Many feel Rosie O’Donnell has gone too far with her remarks made on The View. If you are unfamiliar with her remarks they are all over youtube, but usually placed with an unfair spin.

Some of her opinions/remarks are (not mine):

1. The British are trying to incident a war with Iran by going into their waters, but twisting it to where Iran looks bad for capturing these British soldiers, even though they went into Iran's water to begin with. Rosie also mentions, “Gulf of Tonkin” when talking about the Iran-British crisis.

2. Bringing attention to World Trade Center building 7 ONLY (not the twin towers). Basically she says that how/why building 7 fell supposedly defies physics for it is the only skyscraper in history to have been demolished by only fire...whereas the twin towers were hit by planes. She never said who did it in specific, but just wants to know how it did indeed fall. However, I will admit she is implying something fishy happened in regards to the US Gov.'s role in it.

3. Saying radical Christianity is as dangerous as radical Islam.

4. Calling for Bush’s impeachment.

She has said a lot of other political things, but these are the main ones she is getting flack for.

I look forward to the responses because I don't know what I think.

PS: Anyone who calls her fat, ugly or anything close to those words really makes me feel sorry for them.

Mrs. O'Donnell should not be fired from The View, and if they do so then the producers are fools. She has increased the ratings for the show 5-fold, brought more substance to the show, and brought up controversy so the viewers can watch themselves and form their own ideas if they are aghast or in agreement. Discussing a current event about the Iran/British soldiers fiasco is much more important than the latest pictures of Angelina Jolie's newest kid. I do not watch the show and probably never will, but an opinion talk show needs variety, even radical at times.

However...

http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/5103/rosie05ef8.jpg

Fired? No.

Euthanized though, publicly, in the interest of ratings?
Yes, I could get behind that, sir.

The Tower 7 rant was bizarre and unexpected. I'm pretty sure she's lost her marbles.

Fired? No.

Euthanized though, publicly, in the interest of ratings?
Yes, I could get behind that, sir.

The Tower 7 rant was bizarre and unexpected. I'm pretty sure she's lost her marbles.

But isn't it strange how building 7 fell in free form without ever being hit and so soon?

Should Rosie O’Donnell be fired from The View?

Only if (or perhaps when) they change the flag of this country to this one ----

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v257/rkzenrage/bombs/US-Flag--White-Swastika.gif

Many feel Rosie O’Donnell has gone too far with her remarks made on The View. If you are unfamiliar with her remarks they are all over youtube.............
3. Saying radical Christianity is as dangerous as radical Islam.

I disagree with Rosie on that one. In my view it is far more dangerous.

_____________________________

Fascism is the name of this game; it is the use of governmental power to protect and further the goals of capitalism without concern for the social welfare of anyone else. George W. Bush is probably the most successful fascist in history, and the US is certainly the most powerful fascist nation in the history of the world.

Rosie has a right to say whatever she wants.
I don't see anything wrong with her comments you listed.

Many feel Rosie O’Donnell has gone too far with her remarks made on The View. If you are unfamiliar with her remarks they are all over youtube, but usually placed with an unfair spin.

Some of her opinions/remarks are (not mine):

1. The British are trying to incident a war with Iran by going into their waters, but twisting it to where Iran looks bad for capturing these British soldiers, even though they went into Iran's water to begin with. Rosie also mentions, “Gulf of Tonkin” when talking about the Iran-British crisis.

Ok, that is definitely an odd opinion, but no reason to get fired over.

2. Bringing attention to World Trade Center building 7 ONLY (not the twin towers). Basically she says that how/why building 7 fell supposedly defies physics for it is the only skyscraper in history to have been demolished by only fire...whereas the twin towers were hit by planes. She never said who did it in specific, but just wants to know how it did indeed fall. However, I will admit she is implying something fishy happened in regards to the US Gov.'s role in it.
So she's a conspiracy nut, who cares?

3. Saying radical Christianity is as dangerous as radical Islam.
The Crusades...

4. Calling for Bush’s impeachment.
Damn straight.

PS: Anyone who calls her fat, ugly or anything close to those words really makes me feel sorry for them.
You can start feeling sorry for me

Ok, that is definitely an odd opinion, but no reason to get fired over.


So she's a conspiracy nut, who cares?


The Crusades...


Damn straight.


You can start feeling sorry for me
the Crusades were a response to Arab aggression in the Holy Land.

You can start feeling sorry for me
OK. I will start to feel sorry for both you and Evakian. :)

the Crusades were a response to Arab aggression in the Holy Land.

Yes they were. And then extremists went and diverted from that, which even led to the sacking of Christian cities.

The term is also used to describe contemporaneous and subsequent campaigns conducted through the 16th century in territories outside the Levant[4], usually against pagans, those considered by the Catholic Church to be heretics, and peoples under the ban of excommunication[2] for a mixture of religious, economic, and political reasons.[5] Rivalries among both Christian and Muslim powers led also to alliances between religious factions against their opponents, such as the Christian alliance with the Sultanate of Rum during the Fifth Crusade. The traditional numbering scheme for the Crusades includes the nine major expeditions to the Holy Land during the 11th to 13th centuries. Other unnumbered "crusades" continued into the 16th century, lasting until the political and religious climate of Europe was significantly changed during the Renaissance and Reformation.

The Children's Crusade was not a military campaign but probably a popular uprising in France and/or Germany, possibly with the intention of reaching the Holy Land in order to convert Muslims there peacefully to Christianity.

The Crusades had far-reaching political, economic, and social impacts, some of which have lasted into contemporary times. Because of internal conflicts among Christian kingdoms and political powers, some of the crusade expeditions (such as the Fourth Crusade) were diverted from their original aim and resulted in the sack of Christian cities, including the Byzantine capital, Constantinople. The Sixth Crusade was the first crusade to set sail without the official blessing of the Church, establishing the precedent that rulers other than the Pope could initiate a crusade.

-wikipedia

Crusades shmusades...the real issue here isn't the value of Rosie O'Donnell's opinions, it's her looks.

Roseann Teresa O'Donnell (born March 21, 1962 in Bayside, Queens, New York) is an Emmy-award winning American talk show host, television personality, comedian, film, television, stage actress, and genuine ugly, fat asshole.

After beginning as a stand-up comic, O'Donnell gained notice for her immense weight and Keith Richards-esque bad looks. Later she gained further notoriety starring in a pornographic home video with Donald Trump in a gritty S&M tape that dominated blogosphere columns for weeks. Currently, she is co-host and moderator of the ABC talk show, The View, a position where some of her opinions and views have generated widespread media coverage, and drawn criticism, but not nearly as much as her appearance. Her racy lesbo rag and communist propaganda talk show were cancelled in 2002.

She is also famous for her Oscar speech where she said, "We are living in fictitious times with fictitious presidents, and I am a proud African American woman and this makes up for the strip search. Oh, and I'm obnoxious."

--From wikipedia...sort of...kind of...not really

My avatar loves Rosie!!

I disagree with Rosie on that one. In my view it is far more dangerous.


Yea.. because we see all those christian car bombers and chrisitian beheading tapes on the news... no wait, the corporate right wing media covers that all up

:rolleyes:

Fascism is the name of this game; it is the use of governmental power to protect and further the goals of capitalism without concern for the social welfare of anyone else. George W. Bush is probably the most successful fascist in history, and the US is certainly the most powerful fascist nation in the history of the world.

If you think GWB is more facist than Stalin, Hitler, or Saddam.. you are in severe need of:

A. Education

B. Detox of GWB hater-ade.

My avatar loves Rosie!!
Hahaha.

Yea.. because we see all those christian car bombers and chrisitian beheading tapes on the news... no wait, the corporate right wing media covers that all up

:rolleyes:


If you think GWB is more facist than Stalin, Hitler, or Saddam.. you are in severe need of:

A. Education

B. Detox of GWB hater-ade.
Mmm, mmm, HATERADE! :woohoo:

Rosie is a verifiable Bully.A fat mouth Egoist.
And I don't wanna hear about all her charity work.
It's free publicity,as far as I'm concerned.
No real mensch,ADVERTISES their Charity.
It's disingenuous and only masks,true grit.
I'm not sure what her psychosis is.She's a sociopath,that seems
intent on being Miss Big Shots.
She's got a figure that even the devil,would have to mock.
I think she's a VERY simple thinker.It's all emotion and
Passion Celebre.She loves to jump on circumstances,in order to
First & Foremost,make herself The Big Killer Whale at Disneyworld.
In udder woyds,The Main Attraction.

She's got a figure that even the devil,would have to mock.
I think she's a VERY simple thinker.

?!?

First a childish dig at someone's figure (:confused: ) followed by opining that she is a "very simple thinker".......?

ROTFL.

Those two sentences, coming in direct succession, get my vote for most laughably ironic statement on these boards this year to date.

All power to Rosie. She will bring the Republicans out in droves to vote. One scary woman that!

All power to Rosie. She will bring the Republicans out in droves to vote. One scary woman that!

I don't think there is enough homophobia in the Republican party to overcome the rest of their problems.

I don't think there is enough homophobia in the Republican party to overcome the rest of their problems.
Homophobia is not the point--indeed your mentioning that is a silly distraction. She's a nutcase with a microphone, and unless the Democrats somehow distance themselves from her--really distance themselves, not just mumble a few platitudes--she could destroy them.

I don't think there is enough homophobia in the Republican party to overcome the rest of their problems.

I disagree.

The homophobia, the superstition and the religious fanaticism of the Rightwing zombies should never be underestimated.

_______________________________

The neo-Cons are the tribe of "Always In Error But Never In Doubt". This clan of Simple, Declarative Dumbfucks, have been proven bloodily, monstrously, horrifically, incontrovertibly, overwhelmingly and tragically wrong year after year after year and it hasn't made so much as a dent in their certitude, or nary a new cortical fold or crease to form on the smooth, inert surfaces of their Beautiful Minds. They are lost and doomed; they have filled their skulls with bumper stickers and fear, welded it shut, and melted the keys down for tinfoil to line their beanies.

She's a nutcase with a microphone, and unless the Democrats somehow distance themselves from her--really distance themselves, not just mumble a few platitudes--she could destroy them.

Uh huh...

What makes you call her a "nutcase", specificly?

I think you are assigning her far more influence than she really has.

?!?

First a childish dig at someone's figure (:confused: ) followed by opining that she is a "very simple thinker".......?

ROTFL.

Those two sentences, coming in direct succession, get my vote for most laughably ironic statement on these boards this year to date.

Um...My Bad.
I really meant to stress First - Rosie is such a dim light bulb,that
even in Poland,she'd have a hard time congealing her Fat waddle
of Pudge,from say,the lard bucket,under the kitchen sink.
Even with the Lights ON...Fullbright Scholar and all.
Such you bee...NOT.

I disagree.

The homophobia, the superstition and the religious fanaticism of the Rightwing zombies should never be underestimated.

_______________________________

The neo-Cons are the tribe of "Always In Error But Never In Doubt". This clan of Simple, Declarative Dumbfucks, have been proven bloodily, monstrously, horrifically, incontrovertibly, overwhelmingly and tragically wrong year after year after year and it hasn't made so much as a dent in their certitude, or nary a new cortical fold or crease to form on the smooth, inert surfaces of their Beautiful Minds. They are lost and doomed; they have filled their skulls with bumper stickers and fear, welded it shut, and melted the keys down for tinfoil to line their beanies.
The homophobes who would vote solely on that basis are not going to vote Democratic anyway--so all she does is increase their turnout. More important, thought, is that people like Rosie will persuade the great middle of the political spectrum that the left is dangerous and unreliable, and that will push them to the Republican candidate.

(She is also, of course, doing her bit to hurt the homosexual cause, by linking it in people's mind with the extreme left--and I for one think this is very sad).

That the Republican be the next President might be a pity. Obama is impressive and even Clinton would probably be OK as a President--and either becoming President would be a significant milestone in America's fulfilling its promise.

Uh huh...

What makes you call her a "nutcase", specificly?

I think you are assigning her far more influence than she really has.
She actually has very little influence on policy, since most Democrats shudder at what she says too. The effect is on the undecided, who don't like right-wing social conservatism but who also don't trust the left with foreign affairs.

If you want to defend her outrageous assertions as sensible, by all means do so--but don't expect me to engage you.

If you want to defend her outrageous assertions as sensible, by all means do so--but don't expect me to engage you.

I ask again, what "outrageous assertions"?

I ask again, what "outrageous assertions"?
And I say again, if you want to align yourself with what she says, be my guest, but I will not participate.

And I say again, if you want to align yourself with what she says, be my guest, but I will not participate.

Let's say that no one is 'aligning themselves' with what she says.

The question was simply -- what "outrageous assertions" are you claiming she made?

Well said FT.

Answer the question Thislin.

they may be "outrageous assertions" indeed.. like saying christian terrorists are more of a threat than muslim terrorists or whatever she said....

but she has the right to say them...

From the commonfolk that steadily watch "The View".. i hear Rosie has brought the show down. No need for her, and now that she's promoting her own views.. perhaps the network could be brought to fire her to distance them from here... hey, it happened with Rush and ESPN..

Well said FT.

Answer the question Thislin.
I have no desire to exchange political opinions with you. You have already more than adequately demonstrated that this would achieve nothing since the instant someone disagrees you come on with nothing but insults. I would rather avoid it.

they may be "outrageous assertions" indeed.. like saying christian terrorists are more of a threat than muslim terrorists or whatever she said....

but she has the right to say them...

From the commonfolk that steadily watch "The View".. i hear Rosie has brought the show down. No need for her, and now that she's promoting her own views.. perhaps the network could be brought to fire her to distance them from here... hey, it happened with Rush and ESPN..
Of course, so long as she doesn't libel people, she has every right to say whatever she wants, and the broadcasters have every right to put her on the air or not as they want.

Frankly I rather approve; it brings stuff like this out into the public debate, where it can be hit head on, and where the character of such people can be seen clearly.

they may be "outrageous assertions" indeed.. like saying christian terrorists are more of a threat than muslim terrorists or whatever she said....

but she has the right to say them...
The original post quoted her saying something on the lines of, "extremist Christians are just as dangerous as extremist Muslims". I don't know if I would go quite that far, but looking at history you can see that extremist Christians have been incredibly bloodthirsty in the past. The Crusades, the Line of Demarcation set down by the Pope to divide the rest of the world and any treasure that was found, regardless of who lived there already. The conquistadors and the expansion of the faith. The divide and conquer techniques used on South America and the resulting massacres of hundreds of thousands in the name of God.

From the commonfolk that steadily watch "The View".. i hear Rosie has brought the show down. No need for her, and now that she's promoting her own views.. perhaps the network could be brought to fire her to distance them from here... hey, it happened with Rush and ESPN..
I never watch the show, so I don't really care. If she makes the show entertaining or more lively, why not keep her. If viewers don't want her though, then can her.

I'm pretty sure we are talking about TODAY'S "extreme chrisitians" and "extreme muslims"

Extreme fundamentalist christiands can be the most angriest people you have ever met, but their fury ends with them spewing hate on the other side.

Extreme Muslims seem to find themselves day-after-day in the paper dead because they drove a car full of bombs into a shopping plaza, killing 42 innocent civilians....

Add me to the "you feel sorry for me list" :D

I hate the woman. She is loud, rude, obnoxious, and hard to listen to. However, that doesn't mean she isn't sometimes dead on in her use of satire, irony or mocking.

Fired? For what, being outrageous? That's why they put her there. She has a love her or hate her personality. Money in the bank!

I say can the porky dyke! :D

All joking aside, I don't care if they keep her on, or don't keep her on - it makes no difference to me.

Somehow it is understandable where Christians would object to being compared to Muslims. Christianity has to a large extent outgrown its intolerance: in Muslim countries intolerance is taught as a virtue and is a practical necessity.

I look at the ongoing problems Thailand and the Phillippines have with their Muslim minority, and I can understand that people here fear the establishment of such a minority in the U.S. The French are already experiencing as much.

Wherever there are Muslim majorities, Islam quickly becomes state-supported and Muslim rules quickly become the law and Islam is the only allowed open religion.

You have already more than adequately demonstrated that this would achieve nothing since the instant someone disagrees you come on with nothing but insults. I would rather avoid it.

You are quite wrong. I merely give as good as I get.

You have demonstrated that you have no reservations throwing around insults like everyone else on here.

If I was rude to you it is because you were rude first.

If you are not rude, I will not be rude to you.

If you want to but in with your political opinions, be prepared to engage in a discussion.

If you don't want a discussion, then stay quiet.

Got it? Good. Glad I could help. :)

You are trying to tell me how to post; you have no such right. That I don't want to engage you is all I need to say.

That doesn't mean I am forbidden from discussing things with people I perceive to be more rational and less insulting.

Ok, Thislin.

Since you cannot handle discussing anything with me without becoming insufferably rude, and since you cannot handle me treating you the way you treat me, you may run and hide and refuse to "engage" me after you have already engaged me. :rolleyes:

I will pay you no mind and will assume you won't try to "engage" me anymore.

Have a nice day. :)

You are trying to tell me how to post; you have no such right. That I don't want to engage you is all I need to say.

That doesn't mean I am forbidden from discussing things with people I perceive to be more rational and less insulting.

It's part of The Clore Reich.
Which started in the late 90's in IMDb.com and it's
many boards,particularly Classic Movie Board and then
degenerating towards the Soapbox and Sandbox.
I beat their ass silly and drove them nutz.

It's part of The Clore Reich.
Which started in the late 90's in IMDb.com and it's
many boards,particularly Classic Movie Board and then
degenerating towards the Soapbox and Sandbox.
I beat their ass silly and drove them nutz.

IMDB.com?
Beat their asses in movie trivia, eh?

It's part of The Clore Reich.
Which started in the late 90's in IMDb.com and it's
many boards,particularly Classic Movie Board and then
degenerating towards the Soapbox and Sandbox.
I beat their ass silly and drove them nutz.
In a population of a major city--say half a million or more--it is not hard to get a few hundred "out" to demonstrate and chant slogans, no matter what you want to demonstrate about.

For this reason, it is unfortunate the press spends so much time reporting these things--they make good camera but distort the political process and emphasize the wrong issues and mislead the public as to what really is going on.

I think a similar thing happens on message boards. A few determined firebrands--a half dozen is more than enough--can "take over" a board and shout everyone else down. Unmonitored boards, as much as we may dislike censorship, often end up like that.

I think a similar thing happens on message boards. A few determined firebrands--a half dozen is more than enough--can "take over" a board and shout everyone else down. Unmonitored boards, as much as we may dislike censorship, often end up like that.

Ain't that the truth.
Try posting a liberal opinion on here sometime and watch how quickly you get "shouted down" by mikezila, brooks, gmsisko, decka, the praetorian, sparky, and co. At least the half-dozen you mentioned.
It requires a certain amount of moxie to stand up to that kind of opposition.

Rosie should stay just the way she is.
Porky,Ignurnt & Clueless
Now,if only a gutsy surreal painter could conjure up the
right size apple to stuff in her snout,we could go back to living in
some modicum of satisfaction,knowing that Art is Life.

Rosie should stay just the way she is.
Porky,Ignurnt & Clueless
Now,if only a gutsy surreal painter could conjure up the
right size apple to stuff in her snout,we could go back to living in
some modicum of satisfaction,knowing that Art is Life.
All strong points.

You bet your ass.

You bet your ass.

If rosie "bet her ass"... she'd make donald trump go all in and still have enough for a side pot

LMAO

Ain't that the truth.
Try posting a liberal opinion on here sometime and watch how quickly you get "shouted down" by mikezila, brooks, gmsisko, decka, the praetorian, sparky, and co. At least the half-dozen you mentioned.
It requires a certain amount of moxie to stand up to that kind of opposition.

and prouder your parents could not be of you for having the moxie to stand up to the guy with the cartoon dinosaur avatar on the internet I am sure.

i think someone just gave up... good riddence

Rosie shouldn't be fired from The View but she should be fired from the mouth of a cannon.

She is a rude, overbearing, undereducated bitch, and those are her good points.

Lesbians shouldn't be allowed on television, they corrupt our children and America will collapse. They practice their sinful witchcraft and convert our children into devil spawn that God will smite.

Lesbians shouldn't be allowed on television, they corrupt our children and America will collapse. They practice their sinful witchcraft and convert our children into devil spawn that God will smite.

obviously Evak here is attempting to speak on behalf of fundamentalists... and in the process smear them and put beliefs and words in their mouths...

Some fundies are hate-mongers.. but saying such a broad statement as you did is irresponsible..

and you can say "i was joking" all you want... but the message was pretty clear.

Oh, and i never heard about lesbians being responsible for practicing witchcraft.. way to come up with new stuff! Maybe I should start saying Al Gore fucks sheep, i mean, in the spirit of creating new ridiculous traits for people.

Oh, and i never heard about lesbians being responsible for practicing witchcraft..
"The feminist agenda is not about equal rights for women. It is about a socialist, anti-family political movement that encourages women to leave their husbands, kill their children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism, and become lesbians." -Pat Robertson

Ahh, feminists are lesbians that practice witchcraft. Straight from the mouth of America's contact with God.

"The feminist agenda is not about equal rights for women. It is about a socialist, anti-family political movement that encourages women to leave their husbands, kill their children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism, and become lesbians." -Pat Robertson

Ahh, feminists are lesbians that practice witchcraft. Straight from the mouth of America's contact with God.
The association between homosexuals and the political left is not difficult to understand, but, I think, demonstrates a good deal of political immaturity.

The same thing applies to the association of other minorities and the political left.

The reason for this alignment is obvious--the political right is far less inclined to admit to past wrongs and present discrimination, and even farther less to approve of some of the more hairbrained ideas promoted to correct it.

The only homosexuals I have known at all closely (and was aware of) was a male couple who owned a house near ours in a Dallas suburb. They were religiously agnostic but politically conservative on everything but "gay rights," and while their realtionship was not "blatant," it was not hidden either.

I talked to them several times about their politics--how they could vote Republican in spite of the homophobia that alines itself with the Republicans. Their view was that nothing is perfect, and that what is good for the country can trump what is good for them personally--and they did not trust the Democrats in foreign affairs or with the economy.

Personally (probably because that is very much how I think), I found their attitude mature and unselfish.

Try posting a liberal opinion on here sometime and watch how quickly you get "shouted down" by mikezila, brooks, gmsisko, decka, the praetorian, sparky, and co.
It requires a certain amount of moxie to stand up to that kind of opposition.Vile, Imagineer and Frannie post liberal opinions and they turn into discussions.
People only get shouted down when they act like a-holes.

It requires a certain amount of self-delusion to call idiocy moxie.

It requires a certain amount of self-delusion to call idiocy moxie.


It takes an unbelievable amount of self-delusion to conclude that Rosie O'Donnell is (as several posters here keep insisting) "stupid" or "ignorant" or "an idiot" merely because she holds a viewpoint that the mainstream does not like or agree with.

Her manner of speaking and her immense business success seem to me to demonstrate that she is very knowledgeable and intelligent.

For those here who repeatedly make remarks about her "ignorance" and her 'lack of education', I'd like to see you point to specific examples of things she has done or said that you feel illustrate those failings.

"The feminist agenda is not about equal rights for women. It is about a socialist, anti-family political movement that encourages women to leave their husbands, kill their children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism, and become lesbians." -Pat Robertson

Ahh, feminists are lesbians that practice witchcraft. Straight from the mouth of America's contact with God.

LMAO

i'm sorry, i just spit my milk...

did you just say Pat Robertson is "America's contact with God"?

LMAO that's funny, and so incorrect.

Does Pat Robertson have a fundamentalist following? yes. Do people watch the 700 club? yes. who gives a flying crap... Most people who are christian have a tough time listening to Robertson because of his near-blasphomous preachings and strict, savage viewpoints.

So go ahead and rip on Pat Robertson, but leave christianity out of it.

Does Pat Robertson have a fundamentalist following? yes. Do people watch the 700 club? yes.

Does Pat Robertson also have a very broad based mainstream following? Yes.

Naturally when he is exposed for saying hateful (although Biblically based) or bigoted things, apologists like you desperately try and draw a dividing line between him and Christianity, but you cannot.

Millions of people in America are Robertson-type Xtians, hook line and sinker.

Does Pat Robertson also have a very broad based mainstream following? Yes.

Naturally when he is exposed for saying hateful (although Biblically based) or bigoted things, apologists like you desperately try and draw a dividing line between him and Christianity, but you cannot.

Millions of people in America are Robertson-type Xtians, hook line and sinker.

Replace Robertson with President Bush and Christianity with America and you have the same argument.

Surely you don't feel that George Bush represents you?

It takes an unbelievable amount of self-delusion to conclude that Rosie O'Donnell is (as several posters here keep insisting) "stupid" or "ignorant" or "an idiot"....I was responding to Drama's statement about left-wing posting on AllForums and made no mention of Ms. O'Donnell.

I was responding to Drama's statement about left-wing posting on AllForums and made no mention of Ms. O'Donnell.

I'm aware of that.

Well, except that I know no poster named "Drama".

I think if the ratings have dropped she should.

Does Pat Robertson also have a very broad based mainstream following? Yes.

mainstream following? I didn't know P. Diddy, Paris Hilton, and young jeezy kicked it with Pat Robertson. I didn't know Pat Robertson was on MTV Cribs, and that he was on the cover of teen magazine. I didn't know Pat Robertson made an emo song with a high-priced music video. I didn't know Pat Robertson was on reality TV, and that he was a guest star on Grey's Anatomy and Sex in the City... Gosh i guess i'm living in a cave!

Naturally when he is exposed for saying hateful (although Biblically based) or bigoted things, apologists like you desperately try and draw a dividing line between him and Christianity, but you cannot.

So since i'm a christian I am required to stand by everything Pat Robertson says? That line of logic is, well, the kind i would expect from you FT... moronic.

Millions of people in America are Robertson-type Xtians, hook line and sinker.

Millions? I would say there are 5 times as many who don't even know who he is.

Surely you don't feel that George Bush represents you?

George Bush, as POTUS, represents every man, woman and child in the nation, Lord save us all. It's what a representative government is all about.

George Bush, as POTUS, represents every man, woman and child in the nation, Lord save us all. It's what a representative government is all about.

I didn't mean it in the literal sense, but more along the lines of his ideas and beliefs are reflective of ours.

did you just say Pat Robertson is "America's contact with God"?
He claims it so, it's either him or Pres. Bush.
So go ahead and rip on Pat Robertson, but leave christianity out of it.
No, never. He is a Christian minister who uses the lunacy of the Bible to justify his bigotry and ludicrous stances on modern day issues, and millions agree with him.

Besides, if I am going to rip on Pat Robertson, why waste time? The guy is hilarious as is, while the Bible is full of things far worse than Robertson has ever said.

I don't know what's going on in Rosie O'Donnell's head anymore.

When she and I met, back in 1991, she seemed to have her wits about her.
She was funny, loose, and apolitical.
I found her oddly attractive, even though it was Madonna I was in town to visit.

I had a few free days on my hands, and Ms. Ciccone and I had an open invitation to drop in on each other. Usually when one of us was feeling randy or just plain bored.

Madonna, Rosie, Tom Hanks, and Geena Davis were all staying in the same hotel during the filming of A League Of Their Own. I flew in on a Wednesday evening, and spent the obligatory five or six hours up in Madonna’s room trying to keep up with her insatiable and unusual appetites. By the time breakfast-call rolled around, I was ready for some serious steak and eggs, and not the inevitable Hollywood-set catered crepes and fruit.

Luckily, the studio had a deal going with the hotel kitchen, so they managed to rustle me up a rib eye and three eggs over-easy. The conversation over the breakfast table was unremarkable. Tom Hanks was polite and deferential, but had his nose buried in a script of some sort. Geena Davis impressed me with her height more than anything else. In her cleats she must have gone 6’ or 6’1”!!

Madonna chain-smoked throughout the entire breakfast conversation, and Rosie and she traded barbs over melon slices and toast. There was an odd chemistry between the two women, and Rosie knew all the right buttons to push to keep Madonna constantly in stitches. That was one funny lady!

I hung around the set for a few days, and tried to make myself useful. There wasn’t much I could do though, since I was a member of neither the writers union nor the key grip association. Mostly I just hung around the hotel swimming pool, working on my tan and some tall tumblers of Tanqueray and Tonics.

Tom Hanks and Geena Davis had most of the on-camera time that week, so I spent quite a bit of time with Rosie and Madonna. Rosie hung with me by the pool mostly, while Madonna napped up in her room. Ms. O’Donnell was a sturdy girl, but she looked pretty good in her navy blue one-piece swim suit. She had flawless skin, I remember that much.

She and I clicked, and spent long hours in the sun, drinking and engaging in some harmlessly-flirtatious repartee. By the third day, I had aroused her hormones to the point where she invited me up to her room for a shower and some brief but frantic sex.

I won’t bore you with the details, but I am happy to report that Rosie O’Donnell is quite a tigress in the sack. She’s funny as hell too, in a self-deprecating fashion. Naked, she talks almost non-stop. I guessed it was an unconscious attempt to deflect attention from the roundness of her belly and hips. It mattered not one iota to me, I thought she looked just fine.

One day blurred into the next, until finally it was time for me to depart and fly home. I’d had enough gin and sun, and for sure I’d had enough sex. Late nights with Madonna, and sunny afternoons with Rosie. I felt as spent as a wrung-out toothpaste tube.

Before I caught a cab to the airport, Madonna made a strange request; she asked that I help her pack up all of Rosie O’Donnell’s things, and move them up to her suite. She explained that the hotels had mismanaged the reservations, and that in order to keep from moving to another hotel, Rosie was just going to spend the rest of the shoot bunking with Madonna. I felt that I knew exactly what was going on, but I never let it show on my face. Who the hell was I to judge?

I moved all of Rosie’s things to Madonna’s room, and begged my leave.
Both women hugged me goodbye at the curbside, and I remember that Rosie’s breath smelled vaguely of peppermint as she kissed me for the last time.
The same kind of peppermint as the Tic-Tacs that Madonna kept on her bedside table.

As I waved goodbye through the cab’s rear window, the two women held hands and walked back into the hotel together. I recall now hoping that Madonna would be good to Rosie, and not consume her the way she did most lovers.

Anyway, it’s been many years since then.
I’ve seen Madonna fairly regularly over the years, but I must confess that I’ve totally fallen out of touch with Rosie. I have no idea what’s been going on in her life (other than that she’s pitching exclusively for the other team now). Whatever happened to that cheerful, wickedly-funny girl I cannot say. I just hope she’s happy, however it is that she spends her days.

I guess I’m hoping that her rant on the television show had something to do with gin & tonics, and not some sort of illness or dementia.
I’d hate to think that sweet girl is losing her mind.
That would make me very sad.

Ha ha ha!!!

I felt as spent as a wrung-out toothpaste tube.

Tremendously good, Sparky. :)

The fact that Rosie offers opinions in no way correlates to her knowing what she is talking about. Even a two year old can throw a tantrum and offer opinions.

Rosie is not only opinionated, she is also overbearing, loud, and obnoxious in voicing her opinions.

Her being a lesbian has nothing to do with how many people feel about her. Ellen DeGeneris is also a lesbian talk show host and she generates none of the dislike Rosie generates.

Rosie is disliked because of the way she presents herself not because of her sexual proclivities.

The fact that Rosie offers opinions in no way correlates to her knowing what she is talking about. Even a two year old can throw a tantrum and offer opinions.

Rosie is not only opinionated, she is also overbearing, loud, and obnoxious in voicing her opinions.

Her being a lesbian has nothing to do with how many people feel about her. Ellen DeGeneris is also a lesbian talk show host and she generates none of the dislike Rosie generates.

Rosie is disliked because of the way she presents herself not because of her sexual proclivities.
Since I watch little television, I know little about these two figures. I must say it is gratifying to see that openly homosexual figures can reach prominence now. Back twenty years ago local stations throughout much of the country would have refused to air them.

The quotes I have heard from O'Donnell do seem hairbrained and stupid, but they may be out of context.

Ha ha ha!!!

I felt as spent as a wrung-out toothpaste tube.

Tremendously good, Sparky. :)
As soon as he said "A League of their Own" I pictured some sort of strange BDSM with Sparky, Rosie and Madonna. :eek:

Tom Hanks would coach them from behind the camera. "There is no crying is foreplay! There is no crying in foreplay!"

I'm going to have nightmares. Happy Easter.

I think if the ratings have dropped she should.
produce results or get replaced...just like any other job.

Since I watch little television, I know little about these two figures. I must say it is gratifying to see that openly homosexual figures can reach prominence now. Back twenty years ago local stations throughout much of the country would have refused to air them.

The quotes I have heard from O'Donnell do seem hairbrained and stupid, but they may be out of context.

So you were born on August 1st, 1943. Another war baby. You are just six months younger than I am. It is good to have some 'seasoned' thinkers around here.

Oh yeah, bye the way, it's harebrained, not hairbrained.

He claims it so, it's either him or Pres. Bush.


No wonder you have such a perverse view of christianity..

You consider an EXTREME RADICAL and a president as examples of the religion...

No wonder you have such a perverse view of christianity..

You consider an EXTREME RADICAL and a president as examples of the religion...
Every Christian is an example of Christianity.

Every Christian is an example of Christianity.

Just as every Jew is an example of Judaism and every Atheist is an example of Atheism, right, Evakian.

The fact that Rosie offers opinions in no way correlates to her knowing what she is talking about. Even a two year old can throw a tantrum and offer opinions.

Rosie is not only opinionated, she is also overbearing, loud, and obnoxious in voicing her opinions.

Her being a lesbian has nothing to do with how many people feel about her. Ellen DeGeneris is also a lesbian talk show host and she generates none of the dislike Rosie generates.

Rosie is disliked because of the way she presents herself not because of her sexual proclivities.
That's exactly right, Frogger. I joked about her being a lesbian earlier, but in all honesty, it doesn't matter. Ellen DeGeneris is a perfect parallel. She's funny, witty, and, IMO, very talented. Rosie, OTOH, is not. She's a haughty, overbearing cow whom I'd very much like to see thrown under a moving bus. Twice. That aside, I'll never forgive her for being so RANKLY unprofessional (and not to mention, flat-out rude) when she had Tom Selleck on. In short, I think she's a disgrace to fat lesbians everywhere.

Every Christian is an example of Christianity.
Brilliant refutation, Evak. :rolleyes:

Brilliant refutation, Evak. :rolleyes:
What're you doing on AFN if you're not wasting time at work? Shouldn't you be spending your Sunday watching Rosie O'Donnell porn?

Just as every Jew is an example of Judaism and every Atheist is an example of Atheism, right, Evakian.
Yes.

That is how it works, Frogger. You can't just take the best of something and use that as a representation. All Christians represent Christianity, warts and all.

It's just like when you join the military, everybody looks at your actions as representative of the US armed forces as a whole. One soldier's fuck-up can trigger a firestorm of media attention. That's one of the biggest things they try to impress upon you in boot camp.

That is how it works, Frogger. You can't just take the best of something and use that as a representation. All Christians represent Christianity, warts and all.
Sure, and Adolf Hitler was representative of all humanity. The point you two are making is so loose (and, not to mention, devoid of point), it's laughable. Hell of a way to "construct" an argument there, fellas. :rolleyes:

Adolf Hitler was representative of humanity. It's one of the biggest reasons why the Holocaust was so scary. An alien excursion in the late 30s might have looked at Nazi Germany and decided that humanity wasn't worth befriending. Besides, haven't you ever heard of Godwin's Law?

Well, it's a good thing Godwin's Law doesn't dispute whether any particular reference or comparison to Hitler might be apt. ;)

The point is, is that Decka, and many, many Christians, would have you believe that no matter how many people make Christianity look bad, they aren't representative of the faith. It's like a huge "Get out of jail free" card for any Christian anywhere to make a mockery of their faith. All the while being perfectly willing to throw stones at other faiths for whatever it is their followers do. Its some of the most hypocritical bullshit that I've ever seen.

The point is, is that Decka, and many, many Christians, would have you believe that no matter how many people make Christianity look bad, they aren't representative of the faith. It's like a huge "Get out of jail free" card for any Christian anywhere to make a mockery of their faith. All the while being perfectly willing to throw stones at other faiths for whatever it is their followers do. Its some of the most hypocritical bullshit that I've ever seen.
That coin has the opposite side. There are far more good Christians that bad ones. You have no right to pick just the bad ones.

I don't see any particular evidence that Christians are any better or worse than the rest of humanity. That, however, does not address the issue, since Christians would say the same--"there will come many . . .".

I don't see any particular evidence that Christians are any better or worse than the rest of humanity.
We're not arguing that question. I don't think it is one that could be realistically answered. Instead we can focus on, "Can Pat Robertson be considered to be a good representative of Christianity?"

There are far more good Christians that bad ones. You have no right to pick just the bad ones.
Which would be why Evakian said, "All Christians are representative of Christianity. You can't pick and choose.

Besides, how would you know that there are more good Christians than bad? Have you met all of these Christians? Every one of them? Could you even say you know a statistically significant sample?

We can use Pat Robertson as a good example for Christianity in the US because he's American Christianity's most visible symbol. Millions of American Christians agree with his views, send him money, get his newsletters. We could say he is the best representative of Christianity in America that exists!

We're not arguing that question. I don't think it is one that could be realistically answered. Instead we can focus on, "Can Pat Robertson be considered to be a good representative of Christianity?"


Which would be why Evakian said, "All Christians are representative of Christianity. You can't pick and choose.

Besides, how would you know that there are more good Christians than bad? Have you met all of these Christians? Every one of them? Could you even say you know a statistically significant sample?

We can use Pat Robertson as a good example for Christianity in the US because he's American Christianity's most visible symbol. Millions of American Christians agree with his views, send him money, get his newsletters. We could say he is the best representative of Christianity in America that exists!
You are playing with words. Pat Robertson is not a "representative" Christian because he is only one person, selected in a non-random way. No statistical sample of one is valid, especially if there is bias in the selection.

If you assert that there are more bad than good in any given group, it seems to me you have a considerable burden of proof. People have the right to the benefit of the doubt.

If you assert that there are more bad than good in any given group, it seems to me you have a considerable burden of proof.
The fuck? You take my questioning of your assertion that there are more good Christians than bad, and tell me I'm making the opposite argument, then ask me to prove it?

You are playing with words. Pat Robertson is not a "representative" Christian because he is only one person, selected in a non-random way. No statistical sample of one is valid, especially if there is bias in the selection.
If you were to take the millions that subscribe to his views, you do indeed have a statistically valid sample of Christianity. That they all subscribe makes is easy to study them in the views of one man. But I'm not speaking statistically, as you are when you say, "more Christians are good than bad." I'm speaking in the semantic sense.

The fuck? You take my questioning of your assertion that there are more good Christians than bad, and tell me I'm making the opposite argument, then ask me to prove it?


If you were to take the millions that subscribe to his views, you do indeed have a statistically valid sample of Christianity. That they all subscribe makes is easy to study them in the views of one man. But I'm not speaking statistically, as you are when you say, "more Christians are good than bad." I'm speaking in the semantic sense.
Untrue. The millions would not be a random sample--it would exclude all but fundamentalist Protestants, and even most of those.

Yes, I think you are making an assertion (actually just trying to sneak it under the door) to the effect that most Christians are "bad." That stands in need of proof. Even Pat Robertson's "badness" stands in need of proof.

Yes, I think you are making an assertion (actually just trying to sneak it under the door) to the effect that most Christians are "bad." That stands in need of proof. Even Pat Robertson's "badness" stands in need of proof.
Okay, let's us define this "bad." How about we say that everyone who believes in God is bad due to their superstitions? That way we go from "most" to all Christians, and we even threw the Muslims and Jews in the pot.

Okay, let's us define this "bad." How about we say that everyone who believes in God is bad due to their superstitions? That way we go from "most" to all Christians, and we even threw the Muslims and Jews in the pot.
You make a telling point--one that I was holding in reserve in case he actually began presenting evidence of Christians being "bad." "Badness" is a value judgment and there is no way to prove a value judgement, so the very idea derives from an incorrect framework.

If I define "bad" as something that does harm--but we really never know--in the long, long run the harm can actually be a good. Still, we generally have a pretty accurate notion.

Personally I think Robertson is obnoxious--smug and living off the gullibility of people. I guess this is "bad." I would rather say that I personally am not tempted to send him money, and I marvel that anyone is (although he is nothing compared to Benny Hinn--is he on TV in the States?)

What all this has to do with the positive things Christianity has given us (I listened to the Bach "St. Matthew Passion" today--after all this is Easter). Is this an example of Christianity or is Robertson?

There are things in the religious experience that I am sorry to say those who are without religion completely miss. I know because, even though I always went to church, I never believed or really cared, until I experienced the rituals and ceremonies of a non-theistic religion (so that it could make intellectual sense). Regardless, they will live.

Some of us coil at the tawdriness and superstition, but it seems a lot of people love it. Yes I prefer to have my cake (the rituals and meditation and music and pilgrimages and group noise) and eat it too (dispense with the money grubbing and the cliches and the superstition).

Untrue. The millions would not be a random sample--it would exclude all but fundamentalist Protestants, and even most of those.

Yes, I think you are making an assertion (actually just trying to sneak it under the door) to the effect that most Christians are "bad." That stands in need of proof. Even Pat Robertson's "badness" stands in need of proof.
A sample does not have to be random to be statistically significant. Say you had twenty apples. You can see that twelve of those apples are green apples. You don't know what color the other eight are. You are saying that because you didn't pick the twelve apples randomly, because you are only choosing to look at green apples, that there's no way that at least sixty percent of the apples are green.

Yes, I think you are making an assertion
I really don't give a fuck what you think I'm making. Haven't you ever heard of a straw man?

The fact that Rosie offers opinions in no way correlates to her knowing what she is talking about.

Rosie is not only opinionated, she is also overbearing, loud, and obnoxious in voicing her opinions.

And even if --as you allege-- she were "overbearing, loud, and obnoxious", that in no way correlates to her NOT knowing what she is talking about.

Her opinions should be judged on the merit of the statements themselves, and neither you nor anyone else here has refuted --nor offered the slightest fucking attempt to refute-- what she has said.

And even if --as you allege-- she were "overbearing, loud, and obnoxious", that in no way correlates to her NOT knowing what she is talking about.

Her opinions should be judged on the merit of the statements themselves, and neither you nor anyone else here has refuted --nor offered the slightest fucking attempt to refute-- what she has said.
It is so obvious she is way off the deep end that it amazes me you persist in this line. Most of us are interested in worthwhile discussion, not debates with demagogues (sung to "Tiptoe through the Tulips").

The only reason she gets any attention is that she is a good entertainer, and therefore has come to have her own microphone.

And even if --as you allege-- she were "overbearing, loud, and obnoxious", that in no way correlates to her NOT knowing what she is talking about.

Her opinions should be judged on the merit of the statements themselves, and neither you nor anyone else here has refuted --nor offered the slightest fucking attempt to refute-- what she has said.
But FT, she's a lesbian that isn't attractive and in a pornographic film that I'm watching, therefore she must be wrong.

Evakian,

You seem to have gone from being an open minded poster to the world's youngest crusty old curmudgeon.

You argument that Christians are bad, either because of Pat Robertson or simply because they are Christians simply does not hold water and frankly I find it offensive just as Vilepagan would no doubt find it offensive if I as a Christian was to say that all Atheists are bad simply because they are Atheists.

For every Pat Robertson there is a Dietrich Bonhoeffer. For every Jimmy Swaggart there is a Mother Teresa. You have taken one man and attempted to make him the symbol of Christianity. When that didn't work you changed tack and said all Christians are bad.

You are better than that, Evakian, or at least you used to be.

You are better than that, Evakian, or at least you used to be.
You use this all the time, even when you were relatively new here and so was I. It is a cheap attempt to make me feel bad, and bad manners.

If you disagree with my statements whether they be in jest or of a serious nature, address them, not me. Just as you have failed to provide rebuttal for Rosie O'Donnell's points and resort to personal attacks, you do not address my posts but degrade me instead.

And your insult doesn't hold water, as your disagreement with my playing devil's advocate doesn't mean I am somehow not openminded.