saying so and so is willing to give his medical benefits to whos her face. That would make gay marriage easier at least and the radical atheist can get one step closer to separating church and state.

A simple piece of paper saying so and so is willing to give his medical benefits to whos her face. That would make gay marriage easier at least and the radical atheist can get one step closer to separating church and state.
That's a little disrespectful... Marriage means a lot to people who aren't religious too, you know.

No, it's very clearly a legal institution. People are married in courthouses all the time.
this legal secretary i use to violate the laws of god and man with said it best (though i doubt first)-"a Marriage License has become nothing more that a license to sue".

That's a little disrespectful... Marriage means a lot to people who aren't religious too, you know.

I'm not trying to be disrespectful. Just thinking of the logical aspect.

Why not narrow down what importance has to the person getting married?

I'm sure some gay people would like a marriage under a chapel, but looking at it from the Rosie O'Donnel perspective, wherein she really doesn't like Christians because of the grief she has recieved. I'd say if all she really wants is to pass on her inheritance and make sure her wife is there in the hospital with her when she gets sick. Then a piece of paper would work just the same.

They can make a new tradition, why stick with traditions that only troubled you for being who you are in the first place?

Maybe because marriage isn't a Christian institution.

Marriage means committing yourself to being with a person for the rest of your life. It's important whether you're Christian or atheist, gay or straight.

Maybe because marriage isn't a Christian institution.

It's become one, so technically, it is. Christmas wasn't Christian either, now look where we are. People saying Happy Holidays just to avoid saying Merry Christmas. Come on.
Besides the marriage you're talking about, has in modern marriage wasn't born of Christianity. That doesn't mean Christianity didn't have some type of marriage ritual. What we know today has simply taken its place.

Marriage means committing yourself to being with a person for the rest of your life. It's important whether you're Christian or atheist, gay or straight.

I'm not trying to say it isn't important. I'm saying, make it important to you or to the individual. Whats the importance of sticking with a traditional Christian marriage when you dont want anything to do with Christianity to begin with?

Just make that deceleration in a way that not only shows how important it is but shows why it's important to you.

To do that, all you would need is a piece of paper saying, youre married. The tradition you use to usher in the happy couples alliance can be more meaningful if its a tradition thats important and insightful to the people getting married.

Wouldn't you think?

I'm not trying to say it isn't important. I'm saying, make it important to you or to the individual. Whats the importance of sticking with a traditional Christian marriage when you dont want anything to do with Christianity to begin with?

Just make that deceleration in a way that not only shows how important it is but shows why it's important to you.

To do that, all you would need is a piece of paper saying, youre married. The tradition you use to usher in the happy couples alliance can be more meaningful if its a tradition thats important and insightful to the people getting married.

Wouldn't you think?
Of course. I agree with your original premise completely, I just thought you phrased things a little disrespectfully.

It's become one, so technically, it is.
Well, guess you need to call all the Moslems, all the Jews, all the Buddhists, all the Hindus, and tell them they're performing heathen acts against their religion then. :rolleyes:

Of course. I agree with your original premise completely, I just thought you phrased things a little disrespectfully.


Oh, sorry.

To do that, all you would need is a piece of paper saying, youre married. The tradition you use to usher in the happy couples alliance can be more meaningful if its a tradition thats important and insightful to the people getting married.

Wouldn't you think?Acts of ceremony are important to us to make things seem real and important. Just signing a piece of paper would be attractive only to those marrying for administrative reasons such as to save on taxes or to get someone into the country (nothing wrong with either if a couple is struggling for money or a partner risks deportation).

Link (http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=10851)

maybe it is because people from strict christina families or those "saved" later in life feel real guilty about having sex, or wanting to have sexmore often than they think they should, or what they are thinking or saying while having sex.

what do christians say anyway? "oh fornicate me, oh fornicate me!"?

Acts of ceremony are important to us to make things seem real and important. Just signing a piece of paper would be attractive only to those marrying for administrative reasons such as to save on taxes or to get someone into the country (nothing wrong with either if a couple is struggling for money or a partner risks deportation).
I can see it now, Christians claiming "importance" as their idea.

It's become one, so technically, it is. Christmas wasn't Christian either, now look where we are. People saying Happy Holidays just to avoid saying Merry Christmas. Come on.


Hi, you and i butt heads on religious issues all the time. But on this Holiday issue, I am FOR the Christians. No sarcasm. I am not christian but I get annoyed when people say Happy Holidays instead of Merry Christmas. I say Merry Christmas! GIVE THE CHRISTIANS "THIS" HOLIDAY FOR GOD SAKES!! I am serious - no sarcasm or jokes or attacks.

Even people in non-christian countries celebrate christmas because it is so much FUN! So, MERRY CHRISTMAS to you all from one of the biggest anti-religious people here. If that makes any sense.

Well, guess you need to call all the Moslems, all the Jews, all the Buddhists, all the Hindus, and tell them they're performing heathen acts against their religion then. :rolleyes:

Well he said marriage is a "religious" thing, he did not say it is a "christian" thing. But sure, there are indeed people out there who think marriage is a "christian" thing..

Christians have certainly made it their thing and there is a whole lot of theology around it. If I decide to get married, I would like a beautiful ceremony, but don't want anything religious with it.

Hi, you and i butt heads on religious issues all the time. But on this Holiday issue, I am FOR the Christians. No sarcasm. I am not christian but I get annoyed when people say Happy Holidays instead of Merry Christmas. I say Merry Christmas! GIVE THE CHRISTIANS "THIS" HOLIDAY FOR GOD SAKES!! I am serious - no sarcasm or jokes or attacks.

Even people in non-christian countries celebrate christmas because it is so much FUN! So, MERRY CHRISTMAS to you all from one of the biggest anti-religious people here. If that makes any sense.


To be completely honest, the only thing that bothers me about it is the complication people put into it.

No ones messing with Easter, so we're good. At least not now, but one day, maybe some day soon, someone will want to remove the bunny and call it a summer holiday. Or spring, whatever..

Kind of makes you wonder where they came up with this stuff.
:Christ is reborn on the 3rd day, what are we going to do?
I know! We'll hide eggs and make kids look for them.
:Hmm, OK but where did the eggs come from?
I dont know about you, but I like bunnies! They're cute and cuddly.
:Eggs from a bunny? What the hell... Eggs from a bunny it is!
What about Christmas?
:We'll dress up some fat guy with gifts for the kids.
Why a fat guy? and where did the gifts come from?
:Fat guys are funny, kids will love em! and the gifts, errr... They came from the fat guys elf friends!
O.K. We have elves and a fat guy with gifts, how is the fat guy going to get the gifts to everyone?
:Well, reindeer are kinda cool, how about magical flying reindeer?
Holy Crap! That sounds more Christian then anything I've ever heard! We'll say he has a magic sled with 8 tiny flying reindeer.
Now how will the fat guy get the gifts in the house?
:Well, everyone has a chimney, right?
Yeah, thats true.
:We can say the fat guy goes down the chimney and into the house!
You! Are! Brilliant!

Merry Christmas!
Man, I hope no one gets offended over the fact that Christians have this holiday... We're going to have to call it something else then.

Merry Christmas!
Man, I hope no one gets offended over the fact that Christians have this holiday... We're going to have to call it something else then.
I never understood why everyone gets worked up into such a froth over the whole Christmas debacle, both Christians and non-Christians. Both groups need to remember that it's a bloody pagan holiday, not a Christian holiday, so just STFU about it.

On the other hand, Christmas is a consumerist frenzy and I try to participate as little as possible. I do my shopping online, etc.

I think its cool because the family gets together and everyone has a good time.
People worried over what it is, why? When everyone celebrates it.

I hate shopping and big crowds, love my visa card and a quick Google search.

I say Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays interchangeably... Whatever sounds good to say at that moment. Kinda like the difference between hi and hello for me. Although I'd say in my house we're more partial to "Happy Holidays", because we celebrate both Christmas and Hanukkah. :)

Marriage means committing yourself to being with a person for the rest of your life. It's important whether you're Christian or atheist, gay or straight.

yes. it is for financial survival and heirs. BEFORE the 1800's it was very common for married couples to have lovers. it was accepted and expected.
there is a quote, not verbatim, but it says basicly, "love" will be the death of marriage. in reference to people falling in love, getting married and expected to never have sex with anyone else but the person they are married to. and today's divorce rate is , in america, about 50% now?
people think "love" will keep them wanting to sex up the spouse, then they get bored no matter what happens or what they do. so, you either expect to have very little sex, or none at all and stay married. or one spouse just isn't into sex as much as the other. USUALLY the female. this is common. UNTIL the man gets older, he starts to naturally lose testosterone, and thus natrually loses interest. as women get older, USUALLY as they get near menopause and the body is screaming to get laid, then they are the ones who want it more.
natures joke on humanity. especially for those of a culture who frown upon married people having a lover.
or you might hear this one guys one day, "take the viagra and do me now, or i file a divorce and take everything!!!!!!" from a woman who looks like the granny pic from another thread.