www.ffrf.org:cat:

I'm pretty sure a devine power rendered your hate-site unavailable. Keep trying and you're sure to hit on something that will enable you to insult those silly ole Christians. You know the ones -- those who would never do you any harm? It's a popular pasttime among cowards here at Allforums. Welcome to the boards!

SMW

Didn't you know you have freedom from religion, Finertouch5, or is someone forcing you to go to church?

Keep trying and you're sure to hit on something that will enable you to insult those silly ole Christians. You know the ones -- those who would never do you any harm? It's a popular pasttime among cowards here at Allforums.

I'm glad I'm not violent enough to be a christian.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b222/godsandmen/religion/atheism/GodPilot.jpg

:)

I'm pretty sure a devine power rendered your hate-site unavailable. Keep trying and you're sure to hit on something that will enable you to insult those silly ole Christians. You know the ones -- those who would never do you any harm? It's a popular pasttime among cowards here at Allforums. Welcome to the boards!

SMW
You sure make a lot of unfounded assumptions.

I disagree, Borg. I think SMW made a valid comment and did it in a humorous, wry manner rather than by being nasty.

I disagree, Borg. I think SMW made a valid comment and did it in a humorous, wry manner rather than by being nasty.
If that wasn't nasty I'd sure like an explanation as to what the fuck is. Or is it just that people of a certain religious persuation are exempt?

I'm pretty sure a devine power rendered your hate-site unavailable. Keep trying and you're sure to hit on something that will enable you to insult those silly ole Christians. You know the ones -- those who would never do you any harm? It's a popular pasttime among cowards here at Allforums. Welcome to the boards!

SMW


That so-called "hate-site" works fine (http://www.ffrf.org/) and it doesn't appear to be a hate-site at all.

That so-called "hate-site" works fine (http://www.ffrf.org/) and it doesn't appear to be a hate-site at all.
that depends on how you feel about atheism being shoved done your throat.

thanks for fixing the link, btw.

I really hate having Christianity shoved down my throat. Why I can't even drive around town without being forced to see churches.

I really hate having Christianity shoved down my throat. Why I can't even drive around town without being forced to see churches.

I know what you mean. I love food though, and I see resteraunts everywhere. Weird, huh?

Jesus, Thislin, you're really off your game tonight.

I'm pretty sure a devine power rendered your hate-site unavailable. Keep trying and you're sure to hit on something that will enable you to insult those silly ole Christians. You know the ones -- those who would never do you any harm? It's a popular pasttime among cowards here at Allforums. Welcome to the boards!

SMW

Are you insulted by the existence of the Freedom From Religion Foundation?

We all have freedom from religion. Unlike some other countries no one is forced to support a particular religion or even any religion in the U.S.A.. If you want to belong to a particular religion that is your right and if you want to belong to no religion that also is your right.

Are you insulted by the existence of the Freedom From Religion Foundation?
No, Vile... I'm insulted by yet another I HATE CHRISTIANS thread. And I bet the COWARDS who love to sit back and throw stone at Believers also kick puppies and spit on small children.

I am entitled to MY opinion, aren't I?

SMW

This wasnt a Christian bashing thread untill you made it one SMW. Before you even knew what that site was.

And I bet the COWARDS who love to sit back and throw stone at Believers also kick puppies and spit on small children.

I am entitled to MY opinion, aren't I?




http://images.43things.com/profile/102018s160.jpg

Sorry if I jumped the gun, P. Guess I just figured Freedom from Religion was yet another anti-Christian theme. Silly me. I'll check out the link and if I owe the originator an apology, I'll offer one.

SMW

Lol Jere, that woman you posted a picture of is the scariest woman Ive ever seen. That whole escapade of hers was truly frightening.

OK, I looked and it's not so bad. At least there are no pics of Jesus holding a 9 mm and stuff like that. Besides, it looks like the kinda place the atheist around here get most of their bible-bashing material. Heaven forbid I'd be the one to take away their ability to cut & paste rebuttals.

Sorry, guys. Bash on.

SMW

I don't consider a site that sells tee shirts with messages like the following to be exactly neutral when it comes to religion bashing. SMW has a point and shouldn't be so quick to back down.


The Bible A Grim Fairy Tale

Faith Is Believing What You Know Ain’t So

Global Warning. Religion Is Divisive

There’s A Sucker Born Again Every Minute

Skull and Crossbones anti-Bible message with the words, Warning, Literal Belief In This Book May Endanger Your Health And Life

Aw, but it looks so, quaint.

You're right, Frogger. I didn't dig around looking for worse stuff than their homepage showed, but figured it was there. It really doesn't matter if people don't want to believe in God, it's their eternal life at stake, not mine.

Just get tired of non-believers trying to shove their views down my throat like what I believe has any bearing on them.

I'm apologizing for lashing out at a newcomer. Should've given them a chance before deciding they were yet another Jesus-basher. That's all.

SMW

How much do you want to bet?

No, I don't hate christians but ignorance is not bliss for me and neither is blind faith. "Faith is believing what you know ain't so" Mark Twain

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b222/godsandmen/religion/atheism/eac-oz.gif

OK, I looked and it's not so bad. At least there are no pics of Jesus holding a 9 mm and stuff like that.


You've got a problem with someone posting a picture of Jesus with a gun? You're not going to like me very much.

If you think that constitutes "hate" towards christians, you're wrong. Well, I take that back - it depends upon the motives of the poster. But the picture, in and of itself, is anything but a statement of hate. As a matter of fact, I wouldn't be too surprised if Jesus Himself were to give it a big thumbs up.

Even a cursory reading of the gospels makes it abundantly clear that Jesus was a pacifist. There a few things in the scriptures more undisputable than that. Yet so many so-called fundamentalists are all gung-ho in thier support for this stupid Iraq war. I say "so-called" fundamentalists because, by definition, a fundamentalist is one who takes the bible literally. Yet in this case, they completely ignore the bible, or twist it to say something it doesn't.

Satire and free speech are a good thing, and I, for one, like to post pictures. Get used to it.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b222/godsandmen/religion/Jesus/americanjesus.jpg

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b222/godsandmen/religion/Jesus/jesus04.jpg

"You've got a problem with someone posting a picture of Jesus with a gun? You're not going to like me very much."

Yep, you're right about that. I've read your posts and I don't like you very much. But your silly little pictures really have very little to do with it. Most of us grew out of trying to shock people with our irreverent behavior at about age 12. Looks like you still have a ways to go.

SMW

No, I don't hate christians but ignorance is not bliss for me and neither is blind faith. "Faith is believing what you know ain't so" Mark Twain
How do you know Mark Twain really existed. You met him in person, did you?

How do you know Mark Twain really existed. You met him in person, did you?
I am both shocked and appalled with the stupidity of your statements, sir.

How do you know Mark Twain really existed. You met him in person, did you?
I am both shocked and appalled with the stupidity of your statements, sir.
I'm sure you'll get over it, ma'am.

(BTW, how do YOU know Mark Twain existed?)

I think her message was totally full of hate she called me a coward and said I like to kick puppies and spit on children. That is wry manner? Please

(BTW, how do YOU know Mark Twain existed?)
My name is Samuel Clemens.

I think her message was totally full of hate she called me a coward and said I like to kick puppies and spit on children. That is wry manner? Please

"Wahhhhh. I'm gonna tell my mommy on you, you mean ole woman!"

http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t33/texrose752/crybaby.jpg

(BTW, how do YOU know Mark Twain existed?)
My name is Samuel Clemens.
Well, shut my mouth.

How's your huckleberry hangin, Markie?

:)

But your silly little pictures really have very little to do with it. Most of us grew out of trying to shock people with our irreverent behavior at about age 12. Looks like you still have a ways to go.

SMW

"Wahhhhh. I'm gonna tell my mommy on you, you mean ole woman!"

http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t33/texrose752/crybaby.jpg

Photo posted like a true 12-year-old :)

Photo posted like a true 12-year-old :)
I know you're trying to insult me, darlin... but at my age, that's a compliment!

Thanks!!

:)
SMW

The pleasure was all mine :)

"You've got a problem with someone posting a picture of Jesus with a gun? You're not going to like me very much."

Yep, you're right about that. I've read your posts and I don't like you very much. But your silly little pictures really have very little to do with it. Most of us grew out of trying to shock people with our irreverent behavior at about age 12. Looks like you still have a ways to go.

SMW


You can place me in SMW's camp. I don't like you very much either.

Welcome to allForums, godsandmen!

Keep up the good work. :thumbs:

You can place me in SMW's camp. I don't like you very much either.

Does this mean that you are going to jump to conclusions, spew insults, make unfounded assumptions, and engage in petty bickering too?

The next time you guys feel picked on and "christian-bashed", I suggest you pick up a Bible and read the Sermon on the Mount. If you actually want people to believe you are Christians, it wouldn't hurt to behave like one from time to time. :)

Does this mean that you are going to jump to conclusions, spew insults, make unfounded assumptions, and engage in petty bickering too?

The next time you guys feel picked on and "christian-bashed", I suggest you pick up a Bible and read the Sermon on the Mount. If you actually want people to believe you are Christians, it wouldn't hurt to behave like one from time to time. :)

Christians always act like that.

wtf?

You can place me in SMW's camp. I don't like you very much either.

That's okay, I'm not out to win any popularity contests.

If you actually want people to believe you are Christians, it wouldn't hurt to behave like one from time to time. :)

Preach it! :)

Christians always act like that.

wtf?

Sometimes it seems that way. But I've had a lot of experience with fundamentalist christians, and I can attest that most of them are much nicer than the ones who frequent discussion boards.



To those who disapprove of my posts, I can assure you that I don't do it out of any spite or hatred of christians personally. I do it because I like to poke fun at what I believe is foolishness, and most people enjoy a good joke. I was a fundamentalist myself for many years, so at least I can't be accused of poking fun at something I know nothing about.

My Photobucket contains hundreds of gifs and jpegs in a wide variety of topics, but religion is my favorite. Maybe because of my past experience with it. I look at it this way: Leno, Letterman, Conan and others make jokes every day about things many viewers would consider sensitive subjects. I'm sure they offend many, many people every single day. Yet they do it anyway. Why? Because MOST people think those jokes are funny, and they laugh, and they tune in again the next day for more of the same. My feeling is, if they can do it, so can I.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b222/godsandmen/religion/fundamentalism/0804Fundamentalism.jpg

Does this mean that you are going to jump to conclusions, spew insults, make unfounded assumptions, and engage in petty bickering too?

The next time you guys feel picked on and "christian-bashed", I suggest you pick up a Bible and read the Sermon on the Mount. If you actually want people to believe you are Christians, it wouldn't hurt to behave like one from time to time. :)

I didn't jump to any conclusions. I went to the site, read what it had to say and then checked out their advertisers.

You can blow your little act like a Christian screed out your ass, Vile. It is the same old shit every time a Christian complains about the bashing. Be a good boy and sit and take it. Don't complain. That wouldn't be Christian.

Bullshit. You bash and I'm going to call you on it. You don't like it, that's too fucking bad.

I didn't jump to any conclusions. I went to the site, read what it had to say and then checked out their advertisers.

And? Do you consider the Freedom From Religion Foundation to be a hate group?


You can blow your little act like a Christian screed out your ass, Vile. It is the same old shit every time a Christian complains about the bashing. Be a good boy and sit and take it. Don't complain. That wouldn't be Christian.

Bullshit. You bash and I'm going to call you on it. You don't like it, that's too fucking bad.

No doubt you learned how to speak and act like that in church?

Believe it or not Frogger I was raised a Christian. The fact that I choose not to call myself one now in no way means that I've forgotten the good things it has to teach.

Do I consider them a hate group? Not in the same sense or degree as other groups but yes, I consider them to be a hate group with their hatred directed toward the religious.

No, I did not learn to speak that way in church. Being a Christian means I am forgiven not that I am perfect. I am sick and tired of the same old crap, don't argue back because that is not Christian. Christians don't have to be meek and just sit back and accept whatever people want to say about them without reacting.

Maybe Jesus would turn the other cheek. I'm not Jesus and if you hit me I will beat the living shit out of you.

(BTW, how do YOU know Mark Twain existed?)

Good point. Today, we can't "know" he existed because he's dead, and we didn't meet him personally. The best we can do is rely on the evidence. The evidence for his existence would include the voluminous writings attributed to him personally, numerous contemporary newspaper accounts of his existence, photographs of him actually existing, various and sundry other physical items bearing his name, likeness, and so forth. If that doesn't suffice, there is a tomb in Elmira NY, you can dig up with his name on it. I don't know about you, but I'm convinced he really existed. I'm also convinced that that's not an unreasonable conclusion to draw, based on the evidence. :)

Do I consider them a hate group? Not in the same sense or degree as other groups but yes, I consider them to be a hate group with their hatred directed toward the religious.

Ok. Does the church have the same attitude about such groups, or do they discourage it? I'm actually curious. I haven't been to a church in a long time and I want to know what the church has to say about atheist groups.


No, I did not learn to speak that way in church. Being a Christian means I am forgiven not that I am perfect.

Fine, who's perfect? Maybe I was just saying you could be better. ;)


I am sick and tired of the same old crap, don't argue back because that is not Christian. Christians don't have to be meek and just sit back and accept whatever people want to say about them without reacting.

I agree, but there's a difference between "hitting back" and being aggressive. The person who started this thread merely posted a link to the FFRF website. SMW went off like a roman candle and you stepped up and said she was behaving correctly by badmouthing several posters, and atheists in general.


Maybe Jesus would turn the other cheek. I'm not Jesus and if you hit me I will beat the living shit out of you.

I guess it's ok because you know you're forgiven.

I'm an apolitical atheist. I live in a (technically) theistic monarchy, we have worship in state schools and a "thought for the day" slot on the BBC's flagship news programme but these aren't the cutting issues in modern Britain. I don't care.

I am a political person. I am very concerned about the current rise of faith schools, for example. This is not an atheistic position, I am simply concerned about that it divides a very mixed society. On the other hand, some councils and companies have been banning religious dress in the workplace and I total disagree with that.

If I was American I think I would be different. From across the pond it looks like you have a large group of Christians being mobilised politically by Republicans. For example, I understand being Christian is effectively an unspoken requirement for political office. If so, that sounds very unhealthy indeed.

Blob,

Perhaps someone should inform the following members of Congress that you have to be Christian to be elected in the United States.

Barbara Boxer (Calif-D)
Dianne Feinstein (Calif-D)
Carl Levin (Michigan-D)
Norm Coleman (Minnesota-R)
Frank Lautenberg (New Jersey-D)
Charles Schumer (New York-D)
Ron Wyden (Oregon-D)
Arlen Specter (Penn-R)
Russell Feingold (Wisconsin-D)
Herb Kohl (Wisconsin-D)
Tom Lantos, D
Brad Sherman, D
Howard Berman, D
Adam Schiff, D
Henry Waxman, D
Jane Harman, D
Bob Filner, D
Susan Davis, D
Robert Wexler, D
Debbie Wasserman Schultz, D
Rahm Emanuel, D
Janice Schakowsky, D
Benjamin Cardin, D
Barney Frank, D
Sander Levin, D
Shelley Berkley, D
Steven Rothman, D
Steven Israel, D
Gary Ackerman, D
Jerrold Nadler, D
Anthony Weiner, D
Eliot Engel, D
Nita Lowey, D
Allyson Schwartz, D
Bernard Sanders, Ind.
Eric Cantor, R

Blob,

Perhaps someone should inform the following members of Congress that you have to be Christian to be elected in the United States.

Barbara Boxer (Calif-D)
Dianne Feinstein (Calif-D)
Carl Levin (Michigan-D)
Norm Coleman (Minnesota-R)
Frank Lautenberg (New Jersey-D)
Charles Schumer (New York-D)
Ron Wyden (Oregon-D)
Arlen Specter (Penn-R)
Russell Feingold (Wisconsin-D)
Herb Kohl (Wisconsin-D)
Tom Lantos, D
Brad Sherman, D
Howard Berman, D
Adam Schiff, D
Henry Waxman, D
Jane Harman, D
Bob Filner, D
Susan Davis, D
Robert Wexler, D
Debbie Wasserman Schultz, D
Rahm Emanuel, D
Janice Schakowsky, D
Benjamin Cardin, D
Barney Frank, D
Sander Levin, D
Shelley Berkley, D
Steven Rothman, D
Steven Israel, D
Gary Ackerman, D
Jerrold Nadler, D
Anthony Weiner, D
Eliot Engel, D
Nita Lowey, D
Allyson Schwartz, D
Bernard Sanders, Ind.
Eric Cantor, R

Any idea how many of them are atheists?

Frogger was not claiming that. He was refuting that claim.

P.S.-Dang, look at all those Ds on the list...

Any idea how many of them are atheists?What are they out of interest?

And what percentage of senators are Christians and what percentage are monotheists?

The person who started this thread merely posted a link to the FFRF website. SMW went off like a roman candle and you stepped up and said she was behaving correctly by badmouthing several posters, and atheists in general.

Ever since I've been here, you've ragged on me. I've asked you to lighten up several times, to no avail. In case you don't know your boundries as a MOD, you're supposed to step up if you think someone is being abusive, profane or threatening to other posters. I've never done any of that and yet still, you follow me around and complain about my posts, ridicule my style and attack anyone who happens to support my views, while you let hate-mongers run rampant without saying a word.

You know what?

You can kiss my lily-white, God-fearing ASS, Mod-Boy. If you don't like me, that's friggin fine. But leave me the hell alone or I'm gonna report YOU for abusing your lofty position.

Jerk.

:upyours:

Any idea how many of them are atheists?
Those posted are all officially Jewish but many modern day Jews are Atheist so I have no idea.

Ever since I've been here, you've ragged on me.

Patently untrue.


I've asked you to lighten up several times, to no avail.

Really? I don't recall you ever asking me to lighten up. Perhaps you would be so kind as to find a post where you did and point it out to me.


In case you don't know your boundries as a MOD, you're supposed to step up if you think someone is being abusive, profane or threatening to other posters.

Thank you for telling me how to be a moderator. If I ever need any further suggestions I'll be sure to ask you.


I've never done any of that and yet still, you follow me around and complain about my posts, ridicule my style and attack anyone who happens to support my views, while you let hate-mongers run rampant without saying a word.

If I've responded to more of your posts lately, it's because you've said some pretty foolish things recently.


You know what?

You can kiss my lily-white, God-fearing ASS, Mod-Boy.

No thank you.


If you don't like me, that's friggin fine. But leave me the hell alone or I'm gonna report YOU for abusing your lofty position.

Jerk.

:upyours:

SMW, report me to the owner of the site any time you like. His name is DrewM. Before you waste your time doing so I would like to point out a few things you seem to have not considered in your currently agitated state.

First of all, in addition to being a moderator I'm also a member here and 99.9% of my posts are just that, posts. When I need to don the moderators cap, that's usually quite clear in my post, and so far, I haven't had to don that cap when addressing you. Since you seem to have difficulty telling the difference, if I ever do have to address you as a moderator I'll be sure to make that explicit in my post to you.

Secondly, I didn't post what I did because I don't like you, I posted it because I was struck by the irony of someone wrapping themselves in the mantle of Christianity and blissfully acting as though they were completely ignorant of what Jesus taught. I'm sorry if my comments stung, but if they did I suspect it's because you know there was at least a grain of truth in what I said. If you were serenely sure that your comments and behavior were beyond reproach you wouldn't have lashed out at me like you did.

Thirdly, the worst thing I said about you was that were behaving in an unchristian manner, and your response certainly has done nothing to disabuse me of that notion. As a good Christian aren't you supposed to set a good example? I suggest you go back over this thread and re-read your posts and see if you think you did that.

Those posted are all officially Jewish but many modern day Jews are Atheist so I have no idea.

The only point I'm trying to make is that it is difficult for an openly atheistic person to get elected in this country.

Patently untrue.



Really? I don't recall you ever asking me to lighten up. Perhaps you would be so kind as to find a post where you did and point it out to me.



Thank you for telling me how to be a moderator. If I ever need any further suggestions I'll be sure to ask you.



If I've responded to more of your posts lately, it's because you've said some pretty foolish things recently.



No thank you.



SMW, report me to the owner of the site any time you like. His name is DrewM. Before you waste your time doing so I would like to point out a few things you seem to have not considered in your currently agitated state.

First of all, in addition to being a moderator I'm also a member here and 99.9% of my posts are just that, posts. When I need to don the moderators cap, that's usually quite clear in my post, and so far, I haven't had to don that cap when addressing you. Since you seem to have difficulty telling the difference, if I ever do have to address you as a moderator I'll be sure to make that explicit in my post to you.

Secondly, I didn't post what I did because I don't like you, I posted it because I was struck by the irony of someone wrapping themselves in the mantle of Christianity and blissfully acting as though they were completely ignorant of what Jesus taught. I'm sorry if my comments stung, but if they did I suspect it's because you know there was at least a grain of truth in what I said. If you were serenely sure that your comments and behavior were beyond reproach you wouldn't have lashed out at me like you did.

Thirdly, the worst thing I said about you was that were behaving in an unchristian manner, and your response certainly has done nothing to disabuse me of that notion. As a good Christian aren't you supposed to set a good example? I suggest you go back over this thread and re-read your posts and see if you think you did that.

gawd, I love the way you write...

And what percentage of senators ... are monotheists?
100%.

Dennis Kucinich is technically catholic, but his belief system seems more in tune with eastern thought. I suspect he is a closet pantheist.

Actually Just because someone questions the Validity of the Bible or of Christian Doctrine. Does not automatically make them a hater. There are legitament questions to be asked about the bible and Chrisitian Doctrine.

It is not the questioning but how the questioning is worded.

Read some of Freethinker's posts.

Smart Mouth Women

Sorry. Atheists do not hate Religion. They simply expect religious beleifs to be personal and individual. But when religious beleifs overlap into the Secular World then those beliefs need to be challenged. The Athiests nor I and others challenge Christian beliefs out of hate. It is out of self defence.

Smart Mouth Women

Sorry. Atheists do not hate Religion. They simply expect religious beleifs to be personal and individual. But when religious beleifs overlap into the Secular World then those beliefs need to be challenged. The Athiests nor I and others challenge Christian beliefs out of hate. It is out of self defence.


You are taking how you feel and extending those feelings to cover all atheists. That is illogical and sloppy thinking. As soon as you make a blanket statement like, "Atheists do not hate Religion", you are wrong. Some Atheists do not hate religiion while others do.

Vilepagan seems to not hate religion but Freethinker definitely hates it.

You got me frogger

Actually Just because someone questions the Validity of the Bible or of Christian Doctrine. Does not automatically make them a hater. There are legitament questions to be asked about the bible and Chrisitian Doctrine.

Frogger makes the point, "Read some of Freethinker's posts."

In short, while what you say is true, it doesn't rule out hate, and Freethinker strikes me as someone full of hate, as an autocratic, fundamentalist thinker.

You are taking how you feel and extending those feelings to cover all atheists. That is illogical and sloppy thinking. As soon as you make a blanket statement like, "Atheists do not hate Religion", you are wrong. Some Atheists do not hate religiion while others do.

Vilepagan seems to not hate religion but Freethinker definitely hates it.

OK--my point had already been made.

Haha, you guys are funny.

You are taking how you feel and extending those feelings to cover all atheists. That is illogical and sloppy thinking. As soon as you make a blanket statement like, "Atheists do not hate Religion", you are wrong. Some Atheists do not hate religiion while others do.

Vilepagan seems to not hate religion but Freethinker definitely hates it.
In my experience, however, most atheists do not, in fact, hate religion. And, being an atheist, I have known many.

Haha, you guys are funny.
funny? we amuse you? what are we?, clowns to you?:rant:






:corn:

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b222/godsandmen/religion/atheism/AtheismMythUnderstood-Small.gif

funny? we amuse you? what are we?, clowns to you?:rant:






:corn:

Performing monkeys actually - encore! encore! :thumbs:

In my experience, however, most atheists do not, in fact, hate religion. And, being an atheist, I have known many.

I'm sorry, Borg you are wrong. All atheists hate religions unconditionally. We want to purge all religious people from the earth with red hot pokers, and I speak for all atheists. I am the atheist god.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b222/godsandmen/religion/atheism/blkheli.gif

Well I think that Atheist get mad when people tell them they have no morals of values because they do not believe in god.

I would be defensive too if people assumed I had not morals or values based only on the fact that I was atheist.

It is ignorant such as that that causes divide and hatred.

Now the question is. If God truly does exist, what is the name of this God, What image does this God take, What persona makes up this God. Now since the times of the Neanderthal, there have been thousands of names, thousands of images, thousands of persona's created to discribe this God.

So even if God exists, can we know anymore then that. No religion on earth or in the history of mankind has ever been so superior to all other religions and beleifs that it was obvious to all that it was the truly chosen Religion of God.

So if God does exist. But refuses to give us a Clear Name, Image, Persona to know and beleive in. Refuses to raise his one true Religion and followers above all others to clearly prove they are his chosen people and beleif. Refuses to subdue or clearly show that the lesser Faiths and Beliefs are not His followers or beliefs. If God refuses to give evidence that yes He is real, then does it really matter whether or not God exists.

Is there any difference between having a for real God who does not give clear and unquestionable proof or having no God at all. I dont think so. If no Religion can show itself to be so far above all other beleifs that it is obvious they are Gods Chosen. Then can any religion be considered Valid. If God is real and does not give proof of His reality does this not mean that all religions are Valid.

Or does it mean that none are valid. Could it be that if there is a God. That He has no laws, no restrictions, no commandments and as such does not care if someone believes in Him or not. Could it be that God is nothing more then a Spectator who watches his creation grow and evolve. And that is why He Gives no proofs, or Evidence or His existance.

Just wondering. I do that quite often.

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b222/godsandmen/religion/atheism/358481084_s.gif

So even if God exists, can we know anymore then that. No religion on earth or in the history of mankind has ever been so superior to all other religions and beleifs that it was obvious to all that it was the truly chosen Religion of God.


Yeah, good point. Perhaps that's why some religions put off the display of the proof that theirs is the true religion to the "end times" (in the case of christianity). Hey, we can't prove we're the one true religion - yet! But one day....blah, blah, blah.

How convenient.

Now the question is. If God truly does exist, what is the name of this God, What image does this God take, What persona makes up this God. Now since the times of the Neanderthal, there have been thousands of names, thousands of images, thousands of persona's created to discribe this God.

So even if God exists, can we know anymore then that. No religion on earth or in the history of mankind has ever been so superior to all other religions and beleifs that it was obvious to all that it was the truly chosen Religion of God.

So if God does exist. But refuses to give us a Clear Name, Image, Persona to know and beleive in. Refuses to raise his one true Religion and followers above all others to clearly prove they are his chosen people and beleif. Refuses to subdue or clearly show that the lesser Faiths and Beliefs are not His followers or beliefs. If God refuses to give evidence that yes He is real, then does it really matter whether or not God exists.

Is there any difference between having a for real God who does not give clear and unquestionable proof or having no God at all. I dont think so. If no Religion can show itself to be so far above all other beleifs that it is obvious they are Gods Chosen. Then can any religion be considered Valid. If God is real and does not give proof of His reality does this not mean that all religions are Valid.

Or does it mean that none are valid. Could it be that if there is a God. That He has no laws, no restrictions, no commandments and as such does not care if someone believes in Him or not. Could it be that God is nothing more then a Spectator who watches his creation grow and evolve. And that is why He Gives no proofs, or Evidence or His existance.

Just wondering. I do that quite often.

I was Atheist for a long time because I could not get past the Judeo-Christian verson of god. I did not consider that there was a god just not as the bible discribed. Then I took this test.

http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/atheiststest.php

and realized that with my small human mind that I couldn't possible know if there was a god or not.
So I became and Agnostic and feel that god is so beyond us that communicating with us or caring for us on our level would be absurd. IF something was so massively intelligent to create the universe why would it try to talk to us because we could never possible comprehend it.
It would be like giving a mentally retarded person an reading book at the college level. Why bother?

Compared to god we are severly mentally retarded. LOL:p

Talk about spam!!!!!

who is selling something? I think you got spam confused with someones opinion.

Noone has freedom "from" religion.. they have freedom OF religion...

just because you see a church or a cross does not mean you are participating in a religion... If someone is talking to you about religion, and you don't like it, then change the convo or walk away...

just because you see a church or a cross does not mean you are participating in a religion... If someone is talking to you about religion, and you don't like it, then change the convo or walk away...
You can walk away from a person, ignore an advertisement, but you cannot live without using dollar bills, or pledge allegiance to your country without declaring the existance of a god. Nonreligious folk don't really care what you say, but rather it's what you do. A third of America are born again fundamentalist Christians. Their goals are to put class lead prayer into schools, ban evolution and teach creationism, create a contitutional ban of gay marriage, increase censorship, hijack the courts, etc. Huge fundamentalist churches tell their children to take up arms against secularism. We don't complain about being handed Gideon bibles, or having to hear about how much Jesus loves everyone. The problem lies in how fervent Christian leaders turned political leaders are about their scary beliefs, and how large and how rapidly increasing their followers are. And as the minority I want protection against the tyranny of a rapidly growing majority.

www.ffrf.org The website of The Freedom From Religion Foundation!!!!

just because you see a church or a cross does not mean you are participating in a religion... If someone is talking to you about religion, and you don't like it, then change the convo or walk away...
You can walk away from a person, ignore an advertisement, but you cannot live without using dollar bills, or pledge allegiance to your country without declaring the existance of a god. Nonreligious folk don't really care what you say, but rather it's what you do. A third of America are born again fundamentalist Christians. Their goals are to put class lead prayer into schools, ban evolution and teach creationism, create a contitutional ban of gay marriage, increase censorship, hijack the courts, etc. Huge fundamentalist churches tell their children to take up arms against secularism. We don't complain about being handed Gideon bibles, or having to hear about how much Jesus loves everyone. The problem lies in how fervent Christian leaders turned political leaders are about their scary beliefs, and how large and how rapidly increasing their followers are. And as the minority I want protection against the tyranny of a rapidly growing majority.

The percentage of fundamentalist christians in this country is nowhere near a third of the population, and they most definitely are not a "rapidly growing majority". It is a growing poplulation, but you're way overstating thier numbers. Also, they do not urge people to "take up arms" against secularism.

See what I don't get is why one is right and one is wrong. Religion is based on loving thee neighbours and being able to live with ones self and sleep at night knowing they are moral and ethical. Religion gets in the way of some people being able to make responsible choices and then blame it on religion when it goes wrong.
I am agnostic it was the best for me I could do. I grew up in a home were you were not allowed to speak of religion or else. I grew up questioning why and what. I like to listen and hear about all kinds of religions and will always ask questions about peoples beliefs and faiths in what they believe. Not to run them down but to understand. More people need to be open minded and not so close minded and believe their ways are the only ways. This world is a multitude of people and melting pot so to say. If it is a true religion should it not teach compassion and humanity.

More people need to be open minded and not so close minded and believe their ways are the only ways. This world is a multitude of people and melting pot so to say. If it is a true religion should it not teach compassion and humanity.

Well said.

:flowers:

Odd how religions are a two-edged sword. Most religions simultaneously teach kindness, loving thy neighbor, etc., and also intolerance of things the religion regards as evil (or at least a thread to the belief system), like homosexuality, evolution, etc. Religions teach peace, yet often are the cause of wars and conflict. Too bad you have to take the bad with the good.

Odd how religions are a two-edged sword. Most religions simultaneously teach kindness, loving thy neighbor, etc., and also intolerance of things the religion regards as evil (or at least a thread to the belief system), like homosexuality, evolution, etc. Religions teach peace, yet often are the cause of wars and conflict. Too bad you have to take the bad with the good.
Isn't that life taking the good with the bad and learning compassion and tolerance. I would have thought that this is what it is all about.
Being able to agree to disagree and still show respect.

Isn't that life taking the good with the bad and learning compassion and tolerance. I would have thought that this is what it is all about.
Being able to agree to disagree and still show respect.

In an ideal world maybe. But it this world, it doesn't seem to work that way. Religions blind people to the big picture. They lose their objectivity and intuitive sense of what is and what is not "right". That internal sense gets reprogrammed right out of them. Once they become immersed in a religious philisophy, they no longer think for themselves. They base thier beliefs on something some person or book tells them, and they become afraid of thinking outside of those boundaries anymore.

That's the beginning of the end. From then on, all kinds of bad things can happen.

just because you see a church or a cross does not mean you are participating in a religion... If someone is talking to you about religion, and you don't like it, then change the convo or walk away...
You can walk away from a person, ignore an advertisement, but you cannot live without using dollar bills, or pledge allegiance to your country without declaring the existance of a god. Nonreligious folk don't really care what you say, but rather it's what you do. A third of America are born again fundamentalist Christians. Their goals are to put class lead prayer into schools, ban evolution and teach creationism, create a contitutional ban of gay marriage, increase censorship, hijack the courts, etc. Huge fundamentalist churches tell their children to take up arms against secularism. We don't complain about being handed Gideon bibles, or having to hear about how much Jesus loves everyone. The problem lies in how fervent Christian leaders turned political leaders are about their scary beliefs, and how large and how rapidly increasing their followers are. And as the minority I want protection against the tyranny of a rapidly growing majority.
Really great post.

Really great post.
I dunno; it struck me as scare tactics with an anti-Christian agenda.

The simple fact is the influence of fundamentalist Christianity is but a pale shadow of what it was fifty years ago, and its influence continues to diminish

To be sure, it is noisy, and to be sure it is not without any influence at all, but they are nowhere near taking power in the country and even if they did (after all, they had power for a couple centuries), the consequences would not be as the left paints it.

Demonizing the other side of the fence seems to be a standard left-wing tactic.

It's not a great post at all. In fact it is a hyperbolic post filled with lies and distortions.


just because you see a church or a cross does not mean you are participating in a religion... If someone is talking to you about religion, and you don't like it, then change the convo or walk away...
You can walk away from a person, ignore an advertisement, but you cannot live without using dollar bills, or pledge allegiance to your country without declaring the existance of a god. Nonreligious folk don't really care what you say, but rather it's what you do. A third of America are born again fundamentalist Christians. Their goals are to put class lead prayer into schools, ban evolution and teach creationism, create a contitutional ban of gay marriage, increase censorship, hijack the courts, etc. Huge fundamentalist churches tell their children to take up arms against secularism. We don't complain about being handed Gideon bibles, or having to hear about how much Jesus loves everyone. The problem lies in how fervent Christian leaders turned political leaders are about their scary beliefs, and how large and how rapidly increasing their followers are. And as the minority I want protection against the tyranny of a rapidly growing majority.

Let's look at Blibblob's post. The charts below will show that Blibblob's 1/3 of Americans are Born Again is simply not so. The vast majority of Christians in the world and in the United States are what are known as main line Christians, members of the Roman Catholic and major Protestant sects. ie Lutheran, Episcopalian, Methodist, Baptist, Adventists Mennonites, Amish, Anabaptists, Pilgrim Brethren, Anglican, Christian Scientists, Church of God, Seventh Day Adventists, Jehovah's Witnesses, Waldesians, Church of God and many smaller grouups, none of which are fundamentalist.

Of the Fundamentalist sects, the majority do not wish to do the things Blibblob says. Fundamentalism means the church follows five fundamental truths: the Bible is inerrant, Jesus Christ was born of a virgin, He was physically resurrected from the dead, Christ's sacrifice atoned for man's sins, and Jesus Christ will come again.

The vast majority of Christians, including those who go to church regularly do not do the things Blibblob accuses them of doing. They do their best to seperate their religion from the government and try to, 'render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's."

Blibblob's accusation that huge Fundamentalist churches tell their children to take up arms against secularism is another hyperbolic untruth. One small group did so and in Blibblob's mind this suddenly becomes, huge Fundamentalist churches.

Look at the numbers below to see how what Blibblob posted is not only not a good post but is basically a bunch of untrue, secularist propoganda.


Survey Response %, June 1996 %, March 2001 %, March 2002
Protestant 53 53 52
Catholic 23 23 24
Mormon
(Latter-day Saints) 2 2 2
Orthodox 1 1 *
Non-denominational 1 0 0
Something else (Specify) 1 * 2
Not practicing any religion 1 0 0
Don't know/Refused 2 3 2
TOTAL CHRISTIAN 84% 82% 82%

Now let's take a look at some numbers from the religion section of 2001 edition of The World Almanac. There are just shy of 2 billion Christians in the world (1,974,181,000 according to page 692 of The World Almanac). Of these almost 2 billion Christians, only about 337 million are listed as Protestant.

The figures I've seen in articles and news reports indicate that only 20 to 30 percent of Protestants are Fundamentalists. However, let's play it safe and say that 50% of Protestants are Fundamentalists. That would mean 169 million Fundamentalists (rounding up). 169 million Fundamentalist Protestants out of 2 billion Christians is about 8.5%. That means just over 90% of the world's Christians are not Fundamentalist Protestants -- even with our large estimate of the percentage of Protestants who are Fundamentalists. (Of this 8.5%, of course, not all will be intolerant Fundies.)

OK NO WAY is there 84 percent christian in this nation!! Your distorted because if 84 percent of th public was christan we would have prayer in school and be teaching creation in schools.
No way that less than 20 percent of the people practice Buddhism, Hinduism, Athiest, Agnostic, Wiccan, Unitarian,Baha'i,Quaker, Scientology,Jainism, Islam,Judaism,Reconstructionist,Shinto,Sikhism,Tao ism, and Zoroastrianism.

http://www.beliefnet.com/index/index_10000.html

I wouldn't be surprised if the 84% number is about right. Many denominations count as members people who only show up once a year.

OK NO WAY is there 84 percent christian in this nation!! Your distorted because if 84 percent of th public was christan we would have prayer in school and be teaching creation in schools.
No way that less than 20 percent of the people practice Buddhism, Hinduism, Athiest, Agnostic, Wiccan, Unitarian,Baha'i,Quaker, Scientology,Jainism, Islam,Judaism,Reconstructionist,Shinto,Sikhism,Tao ism, and Zoroastrianism.

http://www.beliefnet.com/index/index_10000.html
Sorry, that's how it is. It's a Pew poll, and Pew is well-known for being very, very thorough, accurate, and unbiased. 84% of this country is Christian.

Now, let's move on to your red herring that if this were true, we'd have prayer and creation in schools. Why don't we? It ain't because of the elected politicians, that's for sure. Let me introduce you to...the judicial branch! (And the Constitution.)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Engel_v._Vitale
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abington_School_District_v._Schempp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lemon_v._Kurtzman
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Fe_Independent_School_Dist._v._Doe
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epperson_v._Arkansas
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edwards_v._Aguillard
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kitzmiller_v._Dover_Area_School_District

84% sounds about right to me too. Keep in mind a couple of things. First, that number is probably an average. The bible belt might drive that percentage up compared to where you or I may live. Also, the number of people who identify themselves as christians is likely far higher than the number who actually practice christianity. The vast majority of those who call themselves christian oppose prayer and the teaching of creationism in public schools. That stuff is more or less the domain of the fundamantist faction, which is a relatively small percentage of the totality of american christendom.

OK NO WAY is there 84 percent christian in this nation!! Your distorted because if 84 percent of th public was christan we would have prayer in school and be teaching creation in schools.

I think you have group all Christians into the fundamentalist category. Even here in the "Bible Belt" I would expect less than half to fall into that particular group of Believers. Not all Christians believe the bible literally (such as "creation science"), nor do they have a problem with the separation of church and state.

I guess we can basically agree that Blibblob's post, especially this part is simply not true.

A third of America are born again fundamentalist Christians. Their goals are to put class lead prayer into schools, ban evolution and teach creationism, create a contitutional ban of gay marriage, increase censorship, hijack the courts, etc. Huge fundamentalist churches tell their children to take up arms against secularism.