Back in the stone age when I was younger, one had to be 21 to vote and 18 to purchase alcohol (in some states). It was quite the eye-opener (for me & countless others) when I was in transit to my second tour in Vietnam that I could not buy a cold beer in the Seattle-Tacoma airport.
Some years later the voting age was lowered to 18 but one had to be 21 to purchase alcohol.

It appears that issue (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20249460/)is coming around again. It would seem that many are realizing the futility of attempting to place an age limit on the purchase of alcohol when so many states have varying rules on consumption.


:drinktoth

I think the drinking age and voting age should both be 18. :)

I do not support lowering the drinking age to 18 for anyone except American soldiers. If you volunteer to possibly take a bullet then you should be able to have a beer.

Just my opinion.

I think if your old enough to vote,serve your country,buy ciggarettes,have credit in your name ect.... you should beable to purchace and consume alcohol. I think they made it 21 to serve as a buffer for those trying too early... usually 18-20 year olds have a bar they can get into. I know I did.

But if the age is 18 then what? we have older looking 15-17 year olds trying to get in? What happends in a bar if a 21plus man accidently picks up a older looking 16 year old... dum dum dum.... 16 can get you 20.....

On the other end of the spectrum we have cities like this one:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070814/ap_on_el_st_lo/prohibition_vote;_ylt=AiilHog_v9bCVyrTKhd0jPJI2ocA

I think if your old enough to vote,serve your country,buy ciggarettes,have credit in your name ect.... you should beable to purchace and consume alcohol. I think they made it 21 to serve as a buffer for those trying too early... usually 18-20 year olds have a bar they can get into. I know I did.

But if the age is 18 then what? we have older looking 15-17 year olds trying to get in? What happends in a bar if a 21plus man accidently picks up a older looking 16 year old... dum dum dum.... 16 can get you 20.....
Plenty of 15-17 year olds can look 21 too. I can easily pass for 21.

No way!

On the other end of the spectrum we have cities like this one:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070814/ap_on_el_st_lo/prohibition_vote;_ylt=AiilHog_v9bCVyrTKhd0jPJI2ocA

Just have to love those intolerant bible thumpers.


:drinktoth

I think I'm in the minority, but I think the drinking age should be lowered to 18. I have 3 boys, only 1 old enough to legally drink. When he goes out with his friends they always have a DD or they stay the night where they are drinking.
My middle son will be 21 the day before Thanksgiving, the biggest bar night of the year (oh joy). He drinks, as do the majority of his friends.
My youngest son is 19, he also drinks and has an MIP to prove it, which has cost him a lot of money.
My kids are up front with us about their drinking and they know to call us if they have been drinking and need a ride home. When we tell them to cool it on the drinking, they do.

The kids can vote, join the service, go to war, they should be allowed to purchase and drink alcohol.

Lower it to 18. Legalize all other presently illegal drugs and set their ages at 18 as well.

On the other end of the spectrum we have cities like this one:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070814/ap_on_el_st_lo/prohibition_vote;_ylt=AiilHog_v9bCVyrTKhd0jPJI2ocA
The next town to the south of us is a dry town. We lived there for 2 years before we moved here. I guess it might be inconvenient but it really means just having to drive 5 miles to get some beer instead of 1 mile...

The next town to the south of us is a dry town. We lived there for 2 years before we moved here. I guess it might be inconvenient but it really means just having to drive 5 miles to get some beer instead of 1 mile...

I encountered that same situation while stationed at Fort Hood, TX many years ago. If not purchasing alcohol on base, one had to drive roughly 11 miles to get to another town where it was sold. That often meant buying even more booze - enough to get home on & have some left over - frequently resulting in more drunks being behind the wheel than might have occured otherwise.


:drinktoth

The next town to the south of us is a dry town. We lived there for 2 years before we moved here. I guess it might be inconvenient but it really means just having to drive 5 miles to get some beer instead of 1 mile...


Dry town? Does that mean you cant buy alcohol at all? Are there bars/clubs in this town?? Oh my i cant imagine that.... In my city you can go into a gas station and buy a single can of beer. up untill a few years ago I believe the passenger of a vehicle was allowed to drink. There is an "open container" low now but the fine is smallish. You can buy cases of beer in grocery store.

Before moving here i lived in another part of the country.Liquor stores are open 24/7.... BUT you cant buy beer except at "beer distribitors" and they are open mon-thursday 12pm-7pm Friday they are open Friday 1pm -6pm... Sat and sun closed. If your lucky you can get a six pack from a bar,,,,but your going to pay about 10 bucks......

Doesnt make much sence to me why beer is regulated yet liquor is freely bought.

Yep, the town doesn't sell alcohol at all. It's a pretty tiny town so there are no nightclubs/bars and there probably wouldn't be even if it were legal. In the county that town is in (we're in another county now), all liquor stores are run by the county government. Keeps prices down, competition low, and gives the government some good revenue.

Keeps...competition low
Exactly why this is an awful idea.

I'm sure there are many responsible 18 year olds in the world, but as with everything else in life you are held accountable to the behavior of the worst in your group.

There are people who don't litter but still have to pay the deposit on a bottle, there are considerate smokers who lost their priveleges because of the a-holes, there are good 19 year old drivers who still pay age-based auto insurance rates, etc....

As long as enough 18 year olds are not responsible enough to have drinking and driving priveleges simultaneously, none of them will.
That's just how it works.

Exactly why this is an awful idea.
Why? Having county-run liquor stores results in extremely cheap liquor for me! :D

I'm sure there are many responsible 18 year olds in the world, but as with everything else in life you are held accountable to the behavior of the worst in your group.

There are people who don't litter but still have to pay the deposit on a bottle, there are considerate smokers who lost their priveleges because of the a-holes, there are good 19 year old drivers who still pay age-based auto insurance rates, etc....

As long as enough 18 year olds are not responsible enough to have drinking and driving priveleges simultaneously, none of them will.
That's just how it works.
Or not. How many 40 year olds have been arrested for DUI, yet still are allowed to drink?

Why? Having county-run liquor stores results in extremely cheap liquor for me! :D
Not for you, considering that you can't buy liquor for another four years. And no, free market competition results in cheap anything.

I'm for lowering the drinking age, but I would take a more European approach and lower it to 14 or 15 (i.e. learn how to drink responsibly before you can drive). 18's a bad age because it's an age where kids become independant of their parents. I don't think kids should be introduced to alcohol right when they are deprived adult guidance.

Not for you, considering that you can't buy liquor for another four years. And no, free market competition results in cheap anything.
I don't see how the liquor could possibly be any cheaper... Go into DC (especially) or over into Howard County and it's much more expensive!

I don't see how the liquor could possibly be any cheaper... Go into DC (especially) or over into Howard County and it's much more expensive!
What are the relative liquor taxes in these counties? You are assuming a cause from an effect.

I'm for lowering the drinking age, but I would take a more European approach and lower it to 14 or 15 (i.e. learn how to drink responsibly before you can drive).
I'm going back and forth on this one. I drank when I was 14-15 and so did most of my friends. I'm now 17 and although I still don't have my driver's license (I have a phobia of driving), but I believe that I know how to drink responsibly now. At least as responsibly as most of my over-21 friends.

What are the relative liquor taxes in these counties? You are assuming a cause from an effect.
Okay, okay, jeez. I have no fucking clue about the liquor taxes anywhere. I was just saying that in Montgomery County all the liquor stores are run by the county. I didn't know that would start an argument... sorry...

Okay, okay, jeez. I have no fucking clue about the liquor taxes anywhere. I was just saying that in Montgomery County all the liquor stores are run by the county. I didn't know that would start an argument... sorry...
Well, you are advocating socialized liquor stores. You should know me well enough to know what vitriol socialized anything raises in me.

Well, you are advocating socialized liquor stores. You should know me well enough to know what vitriol socialized anything raises in me.
I don't know that I'm advocating anything... I think you just assumed that. I don't know enough about it to know if it's the best idea.

I don't know that I'm advocating anything... I think you just assumed that. I don't know enough about it to know if it's the best idea.
Fair enough.

Haha. In my town, at 15 even, you can walk into a gas station, buy a handle of vodka, and they'll even give you ice and a plastic cup!

there are good 19 year old drivers who still pay age-based auto insurance rates, etc....
I hate to double-respond, but it just occurred to me that I'm a 19 year old driver and I only pay a $491 premium per six months. So I guess this isn't universal.

Haha. In my town, at 15 even, you can walk into a gas station, buy a handle of vodka, and they'll even give you ice and a plastic cup!
That's because you live with the uncivilized jungle people. :D

I'm for lowering the drinking age, but I would take a more European approach and lower it to 14 or 15 (i.e. learn how to drink responsibly before you can drive). 18's a bad age because it's an age where kids become independant of their parents. I don't think kids should be introduced to alcohol right when they are deprived adult guidance.Good point. I was in Spain for several years and their cultural distinctives re alcohol were much more open than ours, and alcohol related problems appeared, from where I stood, far fewer.

The point about being relatively free and 18 and opened up to alcohol is also a good one.

Check that out, Leper! I totally agree with you on this.:drinktoth

I'm going back and forth on this one. I drank when I was 14-15 and so did most of my friends. I'm now 17 and although I still don't have my driver's license (I have a phobia of driving), but I believe that I know how to drink responsibly now. At least as responsibly as most of my over-21 friends.

I had a similar experience. I started drinking when I was 13 (I know - too young). But most of the kids I knew who started drinking in college did so in an irresponsible manner. In the meantime, I knew my limits and didn't do anything particularly stupid, unlike many other people I knew.

What would be best is if parents became more open to their kids drinking with them (after all, drinking is legal in the presence of your parent/guardian).

Okay, okay, jeez. I have no fucking clue about the liquor taxes anywhere. I was just saying that in Montgomery County all the liquor stores are run by the county. I didn't know that would start an argument... sorry...


LOL... I think all borg hunter was trying to say was areas where liquor stores are free to govern themselves should yield a cheaper product than government ran liquor stores.

I had a similar experience. I started drinking when I was 13 (I know - too young). But most of the kids I knew who started drinking in college did so in an irresponsible manner. In the meantime, I knew my limits and didn't do anything particularly stupid, unlike many other people I knew.

What would be best is if parents became more open to their kids drinking with them (after all, drinking is legal in the presence of your parent/guardian).
The first beer I had came on my 17th birthday, with my dad. I consider myself a very responsible drinker today.

The drinking age in Canada is 19. Living in Michigan, quite a few of our kids go over the bridge to Canada when they turn 19.

What would be best is if parents became more open to their kids drinking with them (after all, drinking is legal in the presence of your parent/guardian).
Is it really?

Is it really?
In some localities, not all.

Is it really?
It is in Texas.

Lower it to 18. Legalize all other presently illegal drugs and set their ages at 18 as well.

Exactly!

Good point. I was in Spain for several years and their cultural distinctives re alcohol were much more open than ours, and alcohol related problems appeared, from where I stood, far fewer.

Yep. It's hard to get around the fact that Europeans have a much healthier attitude toward alcohol than Americans.

I'm not sure how much of that fact has to do with their drinking laws, but I think that the laws have at least something to do with it.


Check that out, Leper! I totally agree with you on this.:drinktoth

Well, you're much more rational when you're not talking about snake-shooting cops :)

I pretty sure in houston if your at home drinking and your parents are present and give consent you can drink under age.... I do not think it applies to say going to the bar with your parent. Alot of bars dont let people under 21 in period. I am not sure.

Is it really?

Sorry, I should specify I'm talking about Texas. I can't say for other states, but I suspect that's a common exception.

EDIT: Did a quick check on MD law, and it's not an exception there. Sorry Dark!

I pretty sure in houston if your at home drinking and your parents are present and give consent you can drink under age.... I do not think it applies to say going to the bar with your parent. Alot of bars dont let people under 21 in period. I am not sure.


It applies everywhere in Texas where an adult can drink. But that doesn't mean bars/restaurants can't refuse to serve someone under 21, regardless of parental consent. Normal parental standards still apply of course (e.g. getting your kids stinking drunk may still be regarded as endangering your child).

I pretty sure in houston if your at home drinking and your parents are present and give consent you can drink under age.... I do not think it applies to say going to the bar with your parent. Alot of bars dont let people under 21 in period. I am not sure.


Same thing in Michigan. If a parent gives consent for their child to drink but the parent isn't present, that's not ok

Or not. How many 40 year olds have been arrested for DUI, yet still are allowed to drink?The there is a disproportionate concentration of DWI deaths and accidents below the age of 21.

"Young men ages 18 to 20 (under the legal drinking age) reported driving while impaired almost as frequently as men ages 21 to 34 (Liu 1997)."
http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:TulHnQVojzYJ:www.yaerd.org/riskfactors.html+shults+dui+age+18&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=7&gl=us


By just eliminating those three years of drinking a very large number of fatal auto accidents can be eliminated.

Could some 18 year olds be responsible? Of course.
But sometimes the babies get thrown out with the bathwater.

Well, you're much more rational when you're not talking about snake-shooting cops :)
Did you mean kid-shooting cops?:-)

The there is a disproportionate concentration of DWI deaths and accidents below the age of 21.

"Young men ages 18 to 20 (under the legal drinking age) reported driving while impaired almost as frequently as men ages 21 to 34 (Liu 1997)."
http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:TulHnQVojzYJ:www.yaerd.org/riskfactors.html+shults+dui+age+18&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=7&gl=us


By just eliminating those three years of drinking a very large number of fatal auto accidents can be eliminated.

Could some 18 year olds be responsible? Of course.
But sometimes the babies get thrown out with the bathwater.
And this is with the drinking age at 21? Boy! Doesn't seem to be working much, does it?

And this is with the drinking age at 21? Boy! Doesn't seem to be working much, does it?I don't get it.

And this is with the drinking age at 21? Boy! Doesn't seem to be working much, does it?

I say RAISE the drinking Bar.
Cuz this hears 'Ol man,can drink You et al. under the table.
I oughta bees able.
Spent enough practicin to actually Buy me own small Jet.