I have started going to a church in my area, and I have to say, in spite of all the naysayers,it is not full of scared, ignorant people shuffling through life like zombies. In fact, it is full upbeat, polite, nice, intelligent people. Everyone from doctors down to those living in group homes. I go in on Saturday mornings to help feed the poor and we also give out about 4 days worth of food for them to take home, as well as free cloths. We are sending missions to Africa and Mexico to rebuild houses. we have built a hope house for abused single mothers and even have a ministry to fix up cars that members have donated for the single mothers to have. Every time I go I wonder how it is that the Freethinkers of the world have such a warped, twisted idea of what goes on at a church or in religion in general. It leads me to believe that it must be personel more then based on any sort of evidence. Because you would have a hard time coming to the conclusions that Freethinker and afinertouch have just from attending my church. In fact, you would come away with the exact opposite conclusion, as I have. And at one time I used to think along the same lines as thosew two, although not with so much venom

Nice post, Trav. I'm with you on this one... have never understood what it is about Christians that seems to scare the pants off of atheists?

Couldn't be that guilty conscience, could it?

:)
SMW

Good for you, Trav. Nice post.

:)
Kimi

Nice post, Trav. I'm with you on this one... have never understood what it is about Christians that seems to scare the pants off of atheists?

If you think atheists are "scared", you haven't made an effort to understand.


Couldn't be that guilty conscience, could it?

Not likely. :)

I have started going to a church in my area
Is this a new occurrence? Have you all this time you've spoken about church when you didn't even go to church?
Every time I go I wonder how it is that the Freethinkers of the world have such a warped, twisted idea of what goes on at a church or in religion in general.
A church service consists of prayer, music, and preaching usually. FT, VP, Blib, Blob, and I know that---where is our twisted idea?
It leads me to believe that it must be personel more then based on any sort of evidence. Because you would have a hard time coming to the conclusions that Freethinker and afinertouch have just from attending my church. In fact, you would come away with the exact opposite conclusion, as I have.
I've attended churches that give their time and effort for the same services your church does. Doctors, lawyers, as well as clerks and janitors attend my church. I still am opposed to organized religion because of the faith-based dogma.

The fact that almsgiving occurs in Christianity, Islam, and other religions isn't going to make me drop everything and start praying. It's just going to make me feel better about humanity's desire and ability to help one another.

Nice post, Trav. I'm with you on this one... have never understood what it is about Christians that seems to scare the pants off of atheists?
I'm an atheist and I have no "fear" of Christians or Christianity. Why would I fear a religion? To each his own.

I fear attempts to merge government with religion, but that's a different story, and one I can agree with a lot of Christians on.
Couldn't be that guilty conscience, could it?
While I'm sure it would be satisfying to you, with your obvious hatred (or fear?) of atheists and atheism, to believe atheists constantly guilty, I'm afraid you are mistaken. I have no reason to be ashamed or guilty of my lack of religion.

If you think atheists are "scared", you haven't made an effort to understand.



Not likely. :)

Oh, I think I've made an effort alright, Vile. I've never been around as many atheists as Allforums attracts, so actually, I have tried to understand what it is 'they' (or should I say 'you') hate so much about Christians... but never got a straight answer. Still haven't.

I can understand not liking Fundamentalists -- I avoid them myself. However the GREAT MAJORITY of Christians aren't looking to push their religion on anybody. Like Trav said, they work quietly among themselves in an effort to improve the lot of their fellow human beings. Doesn't seem very threatening to me.

Just can't see where that type of person deserves to have people like FT going around making fun of Jesus, calling believers names and ridiculing those who believe. Or, for that matter, people like YOU going around defending his actions.

Maybe you could fill us in on that question, dumplin?

What is it about Christians that makes y'all so angry?

:)
SMW

Oh, I think I've made an effort alright, Vile. I've never been around as many atheists as Allforums attracts, so actually, I have tried to understand what it is 'they' (or should I say 'you') hate so much about Christians... but never got a straight answer. Still haven't.

I can understand not liking Fundamentalists -- I avoid them myself. However the GREAT MAJORITY of Christians aren't looking to push their religion on anybody. Like Trav said, they work quietly among themselves in an effort to improve the lot of their fellow human beings. Doesn't seem very threatening to me.

Just can't see where that type of person deserves to have people like FT going around making fun of Jesus, calling believers names and ridiculing those who believe. Or, for that matter, people like YOU going around defending his actions.

Maybe you could fill us in on that question, dumplin?

What is it about Christians that makes y'all so angry?

:)
SMW
I agree with everything you've said, except your constant insinuations that all atheists hate all Christians.A lot of Christians do great things. A lot of churches do great things. I recognize that the majority of Christians belong to churches like this.

Now. What is with your own prejudice against atheists? You constantly demean, condescend, and make fun of atheists and atheism. In other words, you do to atheists what Freethinker does to Christians. Seems to me you're just as bad.

Yeah, you're right, Borg. I'm just as bad as FT.

And all the insults I've endured here as a Christian are just figments of my imagination. Oh wait... the insults were real. It was the mods who ignored the bashing that had me confused.

Guess it just depends on which side of the fence you're on. Atheist MODS are in at Allforums. Silly me.

;)
SMW

Oh, I think I've made an effort alright, Vile. I've never been around as many atheists as Allforums attracts, so actually, I have tried to understand what it is 'they' (or should I say 'you') hate so much about Christians... but never got a straight answer. Still haven't.

That's because you ask loaded questions. When you ask a loaded question you'll often get no response.


I can understand not liking Fundamentalists -- I avoid them myself. However the GREAT MAJORITY of Christians aren't looking to push their religion on anybody. Like Trav said, they work quietly among themselves in an effort to improve the lot of their fellow human beings. Doesn't seem very threatening to me.

Doesn't seem threatening to me either.


Just can't see where that type of person deserves to have people like FT going around making fun of Jesus, calling believers names and ridiculing those who believe.

Maybe you should be telling this to FT. :)


Or, for that matter, people like YOU going around defending his actions.

Well, I do believe in free speech, but if you mean actually agreeing with his statements vis-a-vis Christians, perhaps you could show me where I've done that, and then maybe I can give you a specific answer.


Maybe you could fill us in on that question, dumplin?

See above.....dumplin?


What is it about Christians that makes y'all so angry?

:)
SMW

Well, there's a certain type of Christian who can't understand anyone who doesn't share their beliefs, so they feel it necessary to characterize their views as "hateful", or tell them they must have a guilty conscience, or that they must be "afraid" of something, or that they're "angry".

Just as most Christians aren't fundamentalists, most atheists are none of the things you describe. They just don't share your beliefs. :)

Could be my imagination, eh, Vilepagan?

Yep, could be.

I do not hate athiest, nor have any hard feelings towards them. They are free to believe, or not believe what ever they want. I myself was one for a very long time.

I understand that freethinker is the Jerry Falwell of athiests. most are reasonable, tolerant people like Borg and Pagan who harbor no grudges towards christians, and I ahrbor no grudges towards them.

Yeah, you're right, Borg. I'm just as bad as FT.

And all the insults I've endured here as a Christian are just figments of my imagination. Oh wait... the insults were real. It was the mods who ignored the bashing that had me confused.

Guess it just depends on which side of the fence you're on. Atheist MODS are in at Allforums. Silly me.

;)
SMW
Have I ever denied that FT insults Christians? Like Vile, I don't think that's something to be stopped, in the capacity of a mod. I do disapprove, just like I disapprove of your insults to atheists. But since I believe this forum should be a place for discussion, even though it may be somewhat odious, I have done nothing to censor him, nor you. For some reason, you seem to want a stop to the insults against you...yet you have no compunctions against insulting people yourself. It's fine with me if you want to pull a persecution complex on me, but I don't buy it.

I don't deny that you've been insulted. By insulting atheists yourself, as a group (and not just targeting the prejudiced and insulting, such as FT), you are no better than he. Your words would hold more weight if you practiced what you preached.

Oh for the "good old days" when I could discuss beliefs with Loki (who did not share them) and we could learn a little from one another.

And no, I'm not being facetious... I really do miss them.

I have the utmost respect for several of our atheist (and religious) members, it just seems that they are not the vocal ones in the discussions anymore. Most of the spirituality threads end up with three or four people pointing fingers at each other's beliefs (or lack thereof) and resorting to name calling and pigeon-holing all people on the opposite side as "monsters".

Come to think of it, it seems that most of the political discussions are also of the same caliber of debate.

Oh well.... :(

Most of the people I hang out with are church going Christians. *shrugs* I find them amusingly human.

Old Phart,

There have been some rather interesting, non-confrontational discussions among Christians and non-Christians lately. I have been participating in one with afinertouch5, Inviolable, Shiloh, Tucker58, Dan F. and Stark where the postings are respectful and not overly confrontational.

I do think that the religious discussions have been much more civil lately.

Oh for the "good old days" when I could discuss beliefs with Loki (who did not share them) and we could learn a little from one another.

And no, I'm not being facetious... I really do miss them.

I have the utmost respect for several of our atheist (and religious) members, it just seems that they are not the vocal ones in the discussions anymore. Most of the spirituality threads end up with three or four people pointing fingers at each other's beliefs (or lack thereof) and resorting to name calling and pigeon-holing all people on the opposite side as "monsters".

Come to think of it, it seems that most of the political discussions are also of the same caliber of debate.

Oh well.... :(

OP, what religion do you follow? Or do you not follow any?


And Trav that was a great post.

I don't look down on anyone for being religious, I've said that a thousand times.
I realize that, especially Christians, do a lot of good things for others and their communities. It's not what they do, at least most of the time, that gets me, it's their beliefs that get me.

For the record I believe in god, just not a god that is dictated to me though religious dogma.

For myself, I am a member of a United Methodist church. My daughters just finished the summer program and the older will be going through confirmation this fall. Great group of people, widely varied on political views, economic status, age, interests, education, etc. All committed to the idea that love of God and neighbor should come before love of self. Pretty simple realy.

...amusingly human.BINGO!

I'm glad somebody else thought my little turn of phrase was as clever as I thought it was.

Nice post, Trav. I'm with you on this one... have never understood what it is about Christians that seems to scare the pants off of atheists?

Been out for a bit, but I read this and thought I should reply.

Atheists as I have seen them do not fear Christians. Personally I enjoy the differences in religions, how else would I have my religious debates?

What I do hate is when people speak inaccurately on behalf of those whom they disagree with.

I attend the Central Presbyterian Church. Our pastor is a woman. Our congregation is small but there's good fellowship, potluck dinners, helping the poor and disadvantaged, and singing. I sing in the choir. My favorite hymn--


Precious Lord, Take My Hand.

My Grandpa, historian, was an atheist. His wife, my grandma, attended Presbyterian church most of her life. Her own Dad had been a deacon in the church for years.

I recall Grandma and Grandpa taking us to Sunday School when we were kids. Grandma would take us in the building, then sit and have fellowship and drink coffee with other elderly ladies while us kids colored pictures of Joseph and his coat of many colors, or the Garden of Eden.

Not once did Grandpa ever enter the building. Now and then, very rarely, Grandma would ask if he wanted to go in. Grandpa would politely decline. He'd sit in the car and work a crossword puzzle or read one of his myriad Civil War books.

They were married over 50 years and got along great. Each respected the other.
It can be done.

I'm a member of the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America, the largest and one of the more liberal Lutheran synods. As a member of ELCA I believe in two sacraments, Baptism and Holy Communion and believe The Bible to be the word of God although not necessarily needed to be taken literally. The ELCA welcomes all baptized Christians to the Lord's Table and is in full communion with the Episcopal Church and the Presbyterian Church as well as several smaller church bodies.

My wife is Roman Catholic as are two of my sons and their families. My daughter is Born Again and my youngest son and his family are Presbytarian.

Have I ever denied that FT insults Christians? Like Vile, I don't think that's something to be stopped, in the capacity of a mod. I do disapprove, just like I disapprove of your insults to atheists. But since I believe this forum should be a place for discussion, even though it may be somewhat odious, I have done nothing to censor him, nor you. For some reason, you seem to want a stop to the insults against you...yet you have no compunctions against insulting people yourself. It's fine with me if you want to pull a persecution complex on me, but I don't buy it.

I don't deny that you've been insulted. By insulting atheists yourself, as a group (and not just targeting the prejudiced and insulting, such as FT), you are no better than he. Your words would hold more weight if you practiced what you preached.

Thanks for your advice, Borg. I'll keep it in mind.

Speaking for myself, I've never tried to push off my beliefs on anybody else. All I ask is that those who don't share a belief in God have a little respect for those of us who do... including you, dear. I have my doubts you would allow anyone to create a thread designed specifically to insult any one particular group of people... except Christians. Then it's OK.

That's entirely your choice. And it's entirely MY choice to voice my opinion about it. So, get over it. The mere fact that you and Vile rushed in to attack me instead of responding to the post that started this thread (and said basically the same thing I said) is very typical of your own prejudice, so don't be so quick to throw stones my way.

SMW

I have seen much more Christian bashing than atheist bashing on this site. If, as Vilepagan and Borghunter seem to be suggesting they are about equal in vehemence and frequency they should have no trouble cutting and pasting the myriad atheist bashing remarks.

Christians have been called delusional, hateful, lying, and just about every other insulting word in the dictionary with little or no comment by the moderators yet when Smartmouthwoman replies in kind both are Johnny-On-The-Spot with comments.

In my opinion Borghunter is a bit more fairminded concerning the issue than Vilepagan who has consistently sided with liberals or atheists in just about any verbal confrontation.

Yeah, you're right, Borg. I'm just as bad as FT.

And all the insults I've endured here as a Christian are just figments of my imagination. Oh wait... the insults were real. It was the mods who ignored the bashing that had me confused.

Guess it just depends on which side of the fence you're on. Atheist MODS are in at Allforums. Silly me.

;)
SMW And called me a coward. For just posting a website that pissed you off. That's all you have is name calling? This is a debate forum and debating different subjects. I don't know why it is so hard for some people to figure that out. Seems that a lot of so called chrisitians sure don't have a problem with name calling and avoiding the topic of the thread. So grow up already!

I have my doubts you would allow anyone to create a thread designed specifically to insult any one particular group of people... except Christians. Then it's OK.
There have been plenty of threads on this forum attacking Muslims, all without any intervention from the moderators. In addition, many of the same people who complain about their faith being attacked have no problem with engaging in such Muslim-bashing. Apparently, it only matters when one's OWN religion is insulted and ridiculed.

[QUOTE=BorgHunter]I'm an atheist and I have no "fear" of Christians or Christianity. Why would I fear a religion? To each his own.

I fear attempts to merge government with religion, but that's a different story, and one I can agree with a lot of Christians on.

While I'm sure it would be satisfying to you, with your obvious hatred (or fear?) of atheists and atheism, to believe atheists constantly guilty, I'm afraid you are mistaken. I have no reason to be ashamed or guilty of my lack of religion.[:thumbs:

It is not simply a problem with name calling, afinertouch5. It is a problem with either the inability or the unwillingness of certain people, ie moderators to see the double standard that is being employed.

It seems quite permissable to bash Christians but as soon as the Christians start bashing back the moderators suddenly take notice.

And called me a coward. For just posting a website that pissed you off. That's all you have is name calling? This is a debate forum and debating different subjects. I don't know why it is so hard for some people to figure that out. Seems that a lot of so called chrisitians sure don't have a problem with name calling and avoiding the topic of the thread. So grow up already!

Excuse me? You posted a website that was insulting to me and I called you on it. Don't over-dramatize the situation.

That's all you have is name calling?

Well, YEAH, it is. Like you said... this is a debate forum. If you can't take criticism, maybe you oughta find yourself a nice recipe swap site.

:matrix:
SMW

[QUOTE=Travh20]I have started going to a church in my area, and I have to say, in spite of all the naysayers,it is not full of scared, ignorant people shuffling through life like zombies. In fact, it is full upbeat, polite, nice, intelligent people. Everyone from doctors down to those living in group homes. I go in on Saturday mornings to help feed the poor and we also give out about 4 days worth of food for them to take home, as well as free cloths. We are sending missions to Africa and Mexico to rebuild houses. we have built a hope house for abused single mothers and even have a ministry to fix up cars that members have donated for the single mothers to have. Every time I go I wonder how it is that the Freethinkers of the world have such a warped, twisted idea of what goes on at a church or in religion in general. It leads me to believe that it must be personel more then based on any sort of evidence. Because you would have a hard time coming to the conclusions that Freethinker and afinertouch have just from attending my church. In fact, you would come away with the exact opposite conclusion, as I have. And at one time I used to think along the same lines as thosew two, although not with so much venom[/QUOTe ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I never said those things about your church!!! And to say that I have a lot of venom. Huh? And none of the name calling christians on this board don't? Give me a break. I have never described your church as you mentioned. This is a debate forum!! And I know I have said that before but it does not seem to be sinking in. I've went to church for over 40 years, I have worked in the church bookstore,sang in the choir and done all sort of things for the church. However, the older I got and the more I read about religion I began to be more skeptical. And there is lot about the history of religion that makes me skeptical. Many unbelievers have been christians in the past. And many of them were as religious as you are now. But to be honest to myself I just could not go on believing. I am convinced that christians are no more tolerant that atheists, and that religion has caused more harm that good. Why should my conclusion be less valid that yours? If you have new concrete evidence or a rational argument then I will be glad to hear them. But please don't waste my time preaching the same old sermons I here all the time in debating people on religion.

I do think that the religious discussions have been much more civil lately.
If that needs to be changed, just PM me.

*ghostbusters theme* Whoyagonnacall? (kids) EE---vah---kee--IN!

The mere fact that you and Vile rushed in to attack me instead of responding to the post that started this thread (and said basically the same thing I said) is very typical of your own prejudice, so don't be so quick to throw stones my way.
Huh? Why would I attack Trav for the first post in this thread? It was well thought out, and made the distinction between "Freethinkers" and atheists. I made the post to you because you do not make this distinction. That's the point I'm trying to get across. It's one thing to recognize that there are such things as fundamentalist atheists, it's quite another to lump all atheists into the fundamentalist camp. That's what you've been doing, and I quite take offense at it. It's called an induction fallacy:

Premise 1: Having just arrived in Ohio, I saw a white squirrel.

Conclusion: All Ohio squirrels are white.
It seems quite permissable to bash Christians but as soon as the Christians start bashing back the moderators suddenly take notice.
I still say, Frogger, that I have not seen this kind of behavior from any of the mods here. Can you give an example of when a "Christian started bashing" and a mod responded with censure (and not merely a responding post, and I may point out that there is a difference between a mod discussing and a mod censuring)? I believe I have been quite fair-minded in my moderation, which is to say, I very rarely get involved in moderating discussions, and rather use the "Delete" and "Ban" buttons 95 to 99% of the time on spammers.

It is not simply a problem with name calling, afinertouch5. It is a problem with either the inability or the unwillingness of certain people, ie moderators to see the double standard that is being employed.

It seems quite permissable to bash Christians but as soon as the Christians start bashing back the moderators suddenly take notice.

It's permissible to bash both, as long as you maintain a certain minimum standard of decency. As Borg pointed out, both he and I are posters here as well as being moderators, and I'd like to think he and I can differentiate between the two.

As far as "taking notice", if you mean we respond to posts that bash atheists, it's very likely due to the fact that we're both atheists. That shouldn't be too surprising. :)

As Borg already said, if you have any specific examples where you think he or I moderated someone in an unfair or biased manner, I think we'd both be interested in seeing them.

[QUOTE=Vilepagan]If you think atheists are "scared", you haven't made an effort to understand.


So,Yer an Atheist ?

[QUOTE=Vilepagan]It's permissible to bash both, as long as you maintain a certain minimum standard of decency. As Borg pointed out, both he and I are posters here as well as being moderators, and I'd like to think he and I can differentiate between the two.

As far as "taking notice", if you mean we respond to posts that bash atheists, it's very likely due to the fact that we're both atheists. !

[COLOR="Black"][SIZE="1"]Atheists should have very limited scope of authority.
If I were a Saint,I'd make sure that " ATHEISTS " are fed,housed,clothed and may under certain circumstance be allowed out in public,with only Limited
visibilty and job means.
I mite,on a good day,allow an " Atheist " to be a Window Washer.
Maybe even small engine repair.
See,the thingy IS,an Atheist Obviously hasn;t
the mental capability or foundation to comprehend THE most basic of
Life's Tenets.Therefore it should follow that they don't get the cream at the top of the milk bottle.
Just an emprty bottle and the Nickle deposit return.
To me,Mind ya... Atheists are THE Laziest of mortals.They havn't even
spent the time to consume what daily confronts them with awe & wonder.
Their {Atheists} just Dullard Slackers.

What?

Atheists should have very limited scope of authority.
If I were a Saint,I'd make sure that " ATHEISTS " are fed,housed,clothed and may under certain circumstance be allowed out in public,with only Limited
visibilty and job means.
I mite,on a good day,allow an " Atheist " to be a Window Washer.
Maybe even small engine repair.
See,the thingy IS,an Atheist Obviously hasn;t
the mental capability or foundation to comprehend THE most basic of
Life's Tenets.Therefore it should follow that they don't get the cream at the top of the milk bottle.
Just an emprty bottle and the Nickle deposit return.
To me,Mind ya... Atheists are THE Laziest of mortals.They havn't even
spent the time to consume what daily confronts them with awe & wonder.
Their {Atheists} just Dullard Slackers.
I have but one word for you. I'll give you a hint. Starts with a "P". Got it yet?

Prejudice. It's an ugly thing.

Atheists should have very limited scope of authority.
If I were a Saint,I'd make sure that " ATHEISTS " are fed,housed,clothed and may under certain circumstance be allowed out in public,with only Limited
visibilty and job means.
I mite,on a good day,allow an " Atheist " to be a Window Washer.
Maybe even small engine repair.
See,the thingy IS,an Atheist Obviously hasn;t
the mental capability or foundation to comprehend THE most basic of
Life's Tenets.Therefore it should follow that they don't get the cream at the top of the milk bottle.
Just an emprty bottle and the Nickle deposit return.
To me,Mind ya... Atheists are THE Laziest of mortals.They haven't even
spent the time to consume what daily confronts them with awe & wonder.
Their {Atheists} just Dullard Slackers.

I wouldn't combine those pills with alcohol if I were you. It renders indecipherable your already barely coherent posts.

I have but one word for you. I'll give you a hint. Starts with a "P". Got it yet?

Prejudice. It's an ugly thing.

Yup.Prejudice is akin to Discriminate.
Everyone virtually has some Discriminating tastes.
What kind of food,clothes,hairdo,body shape, Etc. we
Have.
I guess If i was a Retard and went thru the day,smilin at everyone,
I'd still have problems.
Some people mite not like those who are too Smiley :)
Y'know...Like Liberal Leftists ! :mad:

Yup.Prejudice is akin to Discriminate.
Everyone virtually has some Discriminating tastes.
What kind of food,clothes,hairdo,body shape, Etc. we
Have.
I guess If i was a Retard and went thru the day,smilin at everyone,
I'd still have problems.
Some people mite not like those who are too Smiley :)
Y'know...Like Liberal Leftists ! :mad:
It's fine not to like something. But calling a whole group of people "lacking mental capacity", etc. is a very, very bad form of prejudice. Not the kind of prejudice that keeps you from hanging around scruffy looking dudes who keep fiddling with something in their pocket.

I wouldn't combine those pills with alcohol if I were you. It renders indecipherable your already barely coherent posts.

Oh ... Butts ... " your " should bee [ you're ]
Mind Ya !

Oh ... Butts ... " your " should bee [ you're ]
Mind Ya !
Anyone who says Foolsworth doesn't have a sense of humor isn't paying attention.

Brilliant!

It's fine not to like something. But calling a whole group of people "lacking mental capacity", etc. is a very, very bad form of prejudice. Not the kind of prejudice that keeps you from hanging around scruffy looking dudes who keep fiddling with something in their pocket.

Humans that sashay thru Life,DENYING GOD,deserve at least in
kind.Know matter how unkind that may seem.

Humans that sashay thru Life,DENYING GOD,deserve at least in
kind.Know matter how unkind that may seem.
The United States Constitution disagrees.

Humans that sashay thru Life,DENYING GOD,deserve at least in
kind.Know matter how unkind that may seem.Say, are you drunk right now? Cone on, do tell!

The United States Constitution disagrees.

OH !!! ... I forgot :
In God We Trust

OH !!! ... I forgot :
In God We Trust
What part of the Constitution does that appear in?

Excuse me? You posted a website that was insulting to me and I called you on it. Don't over-dramatize the situation.

That's all you have is name calling?

Well, YEAH, it is. Like you said... this is a debate forum. If you can't take criticism, maybe you oughta find yourself a nice recipe swap site.

:matrix:
SMW
Obviously the answer is yes!!!!

What part of the Constitution does that appear in?

Um,the part closest to yer Right Butt cheek.
Like,in yer wallet.
Now,how mush mores cheeky,can a Guy git.?

Um,the part closest to yer Right Butt cheek.
Like,in yer wallet.
Now,how mush mores cheeky,can a Guy git.?
You're absolutely baffling sometimes.