This book by Charles Templeton is a very interesting read. He was an evangelical and close with the Rev. Billy Graham! Check it out. Fairwell to God: My Reasons for rejecting the Christian Faith by Charles Templeton:thumbs:

are you on some anti christian crusade or something?

are you on some anti christian crusade or something?
Do you have anything to say about the book? Did you read it? If not why are you here then? :confused:

finer, want to tell us some of the "finer" points in the book ... sort of a synopsis...to expect people to run out and buy the book and read it in the next few days in order to respond in this thread is kind of a bit pressuring isn't it... :D

are you on some anti christian crusade or something?
Why do you ask these questions?

why do you follow me around?

finer, want to tell us some of the "finer" points in the book ... sort of a synopsis...to expect people to run out and buy the book and read it in the next few days in order to respond in this thread is kind of a bit pressuring isn't it... :D
I don't expect people to run out and buy this book and read it in order to respond to this post! But if someone has read it and wanted to respond they could. If your really interested in reading it just buy it and read it! Or maybe they have it a your local library.

I don't expect people to run out and buy this book and read it in order to respond to this post! But if someone has read it and wanted to respond they could. If your really interested in reading it just buy it and read it! Or maybe they have it a your local library.

I find the process of a change in belief structure to be intriguing. I think there are likely points in the book that would be good to discuss.

I know my belief structure has changed greatly over the years. I think discussion can lead to understanding and harmony.

Although I would no longer label myself Christian, my partner is a fundamentalist Christian... That does not seem to be a problem in our relationship. He leans right politically and I lean left. We seem to see eye to eye on things but we talk, talk, talk about everything constantly.

Where mutual respect exists...harmony exists.

I just thought that if Templeton had made some points that you felt were interesting that a synopsis of the book or those points might generate discussion rather than hoping people had read the book.

I find the process of a change in belief structure to be intriguing. I think there are likely points in the book that would be good to discuss.

I know my belief structure has changed greatly over the years. I think discussion can lead to understanding and harmony.

Although I would no longer label myself Christian, my partner is a fundamentalist Christian... That does not seem to be a problem in our relationship. He leans right politically and I lean left. We seem to see eye to eye on things but we talk, talk, talk about everything constantly.

Where mutual respect exists...harmony exists.

I just thought that if Templeton had made some points that you felt were interesting that a synopsis of the book or those points might generate discussion rather than hoping people had read the book. He is intellectually honest and his book is easy to read. He considers himself an agnostic by the way. No time to write a synopsis at the moment though. If you and your partner see eye to eye on things I don't quite understand how you can be a believer and he is a fundamentalist. And you are on the left and he is right wing. That is hard to believe that you could see eye to eye on everything!!!

Funny how some people will believe something just because they read it in a book... but not believe what it says in the Bible.

Then sit around and call the rest of us idiots.

Amazing.

:)
SMW

Funny how some people will believe something just because they read it in a book... but not believe what it says in the Bible
ROFL!!

*wipes tears*

Phew.

ROFL!!

*wipes tears*

Phew.
Don't cry, Ev. Jesus loves you, too!

;)
SMW

Jesus hates me this I know, for the Bible tells me so.

What, didn't you guys have to say that in Sunday school?

He is intellectually honest and his book is easy to read. He considers himself an agnostic by the way. No time to write a synopsis at the moment though. If you and your partner see eye to eye on things I don't quite understand how you can be a believer and he is a fundamentalist. And you are on the left and he is right wing. That is hard to believe that you could see eye to eye on everything!!!
Heeeeeeey, where'd the annoy part go... I thought that was cute.

Nah, I'm not here just to annoy you. I'm here to annoy everyone. Just ask Evak, he'll tell ya.

Well eye to eye can turn into an eye "for" an eye on some days... He only has one left... :D

Eye to eye means that we basically respect each other's religious and political standings. I am not your typical mystic and he is not your typical Evangelical Christian. He is one of the kindest, least judgemental people that I have ever met. He is even a minister... doesn't practise often any more except to marry people once in a while. It took him a while to get the nerve to hang out with me. He said he had to wait until my "like" for him became stronger than my dis-like for fundamentalists. :D Now I just love him regardless of what he believes.

It matters most how we live and love. Love primarily. That is the big one.

He has basically taught me that one cannot judge another by labelling them ever. None of us fit a mould... not truly.

If you can think up any discussion angles from the book, throw them up here.

Jesus hates me this I know, for the Bible tells me so.

What, didn't you guys have to say that in Sunday school?

no Sunday school for us Catholics... that is heathen... what the hell is wrong with you?

no Sunday school for us Catholics... that is heathen... what the hell is wrong with you?
LOL, Evak was raised Catholic too. There was Sunday school in Catholic church when I was little too.... Not that I went, but my grandma did. Maybe you are not Polish like Evak or Irish like me. Perhaps Catholics from different countries do things differently...

Funny how some people will believe something just because they read it in a book... but not believe what it says in the Bible.

Then sit around and call the rest of us idiots.

Amazing.

:)
SMW Well first of all I don't believe everything I read! And if you want to believe all those crazy stories in the bible, then you are the one with the problem, not me. And where did anyone in here call you an idiot? And when you are so free to call others names why do you even give a dam? And why are you even in this thread when you know you would never even read the book. Your just here being a troll. Get a life!:mad:

Well first of all I don't believe everything I read! And if you want to believe all those crazy stories in the bible, then you are the one with the problem, not me. And where did anyone in here call you an idiot? And when you are so free to call others names why do you even give a dam? And why are you even in this thread when you know you would never even read the book. Your just here being a troll. Get a life!:mad:
No skin off my nose if you prefer to bet your eternal soul on a book from amazon.com instead of the Bible. I was just stating my opinion. Does that make me a troll?

SMW

You can get the Bible from amazon...

Maybe you should order yourself a couple? Need to borrow a CC#?

Sure! Go ahead and pm it to me! Make sure you put in the little three numbers on the back and the expiration date. A billing zip code wouldn't hurt either.

Sure! Go ahead and pm it to me! Make sure you put in the little three numbers on the back and the expiration date. A billing zip code wouldn't hurt either.

Coming right up. Watch your PM.

:hahanot:

LOL, Evak was raised Catholic too. There was Sunday school in Catholic church when I was little too.... Not that I went, but my grandma did. Maybe you are not Polish like Evak or Irish like me. Perhaps Catholics from different countries do things differently...

Nah, I don't think it's so much cultural as age related. We were thoroughly indoctrinated in school and then went to mass on a Sunday (well good Catholics did... we went when we could which was more circumstance related).

:) Heeeeeeey, where'd the annoy part go... I thought that was cute.

Nah, I'm not here just to annoy you. I'm here to annoy everyone. Just ask Evak, he'll tell ya.

Well eye to eye can turn into an eye "for" an eye on some days... He only has one left... :D

Eye to eye means that we basically respect each other's religious and political standings. I am not your typical mystic and he is not your typical Evangelical Christian. He is one of the kindest, least judgemental people that I have ever met. He is even a minister... doesn't practise often any more except to marry people once in a while. It took him a while to get the nerve to hang out with me. He said he had to wait until my "like" for him became stronger than my dis-like for fundamentalists. :D Now I just love him regardless of what he believes.

It matters most how we live and love. Love primarily. That is the big one.

He has basically taught me that one cannot judge another by labelling them ever. None of us fit a mould... not truly.

If you can think up any discussion angles from the book, throw them up here. Charles Templeton was a right-hand asstistant to the Rev. Billy Graham for many years. He was also a preacher. His book covers many subjects but has a lot about the bible. It is a informative critque of christianity. Which I think took a lot of guts coming from someone in his position. It shows how someone awoke to rebute the lies and reveal the deceit in religion. It has a lot of contradicitions and inconsistencies in the bible which many church going people don't have a clue about! It is an easy read for someone who has not really read any books on the critique of religion.

I am neither an atheist nor an agnostic, but I did read that book. Just a few years ago, as a matter of fact.
It was well-written, and very entertaining & enlightening.

I would categorize it as a beginner's primer to rejecting Christianity.
The author wrote the thing in such a manner that your head would not be swimming with the point-counter point-debate-counter debate nonsense that most anti-religious books are typically bogged down with.

Templeton's credentials were impressive, I'll give him that.

PS: The title of the book is "Farewell to God....", not "Fairwell to God..."
It's a common mistake, don't sweat it.

Another PS: I am currently reading God Is Not Great, by Christopher Hitchens. An intriguing and intelligent book, I must say.
If Templeton's book was 'Anti-Religion 101', then Hitchens work could be considered graduate-level reading.

I am neither an atheist nor an agnostic, but I did read that book. Just a few years ago, as a matter of fact.
It was well-written, and very entertaining & enlightening.

I would categorize it as a beginner's primer to rejecting Christianity.
The author wrote the thing in such a manner that your head would not be swimming with the point-counter point-debate-counter debate nonsense that most anti-religious books are typically bogged down with.

Templeton's credentials were impressive, I'll give him that.

PS: The title of the book is "Farewell to God....", not "Fairwell to God..."
It's a common mistake, don't sweat it.

Another PS: I am currently reading God Is Not Great, by Christopher Hitchens. An intriguing and intelligent book, I must say.
If Templeton's book was 'Anti-Religion 101', then Hitchens work could be considered graduate-level reading. I would say calling it a beginner's primer to rejecting Chrisitanity correct. Thanks for the correction on the title though. And pointing out mistakes in grammar or spelling do not upset me like some people who would seem to rather go on making the same mistake instead of someone pointing it out to them. I read Hitchens book recently and he is really a great writer. And I agree with your comparison of the two writers. But for someone who has not read any books that are anti-religion Templeton's might be an easier read for them. Have you read Losing Faith in Faith: From Preacher to Atheist by Dan Barker? That's a really good book too!

No skin off my nose if you prefer to bet your eternal soul on a book from amazon.com instead of the Bible. I was just stating my opinion. Does that make me a troll?

SMW I did not buy his book on amazon.com and I don't remember anyone asking our opinion on something you have not read or will never read. So yes, I would consider you a troll!

Another PS: I am currently reading God Is Not Great, by Christopher Hitchens. An intriguing and intelligent book, I must say.
If Templeton's book was 'Anti-Religion 101', then Hitchens work could be considered graduate-level reading.
I've seen Hitchens on television several times, and read the book. He's an ass, but at least there's a point to it.

"Fairwell to God: My Reasons for rejecting the Christian Faith".

Did he begin to doubt the existence of God, or did he become turned off by Christianity. The latter doesn't have to lead to the former.

And if he not longer believed in God, giving reasons for rejecting the Christian faith is rather superfluous. It's sort of obvious.

"Fairwell to God: My Reasons for rejecting the Christian Faith".

Did he begin to doubt the existence of God, or did he become turned off by Christianity. The latter doesn't have to lead to the former.

And if he not longer believed in God, giving reasons for rejecting the Christian faith is rather superfluous. It's sort of obvious. Well no the latter does not have to lead to the former but it certainly could! I believe he considers himself an agnostic now though.

This book by Charles Templeton is a very interesting read. He was an evangelical and close with the Rev. Billy Graham! Check it out. Fairwell to God: My Reasons for rejecting the Christian Faith by Charles Templeton:thumbs:


That does sound interesting.

I am curious - have you checked this book out written by a former athiest?
The Case for a Creator:by Lee Strobel

That does sound interesting.

I am curious - have you checked this book out written by a former athiest?
The Case for a Creator:by Lee Strobel

I have. Good read.

Well no the latter does not have to lead to the former but it certainly could!
I don't agree. If one is turned off by the tenets or culture of a particular organized religion it should not affect one's belief in a Supreme Being.

That'd be something of a juvenile reaction.

That does sound interesting.

I am curious - have you checked this book out written by a former athiest?
The Case for a Creator:by Lee Strobel No but I have heard of it. Earl Doherty wrote a book challeging it called Challeging the Verdict: A Cross-examination of Lee Strobel's "The case for Christ"

No but I have heard of it. Earl Doherty wrote a book challeging it called Challeging the Verdict: A Cross-examination of Lee Strobel's "The case for Christ"


The Case for Christ is actually another book written by Strobel.

You might want to check out Case for a Creator - it's a great book.

The Case for Christ is actually another book written by Strobel.

You might want to check out Case for a Creator - it's a great book. Well he is an apologist and I don't find what he says convincing. So I doubt I would ever read his book.