I knew it wouldn't last long...

You know not the time or the place for a comment like that OD. Leave it alone and grow up he has...
now look who is stirring the pot up. You were looking for a response...........rude

On the issue:


The comment about being under age and drinking is very personal. I had a very good friend die of alcohol poisoning. Not sure if any of you have seen what it does to a person..Well let me tell you!

He drank a mixture of all kinds of alcohol at school as at home he would have been in a lot of trouble for it. He brought a thermas full of all kinds mixed then he drank it at lunch in the field behind the school. He was drinking straight moon shine. Well he started to turn green literally and was having problems breathing.. Someone spotted him in the field and ran and got 911. Well by the time the ambulance got there it was too late.They did work on him but.......:(
OK so yes maybe if he had been allowed to drink at home he might not have snuck it..maybe if his life had been better he would not have drank but he did and it ended poorly for him.

Here in Canada it is 19 to drink and in manitoba where I am right now it is 17.
Well I still feel these rules are there for a purpose. You may not agree with them or like them but they are there. I just wish people could see what they look like when they are drinking. Everyone thinks they are in control...right.
Your judgement is impaired and you make choices you might not otherwise make in that altered state. Most alcohol related incidents take place on college campus's..Which leads to all kinds of bad things, Date rapes and such.
OK again this is just my opinion on the subject.

You wanna get drunk, fine with me.

You wanna fuck your brains out, fine with me.

Just don't go around saying there are no consquences to your actions.

We have people bragging about how much they drink, how much they screw and how young they are while doing it. Then they get all pissy when their actions are met with disapproval.

Comics come on asking if he is an alcoholic. He exhibits many of the signs indicating he either is or is on his way to becoming one. Even though he is the one who asked the question he then posts that his drinking to excess doesn't matter and I scare him.


Well he scares me. He and the countless people like him who feel the weekend isn't the weekend unless they are drunk out of their minds, the people who pass out only once in awhile. These are the same people who get in cars and drive the wrong way down the road killing innocent people. They say they don't drive when they are drunk but fail to realize that drunk people almost always say that when sober. What they do when drunk is quite different. You don't think as rationally when drunk.

Getting drunk isn't something funny, it isn't something you have to do in order to satisfy your curiosity. It is a failure on your part, not something to brag about.

21 is our drinking age. It would seem high, but no one really observes it. 21 is when many American youths stop drinking heavily.

yeah, I quit drinking heavily once I hit 19...however "heavily" is relative... I no longer drank till I puked...

All you alcohol drinkers disgust me. Bah humbug.

yeah, I quit drinking heavily once I hit 19...however "heavily" is relative... I no longer drank till I puked...

I've never puked while drinking... In fact, I don't vomit very much in general, even when I'm very sick and feel like I need to.

Also, I've never passed out and only blacked out once... And that was the end of my drinking just to get drunk. I suppose back then I didn't see the point of having just one beer, or one shot, although small amounts of alcohol do help me play pool better... Basically, you hear this a lot, but I wanted to use alcohol to escape from my problems, but I soon gave up on that because it didn't help me escape at all. Nothing does. So I eventually figured it was better to sit around being depressed and feeling horrible all the time than drink or do drugs all the time, because at least depression doesn't ruin my liver.

I've never puked while drinking... In fact, I don't vomit very much in general, even when I'm very sick and feel like I need to.

Lucky you, I used to puke the way you cry.

Also, I've never passed out and only blacked out once... And that was the end of my drinking just to get drunk. I have never had a blackout...well...to my knowledge. I think for the most part, young people drink to get drunk as you used to and as I certainly used to. I wanted the high, I liked the high. I really can not imagine a young person drinking in order to appreciate the flavour of a particular wine. I liked a fast, cheap, high. And for a while I could forget the crap that was going down in my life too.


I suppose back then I didn't see the point of having just one beer, or one shot, although small amounts of alcohol do help me play pool better... Basically, you hear this a lot, but I wanted to use alcohol to escape from my problems, but I soon gave up on that because it didn't help me escape at all. But see, the realization of why you were drinking and the realization that it only temporarily fogs it out without making it go away, is a very mature realization. The fact that you have now cut back considerably on the amount that you consume due to those realizations, is a behaviour many are never capable of realizing.

The other reality is that some people have the gene which allows for alcoholism, and others do not. It is just luck of the draw. I can't drink much or I puke. It ruins my evening. I go from wild and boisterous to very quiet as I drink more because the more I drink the more nauseated I become.


Nothing does. So I eventually figured it was better to sit around being depressed and feeling horrible all the time than drink or do drugs all the time, because at least depression doesn't ruin my liver :D the liver is a rather important organ. As for the constant depression and feeling horrible all of the time, it sounds like bad things have happened in your past. They may have screwed up your brain chemistry. That can be adjusted sometimes without being on meds for that long. Sometimes too, just being a teen with all of the hormonal changes can really challenge a person. Life will get better. You are pretty, you have a hot body, an intelligent mind, and a super personality and you said, a good life now....and a good boyfriend. It's a good start! ;)

:D the liver is a rather important organ. As for the constant depression and feeling horrible all of the time, it sounds like bad things have happened in your past. They may have screwed up your brain chemistry. That can be adjusted sometimes without being on meds for that long. Sometimes too, just being a teen with all of the hormonal changes can really challenge a person. Life will get better. You are pretty, you have a hot body, an intelligent mind, and a super personality and you said, a good life now....and a good boyfriend. It's a good start! ;)

Thanks Sal :) I do hope it's just teenage hormones or something temporary that will go away, because my parents think I'm making it up and any time I try to talk about it it starts a fight about how my mother "is making me think I'm a psycho like her"... Ugh.

Passed out once, nothing to do with drink tho, was in a fight and got hit with a spade, wish I had been drunk tho.

Comics come on asking if he is an alcoholic. He exhibits many of the signs indicating he either is or is on his way to becoming one. Even though he is the one who asked the question he then posts that his drinking to excess doesn't matter and I scare him.

Well he scares me. He and the countless people like him who feel the weekend isn't the weekend unless they are drunk out of their minds, the people who pass out only once in awhile. These are the same people who get in cars and drive the wrong way down the road killing innocent people. They say they don't drive when they are drunk but fail to realize that drunk people almost always say that when sober. What they do when drunk is quite different. You don't think as rationally when drunk.


I found you scary because you jump down anyones throat that even thinks about drinking. If you are anti-alcohol, then that's fine with you. But you don't just come on with advice, you go so as to condemn as though you have some absolute moral high ground.

And for the record, I never mentioned anything about getting drunk out of my mind on weekends. And, while alcohol does impair judgment, I retain enough rationality to do the right thing. I've been drunk and handed my keys over to a friend without being asked. Perhaps it's because I've been trained to control my thoughts, part of my therapy with OCD since I didn't want to be medicated for the rest of my life. I believe this has given me increased control over my actions.

You could argue that choosing to get drunk is in itself irresponsible and shows a lack of control. But how you handle yourself once intoxicated is, to me, the key issue. Learning when to stop before "losing it" is the primary lesson. After some unfortunate trial and error, I believe I have reached this point.

But you don't just come on with advice, you go so as to condemn as though you have some absolute moral high ground.

May I be the first to suggest that Frogger's high horse be put down? But then Frogger would need something else to get around town in! Might I suggest something more befitting his stature?

http://us.st11.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/playthingspastllc_1929_41033292

Click to enlarge? Why, Nappy, I suppose you wish you had that button on your three-inch dick. ;)

Fuck, top of the class Borg.

Click to enlarge? Why, Nappy, I suppose you wish you had that button on your three-inch dick. ;)

I do. Praised be technology!

Comics,

You were the one who asked the question. Too bad if you don't like the answer. I really don't much care. Do what you want. Drink yourself blind. Become a full blown alcoholic. It's your life to either screw up or not.

Just don't come asking for advice and then get nasty when you don't like the advice you get.

I scare you. You scare me. It is people who say, "I am a responsible drunk" who wind up killing innocent people. There is no such thing as a responsible drunk. If you are a drunk you are not responsible. It's that simple.


There is nothing wrong with social drinking. There is something wrong with binge drinking. How many people here, including you, have mentioned drinking so much they blacked out? Tell me how that is being responsible.

You seem to want some form of approval for your getting drunk. Sorry but you're not going to get it from me.

You can easily be a responsible alcoholic. I've known several of them.

You can easily be a responsible alcoholic. I've known several of them.

As have I, and hospitalized many of them for detoxification. It's amazing how some can consume a quart of hard liquor or more daily and still function - quite well, in fact.

I just have to say the new year is upon us. And I will quit drinking as soon as im sober and i mean that till the next time I say it.

There is a difference between being a responsible alcoholic and a responsible drunk. You CANNOT be a responsible drunk since the mere act of getting drunk is irresponsible.

As have I, and hospitalized many of them for detoxification. It's amazing how some can consume a quart of hard liquor or more daily and still function - quite well, in fact.

I'm with Drew on this. Being an alcoholic does not necessarily even mean binge drinking. A person could have 3 drinks a day every day and that is technically considered being an alcoholic (according to the AA website). But with only 3 drinks in the system, the person likely isn't even drunk. In fact, many people can legally drive after 3. So, yeah, you CAN be a responsible alcoholic without harming others or your self. Extreme alcoholics or specifically "drunks" that pound the drinks down frequently are the ones that wind up hospitalized.

I know someone at my school that fell off a stage drunk and broke her arm in three places. A year later she was back at the hospital because of alcohol poisoning and everyone thought she was dying. Just a few weeks ago I found her passed out on a living room floor in her apartment. And yet she's called me an alcoholic and tried to stop me from having a 5th drink because she was "concerned". There's so much hypocrisy out there and people need to step back and realize that everyone has there own limits.

You admit you sometimes drink until you black out. If you're alright with that it's your problem. Just never leave your home when you are drinking because then it becomes my problem.

Just never leave your home when you are drinking because then it becomes my problem.

Does he live close to you :rolleyes:

Haha NOPE.

Yeah, uh... I actually started this thread when I was drunk. So it's quite entertaining to read everything now that I'm sober. While several good points have been made, I most agree with Napsterbater's 2nd post.

I'm an over 6 foot, 185 pound guy. I have a relatively high tolerance, so on campus it appears that I drink more heavily. Which is still true, but it looks worse to others. I can have a good 4-5 drinks and barely feel the effects. I was once able to have 8 shots and no one could even tell I'd had them.

I've also never physically harmed anyone drunk, I've always kept myself in control. I had a small handful of occasions where I couldn't walk, but otherwise I'm a very controlled drinker. I almost never have blackouts.

I have an average of 4 drinks a day. And by that I mean I'll have 10 one day and maybe 1 on another, etc. It breaks down to 4 a day. And I'm pretty sure that's not that terrible. I'm physically in the best shape I've ever been in as well.

So yeah, I think alcohol gets too hard a rap. Yeah, I had 17 shots when my girlfriend of 2.5 years dumped me. And that wasn't healthy. But those are unhealthy moments and shouldn't define my overall drinking pattern. I just like booze. I like the taste, I like how it makes me feel (especially at the end of a rough day), and its just fun to have when watching a hilarious movie.

What's the harm.

As long as you're not a mean drunk and not getting into cars to drive while you're drunk..... there is no harm to "others".

But it can harm "you". I'm sure you know of the physical effects that drinking can have on the body when a person is a moderate drinker.

I myself will have occasional drinks but not really enough to say that I drink.
(at least not anymore)

Anyways......... when I seen your end statement "What's the harm" I had to respond. I lost my mom about 6 years ago because of her drinking. She was only 54.

But it can harm "you". I'm sure you know of the physical effects that drinking can have on the body when a person is a moderate drinker.
Moderate drinking, studies show, has a positive effect on one's health. Doctors recommend things like a glass of red wine every day. It's drinking beyond moderation that is dangerous.

Moderate drinking, studies show, has a positive effect on one's health. Doctors recommend things like a glass of red wine every day. It's drinking beyond moderation that is dangerous.


It was late when I posted that. When I said moderate I was thinking more along the lines of more then a few drinks a day. Sorry. Guess I should have went to bed instead of posting LOL

A few drinks a day is fine too, for men at least. I think the limit of healthy is 2 for women, 3-4 for men?

A few drinks a day is fine too, for men at least. I think the limit of healthy is 2 for women, 3-4 for men?
I think more than three a day is the definition of heavy drinking, not the safe limit. Myself, I'll have a beer sometime during the night if they're available, but usually not more than one. It's a good place to be because the effects on your behavior at one drink are negligible (for most people), but it affects your health positively.

EDIT: "Moderate consumption of alcohol is defined by the U.S. Department of Agriculture and the Dietary Guidelines for Americans as no more than two drinks for men and one drink for women per day."

Hah... let's tally up how many drinks I had on New Year's.

Well that bottle of vodka had at least 10 shots in it. Probably more like 12.

And then those 4-5 hard lemonades. So those are like beers.

Then 2 actual beers.

And I think there may have been a shot of Jack in there too.

Well, all in all, 16-20 drinks. And all of that washed down with about 1000 mg of caffeine in pill form.

Then all those bowls I smoked... Yeesh I can't even begin to count those.

Hah... let's tally up how many drinks I had on New Year's.

Well that bottle of vodka had at least 10 shots in it. Probably more like 12.

And then those 4-5 hard lemonades. So those are like beers.

Then 2 actual beers.

And I think there may have been a shot of Jack in there too.

Well, all in all, 16-20 drinks. And all of that washed down with about 1000 mg of caffeine in pill form.

Then all those bowls I smoked... Yeesh I can't even begin to count those.
:@@: More then what I do at parties.

Well I only party like once every couple months now. That used to be pretty close to what I did almost every night. So forgive me if my tolerance hasn't slowed down as much as my desire to party.

And she isn't even 17 yet!

And she isn't even 17 yet!
Lots of people in high school drink, and the percentage goes up to, like, 100% in college.

Though that amount is excessive, yes.

Blah... I feel like a horrible person for drinking. When will my overactive conscience stop?

Blah... I feel like a horrible person for drinking. When will my overactive conscience stop?
Never! Soon you'll be gripping the headboard and reciting baseball statistics in an effort to not enjoy sex.

Oh my god. What am I saying?! NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

Hah... let's tally up how many drinks I had on New Year's.

Well that bottle of vodka had at least 10 shots in it. Probably more like 12.

And then those 4-5 hard lemonades. So those are like beers.

Then 2 actual beers.

And I think there may have been a shot of Jack in there too.

Well, all in all, 16-20 drinks. And all of that washed down with about 1000 mg of caffeine in pill form.

Then all those bowls I smoked... Yeesh I can't even begin to count those.

Wow and this is not excessive drinking. It may only be once or twice in a blue moon but at your age which is at least 4 years under your drinking laws is too much.. I am not judging you or saying you are a bad person. I am speaking in general. Yes it is your life to live but think how it looks for the outside looking in. Borg may say drinking a glass a day of wine is good for you, hummm maybe it is not saying its not.....but at a legal adult age also this statistic was made.
I'm not sure what people get out of getting shit faced and drinking to just keep drinking. A social drink here and there is not a big deal at any age you could say but to drink until you get plastered is.

I did my fair share of being stupid when I was younger but there is so much more to life then getting wasted or drinking. I have watched it screw up to many people to find this an appealing act. That is just my opinion and is not for everyone and every one is different.

I did my fair share of being stupid when I was younger but there is so much more to life then getting wasted or drinking. I have watched it screw up to many people to find this an appealing act. That is just my opinion and is not for everyone and every one is different.
Shorty, dont be too hard on Darkie.
I spent the same years of my life doing exactly what she's doing now. Soon enough, she'll have a better understanding of what's going on in the world and grow out of it. I did it, you did it, and most everyone here has too. Criminy, I used to go to school with a case of beer in the fridge of my van. Mostly for breakfast, and would polish it off at lunch. By the time the morning bell rang, it looked like the Yesca van in "Up in Smoke".

I was a party animal at her age and didn't turn out so bad. I imagine she'll do the same.

Never! Soon you'll be gripping the headboard and reciting baseball statistics in an effort to not enjoy sex.

Oh my god. What am I saying?! NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!
Borg, I have a couple of books you can borrow so you can test your theory.

I think Shorty's concern is the same as mine... partying like this at 16 will leave the little miss a burned out old hag by age 21. College-age boozing is one thing. Under-age binges quite another. Excessive alcohol is bad not only for the liver, but brain cells, skin, eyes, etc. It's sad to sit back and watch a young woman self-destruct.

I'm not condoning it, but the only way she'll get it out her system is by doing it. It's a phase and she'll pull through just fine. If she doesnt, I'll open a can of whoop-ass on her to straighten her out.

I'm not condoning it, but the only way she'll get it out her system is by doing it. It's a phase and she'll pull through just fine. If she doesnt, I'll open a can of whoop-ass on her to straighten her out.

And I'm gonna hold you to that can of whoop-ass treatment.

:banana:

DF. You not studying today, girl.

Wow.. it's not like I have a case of beer in my fridge and drink it every day. It was New Year's, I hadn't had a drink at all since October, hadn't been drunk since August at least... Didn't say it was an everyday thing and didn't say I felt good about it, because I don't. Anyways I think it's safe to say that I won't be mixing caffeine pills with alcohol anymore because after 1000 mg of caffeine your tolerance really goes up. I wasn't even extremely drunk.

I wasn't even extremely drunk.
Thats what I said when I tried to teach my car how to swim. Some things just dont learn very well

Thats what I said when I tried to teach my car how to swim. Some things just dont learn very well
Hahahah! Oh god... I always hear about other people doing stupid things while drunk, but the stupidest thing I've ever remembered OR heard about later that I've done was stealing a lesbian away from her girlfriend and then falling down in the middle of the dance floor. Other than that I just tend to sit there and stare at everything and laugh when I'm drunk.

Hahahah! Oh god... I always hear about other people doing stupid things while drunk, but the stupidest thing I've ever remembered OR heard about later that I've done was stealing a lesbian away from her girlfriend .

I need to get some pointers from you. The last time I tried that I wound up with a black eye.....

Shorty, dont be too hard on Darkie.
I spent the same years of my life doing exactly what she's doing now. Soon enough, she'll have a better understanding of what's going on in the world and grow out of it. I did it, you did it, and most everyone here has too. Criminy, I used to go to school with a case of beer in the fridge of my van. Mostly for breakfast, and would polish it off at lunch. By the time the morning bell rang, it looked like the Yesca van in "Up in Smoke".

I was a party animal at her age and didn't turn out so bad. I imagine she'll do the same.


Like I was saying I am not judging her at all. She has the god given right to do as she pleases with her body and mind..What I was try to articulate was that social drinking is much different from getting shit faced.
Personal growth and maturity comes in time and with experience and I just feel the drinking laws are there to prevent a lot more mishaps then we have right now...is all.

Like I was saying I am not judging her at all. She has the god given right to do as she pleases with her body and mind..What I was try to articulate was that social drinking is much different from getting shit faced.
Personal growth and maturity comes in time and with experience and I just feel the drinking laws are there to prevent a lot more mishaps then we have right now...is all.
Laws are made to be broken, rules are made to be bent, and everything is open to interpretation.

Guess it all depends on what your goals are. Just glad to see not all teenagers are hell-bent on breaking laws, bending rules and liberal interpretations of what's right or wrong.

UK teen completes record solo sail
POSTED: 1902 GMT (0302 HKT), January 3, 2007

LONDON, England -- A British teenager on Wednesday entered the record books after reaching Antigua to become the youngest person ever to sail single-handed across the Atlantic Ocean.

Michael Perham, 14, took six weeks to complete the 5,600-kilometer (3,500-mile) voyage from Gibraltar to the Caribbean island in his 8.5-meter (28-feet) boat Cheeky Monkey.

Perham contended with giant waves, shark-infested waters and hurricane winds to reach his destination, the UK's Press Association.

A last-minute hitch with a sail also delayed his arrival by 24 hours.

"This is an amazing moment. Michael has become the most famous teenager in the world and an inspiration to millions of youngsters," family spokesman Kizzi Nkwocha said, according to Reuters.

"I've just spoken to him and he's completely overwhelmed by the huge public support his adventure has attracted. He is looking forward to being back on dry land, having a decent steak meal and seeing his family and friends again."

He was looking forward to the comforts of his Playstation, a steak meal, and going to bed without being wet, he added.

Although he has completed the voyage solo, Perham's father Peter, an experienced yachtsman, has been shadowing the trip in regular radio contact with his son, PA said.

The previous record for the youngest person to cross the Atlantic was set by 15-year-old Sebastian Clover from the Isle of Wight, who sailed from the Canary Islands to Antigua in January 2003.

Michael's mother Heather said from her north London home her son loved a challenge and had been inspired by Clover's exploits, Reuters said.

Whenever I hear about these teenagers accomplishing things I feel bad. I don't have any goals. I used to, but I'm just not interested in anything anymore.

Whenever I hear about these teenagers accomplishing things I feel bad. I don't have any goals. I used to, but I'm just not interested in anything anymore.
Please don't think it's too late, DF. You may be a 'senior member' but you're not exactly over the hill yet! You can do ANYTHING you set your mind to. It may be too late for lots of us 'old geezers' around here, but it's certainly not too late for your dreams to come true.

You can do ANYTHING you set your mind to.
This line of thought is really a load of crap. I wish parents would stop handing this bullshit to their kids. It leads to all manner of irresponsible behavior.

Whenever I hear about these teenagers accomplishing things I feel bad. I don't have any goals. I used to, but I'm just not interested in anything anymore.
Setting goals is a societal value that is highly over rated. Most rule oriented folks will tell you that in order to achieve anything in this life you must have goals. That is bullshit. I have never set a goal for anything my whole life and I am happier than 90% of the people I know. I have a great life materially, mentally and emotionally.

Focus on doing the best you can in each and every situation. Analyze later if you used your full potential and how you could have done better. Screw the rest. Most will tell you that won't work. Perhaps you are different than most. Chose your own path.

This line of thought is really a load of crap. I wish parents would stop handing this bullshit to their kids. It leads to all manner of irresponsible behavior.
Agreed!

Setting goals is a societal value that is highly over rated. Most rule oriented folks will tell you that in order to achieve anything in this life you must have goals. That is bullshit. I have never set a goal for anything my whole life and I am happier than 90% of the people I know. I have a great life materially, mentally and emotionally.

Focus on doing the best you can in each and every situation. Analyze later if you used your full potential and how you could have done better. Screw the rest. Most will tell you that won't work. Perhaps you are different than most. Chose your own path.

Thanks :D You always seem to have a really logical way of looking at things.

Short term goals are useful in providing incentive and direction. Long term goals for most get lost in the chaos of daily living.

A great many parents are overly protective of their offspring to the point where the that child is nearly incapable of facing the realities of independent living. They are doing their children a great disservice in that regard.

Well I have plenty of short term goals, but nothing like my life-long dream to accomplish some great bullshit...

Thanks :D You always seem to have a really logical way of looking at things.
Welcome... I have just never done things the way others "think" they should be done. Sometimes it made me sort of feel less than. You have to live with yourself, not how someone else thinks about you. Make sure you are right with yourself and everything else will follow.

This line of thought is really a load of crap. I wish parents would stop handing this bullshit to their kids. It leads to all manner of irresponsible behavior.


Agreed, teach them proper behaviour and realism... Life is hard and not always fair.
Many of us have our own crosses to bare or things in our past that we wish we could do over. Pain and suffering seem to go hand and hand. I just worry what people look for when they drink. It is easy to get lost in the world and not try and get back on track especially when one drinks or uses drugs.

This line of thought is really a load of crap. I wish parents would stop handing this bullshit to their kids. It leads to all manner of irresponsible behavior.
Ah, so you should tell your kid that he's nobody and he's not going to amount to anything...

Yes, that's exactly what you should tell them.

Or, you could be realistic about things and give them something real to shoot for, not, "anything their heart's desire."

Kids whose parents tell them they can do anything they set their mind to, are the kids that try out for American Idol and get jeered at and humiliated. Mummy usually thinks they sing well too. Pathetic.

The gift of realism is invaluable.

My parents always told me I could do anything I wanted.... But I have about the opposite of an unrealistic faith in my abilities. My fear of failure prevents any such American Idol type debacles.

Yes, that's exactly what you should tell them.

Or, you could be realistic about things and give them something real to shoot for, not, "anything their heart's desire."

I agree completely. Having a positive outlook and working hard are one thing, but spending your life trying to be the first blind F1 driver is a waste of everyone's time, effort, and money.

Kids whose parents tell them they can do anything they set their mind to, are the kids that try out for American Idol and get jeered at and humiliated. Mummy usually thinks they sing well too. Pathetic.

The gift of realism is invaluable.They are also the kids who become doctors, lawyers, astronauts, President. If you dont allow your child at least the "idea" that anything they work their asses off to achieve is possible (not probable), that can lead to a stunted outlook on the future and a "Why even try" attitude, IMO.

It's better to encourage than discourage in my humble opinion.

Hmm see, my parents told me I could do anything I wanted... And here I am, with social anxiety and a crippling fear of failure! A bit of an oxymoron...

They are also the kids who become doctors, lawyers, astronauts, President. If you dont allow your child at least the "idea" that anything they work their asses off to achieve is possible (not probable), that can lead to a stunted outlook on the future and a "Why even try" attitude, IMO.

It's better to encourage than discourage in my humble opinion.

Why do people seem to think that lack of negative encouragement is the same thing as negative discouragement? There is such a thing as positive discouragement, you know.

Are you guys suggesting that if your born and Educated in the United States theres only so far you can go in achieveing your ambitions, or is it a case of taking a step back, and being more realistic about those ambitions in the first place.

Paul, there's a difference between ambitions, and blind dreams. An ambition is a realizable destination; encouraging children to follow blind dreams is setting them up for failure.

What a load of CRAP!!

I expected as much from Nappy, but SAL??? You're all for discouraging young people by forcing them to see the ugly side of reality?? A reality they might never have to experience if they chose a path different from the one YOU pick for them?

No wonder kids have such a tough time today.

I have a news flash for you who would discourage DF to 'live her dreams.' The decisions she makes TODAY will determine what her life is like twenty years from now. Now I could choose as destructive a path as I like for my own life, and twenty years from now I'll still be a dottering ole lady. But twenty years from now, DF could be a DOCTOR, ATTY, anything she's smart enough to strive for! At the ripe old age of 36, she could be financially set for life and doing something meaningful and emotionally rewarding every day.

OR she could be a pot-smoking single mother of a houseful of unmotivated brats who barely scrapes by each month on public assistance.

For you both to discourage her is shameful. DF appears to be an INTELLIGENT young woman who's striving to find her place in this world. Unless we encourage such children to follow their dreams, we're setting up a whole generation that's considered lost before even having a chance for greatness.

Just because the two of YOU have accepted a second-rate life doesn't mean SHE should.

Like I said SHAME ON YOU BOTH!

:(
SMW

Hmm see, my parents told me I could do anything I wanted...
Darkie,
Your parents are right, but what it is and how you get there is purely going to be up to you. Nobody's going to do it for you, and dont expect much help.

And here I am, with social anxiety and a crippling fear of failure! A bit of an oxymoron...
The social anxiety is natural for your age. You're still trying to define who you are. You'll grow out of it, so dont worry too much about it.

"A crippling fear of failure"? I doubt that. If you had one, you would lock yourself in your room and never socialize with anyone. A fear of failure is natural though. Thats what gives you the drive to succeed and prove to yourself that youre not a failure.
A fear of success is a different story. This is the fear that makes you change direction midstream and never finish what you start. This is the only real stumbling block to being the person you want to be. You overcome this (and it's harder than you think) and there isnt anything you wont be able to do.

Yeah, uh... I actually started this thread when I was drunk. So it's quite entertaining to read everything now that I'm sober. While several good points have been made, I most agree with Napsterbater's 2nd post.

I'm an over 6 foot, 185 pound guy. I have a relatively high tolerance, so on campus it appears that I drink more heavily. Which is still true, but it looks worse to others. I can have a good 4-5 drinks and barely feel the effects. I was once able to have 8 shots and no one could even tell I'd had them.

I've also never physically harmed anyone drunk, I've always kept myself in control. I had a small handful of occasions where I couldn't walk, but otherwise I'm a very controlled drinker. I almost never have blackouts.

I have an average of 4 drinks a day. And by that I mean I'll have 10 one day and maybe 1 on another, etc. It breaks down to 4 a day. And I'm pretty sure that's not that terrible. I'm physically in the best shape I've ever been in as well.

So yeah, I think alcohol gets too hard a rap. Yeah, I had 17 shots when my girlfriend of 2.5 years dumped me. And that wasn't healthy. But those are unhealthy moments and shouldn't define my overall drinking pattern. I just like booze. I like the taste, I like how it makes me feel (especially at the end of a rough day), and its just fun to have when watching a hilarious movie.

What's the harm.

If you blackout from drinking, your kinda dumb You could, and Im being serious, die from that crap. I, in all the nights Ive been out drinking, have never myself, nor any of my friends blacked out. And by blackout I mean, your missing some time and you have no idea what happened during that time. Ive had some seriously heavy nights before too, like 20 drink nights. Say what you will, drinking that heavy is like a once every month or two occurance, I dont even hardly drink at all in between. But to the point of blacking out? Naw. I always stumble to a cab, or home, or maybe im already home when Im drinking. (and by home these days, I mean the barracks.) But since I always go out with no less than maybe 3 other people, we keep a look out for eachother. To be honest, Ive never even puked from drinking. Ive wanted to kill myself the next day I felt so bad, but Ive never puked. And I always remember going to bed the night before. So yeah.

Paul, there's a difference between ambitions, and blind dreams. An ambition is a realizable destination; encouraging children to follow blind dreams is setting them up for failure.
That may be Nap. Tho I would have thought that America, if nowhere else, would be the place to reach your goal. Prehaps America in the real world is not that place.

Well, see, the whole problem with this discussion is that I don't want to be a doctor or a lawyer. Once I get married and have kids I'm planning on being a stay at home mom, but before that or if plans change, my two most wanted jobs are librarian and secretary.

I expected as much from Nappy, but SAL??? You're all for discouraging young people by forcing them to see the ugly side of reality?? A reality they might never have to experience if they chose a path different from the one YOU pick for them?

There's a definite difference between being realistic and actually discouraging people. Hard work will only get you so far. It's amazing how many resumes I see where people are completely and totally unqualified but somehow they think they can figure out how to do the job because they "learn fast and work hard." I'm not saying that everyone shouldn't aim high, but I just see way too many people with completely unrealistic notions of what they can achieve.

Well, see, the whole problem with this discussion is that I don't want to be a doctor or a lawyer. Once I get married and have kids I'm planning on being a stay at home mom, but before that or if plans change, my two most wanted jobs are librarian and secretary.

I didn't realize you had such limited expectations for your life because you seem to be such an intelligent person. There's no shame in wanting to be a soccer mom. And if that's what you long for... here's hoping you find a man to support you. Just don't settle for that because you don't think you could ever do anything more serious, because I have no doubt you could.

"The whole purpose of education is to turn mirrors into windows." Sydney J. Harris

Well, my mother's generation was the rebellious one in my family... Basically, by having a basically normal life (college, marriage, kids, house and car in the suburbs...), I'm completely rebelling from what my parents did. I believe someone mentioned a 36 year old pot-smoking single mother on welfare? ::cough MY MOM cough:: Hehe...

Well, my mother's generation was the rebellious one in my family... Basically, by having a basically normal life (college, marriage, kids, house and car in the suburbs...), I'm completely rebelling from what my parents did. I believe someone mentioned a 36 year old pot-smoking single mother on welfare? ::cough MY MOM cough:: Hehe...

Other than the college part, sounds to me like you strive to be EXACTLY like your mother! Without marriage, kids, house and car in the suburbs, how do you expect to live out your dream of being a stay-at-home mom?

Ahhhh, pot... the great de-motivator. Amazing how rosy the world looks through that marijuana fog, ain't it? Just add a little alcohol and one can practically walk on water.

Wait, what? I said I'm going to have marriage, kids, a house and a car in the suburbs... I'm also going to college, but then again my mom did that too.

Wait, what? I said I'm going to have marriage, kids, a house and a car in the suburbs... I'm also going to college, but then again my mom did that too.
If I'm not mistaken, SMW meant to ask what would happen if your plans for marriage, 2.5 kids, house, car fell through.

Well like I said a couple posts up, plans change... I'm going to college, I can get a job.

Yea, ya gotta be flexable with your plans, at your age DF, you could be into one thing this year andanother thing next.

Good advice, Paul. Hopefully, she won't have any problem finding that Mr. Right who'll happily support her and the kids so she can stay home. Didn't work out for me and I've been looking for that guy my whole damn life! For some reason, they all expect me to carry my own share!

The nerve!!

Well I think I've found him. :D

Well I think I've found him. :D
Way to go, Borg! You the man, dude.

;)

Why do people seem to think that lack of negative encouragement is the same thing as negative discouragement? There is such a thing as positive discouragement, you know.
What would be an example of positive discouragement?

What would be an example of positive discouragement?

Telling your children that it is extremely unlikely for them to become the president/an athlete/a supermodel... If that's what they're going for, they should have a back-up plan.

It is said that true alcoholics need to "hit bottom" before they will accept rehabilitation. Loss of job, fortune, family, etc. Rather than allowing that to take place, those doing the intervention modify the place at which "bottom" takes place, thereby getting the individual into treatment and on the road to true recovery before permanant damage is done. That would be an example of postive discouragement.

Well I think we were talking about positively discouraging one's offspring.

What I described would work with offspring as well. Some might call it "tough love".

Ah, youve done this before es.

Good advice, Paul. Hopefully, she won't have any problem finding that Mr. Right who'll happily support her and the kids so she can stay home. Didn't work out for me and I've been looking for that guy my whole damn life! For some reason, they all expect me to carry my own share!

The nerve!!
I'll send you a PM when Im available.

Ah, youve done this before es.

For me, it's a well traveled road, Paul.

What a load of CRAP!!

Wow, had a bad sleep did ya?

I expected as much from Nappy, but SAL??? You're all for discouraging young people by forcing them to see the ugly side of reality?? A reality they might never have to experience if they chose a path different from the one YOU pick for them?
Nice misinterpretation.


I have a news flash for you who would discourage DF to 'live her dreams.' The decisions she makes TODAY will determine what her life is like twenty years from now. Now I could choose as destructive a path as I like for my own life, and twenty years from now I'll still be a dottering ole lady. But twenty years from now, DF could be a DOCTOR, ATTY, anything she's smart enough to strive for! At the ripe old age of 36, she could be financially set for life and doing something meaningful and emotionally rewarding every day. Maybe you could point out specifically where all the discouragment happened. Cause I think you are perhaps in the wrong thread.


OR she could be a pot-smoking single mother of a houseful of unmotivated brats who barely scrapes by each month on public assistance. And your point would be?

For you both to discourage her is shameful. IF that's what had been done, it would be. However it was not so it is not.
DF appears to be an INTELLIGENT young woman who's striving to find her place in this world. At least here you've cooled down enough to get rational for a moment.


Just because the two of YOU have accepted a second-rate life doesn't mean SHE should. Very nice SMW!


Like I said SHAME ON YOU BOTH! All I am going to say is, you don't get it.

Are you guys suggesting that if your born and Educated in the United States theres only so far you can go in achieveing your ambitions, or is it a case of taking a step back, and being more realistic about those ambitions in the first place.
Actually I wasn't suggesting anything specific with it. I was merely addressing specific posts made by specific people.

They are also the kids who become doctors, lawyers, astronauts, President. If you dont allow your child at least the "idea" that anything they work their asses off to achieve is possible (not probable), that can lead to a stunted outlook on the future and a "Why even try" attitude, IMO.

It's better to encourage than discourage in my humble opinion.

HaVok, the simple reality is someone with an IQ of 130 is not going to be a doctor or a lawyer or an astronaut or the President even if they do work their asses off. However, that is irrelevant if the person has peace of mind and is happy. Also those professions are not the only ones that make a tremendous amount of money if money is what this is really all about and it isn't. It's about success in life, and success in life can not be measured easily and is certainly not merely about career.

Encouragement is a good thing, yes.

HaVok, the simple reality is someone with an IQ of 130 is not going to be a doctor or a lawyer or an astronaut or the President even if they do work their asses off. However, that is irrelevant if the person has peace of mind and is happy. Also those professions are not the only ones that make a tremendous amount of money if money is what this is really all about and it isn't. It's about success in life, and success in life can not be measured easily and is certainly not merely about career.

Encouragement is a good thing, yes.


Not to be a pain.... but an IQ of 130 puts a person in the top 4% of the tested subjects... I think it's also the MENSA minimum requirement for admission based on Stanford-Bennett intelligence tests. I would say that an IQ of 130 would do quite well in the professions you listed (along with a good work/study ethic, and no ethics for your last example ;) )

/wave @ Sal

That may be Nap. Tho I would have thought that America, if nowhere else, would be the place to reach your goal. Prehaps America in the real world is not that place.
America is a perfect place to achieve your dreams. They, however, must be realistic. What is great about America is that more things are realistic here than anywhere else.

Sal's mistake made me laugh out loud. ;)

What a load of CRAP!!

I expected as much from Nappy, but SAL??? You're all for discouraging young people by forcing them to see the ugly side of reality?? A reality they might never have to experience if they chose a path different from the one YOU pick for them?

No wonder kids have such a tough time today.

I have a news flash for you who would discourage DF to 'live her dreams.' The decisions she makes TODAY will determine what her life is like twenty years from now. Now I could choose as destructive a path as I like for my own life, and twenty years from now I'll still be a dottering ole lady. But twenty years from now, DF could be a DOCTOR, ATTY, anything she's smart enough to strive for! At the ripe old age of 36, she could be financially set for life and doing something meaningful and emotionally rewarding every day.

OR she could be a pot-smoking single mother of a houseful of unmotivated brats who barely scrapes by each month on public assistance.

For you both to discourage her is shameful. DF appears to be an INTELLIGENT young woman who's striving to find her place in this world. Unless we encourage such children to follow their dreams, we're setting up a whole generation that's considered lost before even having a chance for greatness.

Just because the two of YOU have accepted a second-rate life doesn't mean SHE should.

Like I said SHAME ON YOU BOTH!

:(
SMW
You really shouldn't be talking, being a stupid ho and all.

You really shouldn't be talking, being a stupid ho and all.

Aww, Nappy, did someone get up on the wrong side of the bed?