The story of a school (http://goleft.tv/view.asp?v=524) that uses electric shock to punish students.

.

Woah... lea morris turtle is kinda hot... agree?

At first blush this video seems to document cruel and unecessary punishment of children and adults. However, when you listen closely to the entire video and if you have any background in working with severly retarded and autistic children and adults you understand both the rational and efficacy of such treatments.

You have to remember that these children and adults are not the same as children and adults you see in the general population. They are not even the same as retarded and autistic children and adults you see in the general population or even in your average mental health facilities.

My mother and two uncles worked at Pilgrim State Hospital, at one time the largest hospital of any kind in the world and until its closing the largest mental health hospital that had ever existed. An aunt and another uncle worked at King's Park Psychiatric Center another large mental hospital. I have a Master's Degree in Special Education and spent quite a few years working with mentally handicapped and autistic children and adults. While they were not as severely affected by their disabilities as the residents of this school they did often exhibit self destructive behaviors. We worked with people who had to wear helmits because they constantly hit their heads against walls and posts, people who actually had bitten off fingers in sessions of self destructive behavior and had to wear thick mittens and have cardboard tube over their elbows so that they could not bend them to get their hands into their mouths. We worked with people who ate anything they could get into their mouths including sharp objects and even their own feces.

While these children and adults were in the minority in our program and were severely handicapped they were seemingly not as handicapped as the students attending the facility in question. The residents there are so severely handicapped that they cannot be released into the general population except for short periods of time and even then not without their shock transmitters.

Extreme aversive correction sounds horrid, especially to the lay person but it is sometimes necessary in order to correct something even worse. I am sure that the staff does not go around shocking students for the sheer pleasure of it but uses the shock generators only to stop self destructive or other person directed destructive behavior.

The fact that some residents of the facility have been there for years and even decades tends to show just how severely handicapped they are. They are so handicapped that they cannot be released to their homes or even to other facilities.

Yes, shock correction seems horrible but how horrible is it when compared to a student who exhibits such self destructive behavior that he is in danger of killing himself? I say he because the vast majority of these children and adults are male.


The fact that an investigative panel consisting of three psychologists and two other persons, seemingly lay people, did not like what they found does not really carry that much weight. In order to be a psychologist all one needs is a Master's Degree. The school is run by a psychiatrist, someone with a doctor's MD degree in addition to training in the field of mental health.

Before jumping to conclusions it would be necessary to actually know what type of population the school is dealing with and how successful any other therapies have been.

Extreme aversive correction sounds horrid, especially to the lay person but it is sometimes necessary in order to correct something even worse. I am sure that the staff does not go around shocking students for the sheer pleasure of it but uses the shock generators only to stop self destructive or other person directed destructive behavior.
I will agree with this statement, in general. But I must quickly add that while working on my undergraduate degree in psychology/clinical, I could not help but be bothered by some of the notions and techniques that can only be described as freaking medieval.

Much has changed in the world of medicine, both in the physical and mental specialties, but we're still growing, as they say. (It wasn't so long ago that medical doctors wouldn't work with an AIDS patient without wearing some gitup out of a Crichton movie!)

And constant vigilance is always needed; How terrible would it be to learn that an overworked, burned-out staffer with a saditsic urge after being jilted by his old lady went cop on these patients! (Btw, I expect this will bring comparisons from the support-the-tasering-cops-at-all-cost crowd. So, cinch up your belt and get ready!:cool: )

Those who have spent any significant amount of time working with the MR / DD (mentally retarded / developmentally disabled) populace would understand the utilization of these types of products. In my years I have worked with some individuals who were so profoundly detached from their surroundings they were unable to respond to a 120 decible fire alarm. Agreed, at first blush it does seem barbaric, but the alternative may even be more so - physically restraining someone can lead to injuries to both those being restrained and those doing the restraining. Many facilities caring for these people forbid the use of "mechanical" restraints - i.e. straitjackets, wrist & leg restraints - meaning the staff must do "hands on" until the individual has calmed enough to be returned to previous activities.

es347fan,

Your post illustrates part of the problem with people like the two in the video jumping to conclusions. Both you and I have worked with profoundly retarded individuals and realize that while aversive shock treatment might seem cruel it is sometimes a better alternative than physical restraint.

Woah... lea morris turtle is kinda hot... agree?

Yes, definitely.

no i mean she really is... i mean hot... i would like to get her in a bathtub full of jello

Electric shock, huh? ...Kinky. :thumbs: