Some years ago the media created a fictional myth of the ‘religious right’. Something along the lines of ‘Religion’ taking power in America, and erasing freedoms, yada, yada, yada. Never mind the reality that was right in front of us, of the continuing loss of religious influences across all boundaries, the continuing diversity of all religions, the inability to attract clergy, the increasing median age of church goers, etc….

As an example, I even had someone tell me that ‘Religion’ tells a person to hate gay people, and to inflict violence upon them. I’m thinking: “Sure queer bait. This is something that ‘Religion’ taught you, a person who doesn’t even go to church.” I mean, am I the only person who went to a high school where people that were ‘different’ were ostracized and tormented? Yeah, like if you were gay, and it got out in school, like you would pee in your pants worrying about the ‘Jesus freaks’.

The only reason I bring this up, is that people seldom stand up for the ‘Legend’ that is American religion. And yes, it is a ‘Legend’ in its own time. In the light of all of the ‘religious’ turmoil in modern culture, doesn’t American’s example of ‘Religion’ shine out? Just as a small example, why are American Shias and Sunnis not amazing militias and gunning each other down? I mean, if there was a model of how religion can interact with both society and politics, can you give a better example than America?

The Lebanon did a pretty good job of it.

Some years ago the media created a fictional myth of the ‘religious right’. Something along the lines of ‘Religion’ taking power in America, and erasing freedoms, yada, yada, yada. Never mind the reality that was right in front of us, of the continuing loss of religious influences across all boundaries….

Wow.

That screed is filled with so many falsehoods it's hard to know where to begin.

a) The 'religious right' was neither fictional, nor was it a 'myth'.

It was (and is) a tangible entity and force in American society, as real and discernible as the KKK, or the Boy Scouts or the Chamber of Commerce.

Back when it gained supreme prominence, it was known as the *Moral Majority*. Millions upon millions of devout followers of the movement are still with us today......STILL working toward the same goals of bringing this government and this society under the heel of its Christian ideology and its agenda........and to ceaslessly coerce the Washington political crowd to pass legislation that will codify its superstitions, prejudices and religious edicts into the law of the land. .

b) the Religious right was not in anyway created "by the media" but was dreamed up by, spawned by and created by various religious hucksters such as Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson, and was endlessly cowtowed to by the political classes, led by rightwing political stalwarts such as Newt Gingrich.

c) the Religious Right did weild tremendous power in this society, and ceaselessly sought to abridge various freedoms of American citizens who did not happen to go along with its totalitarianist-leaning, sanctimonius, holier-than-thou agenda.

The small band of advocates for a completely secularist goverment in America is still forced to fight tooth and nail against the dominant Religious Right on various fronts at the ballot box every election, ......on issues like gay rights, abortion and pornograpy.


As an example, I even had someone tell me that ‘Religion’ tells a person to hate gay people, and to inflict violence upon them.

If we are to count the edicts of the Bible itself as being what *religion tells a person to do* (and I cannot imagine how it could be construed as being otherwsie) , then it is absolutely true and correct to assert that --"Religion tells people to hate gay people, and to inflict violence upon them".

Great post, Shadowalker. Any time you get Freethinker disagreeing with you, you know you are right.

Great post, Shadowalker. Any time you get Freethinker disagreeing with you, you know you are right.

ROTFL.

Translated into non-bull shit:--- "I can’t think of anything intelligent to say, and I have no refutation for the points Freethinker has made, but puling --"Any time you get Freethinker disagreeing with you, you know you are right"-- always makes us Reichwingers feel warm and tingly inside and earns me some serious Conservative brownie points.

Free, he does make a great point about the fact that there's something in the American psyche or culture that allows religions to interact better than almost anywhere else in the world.

Also, I looked up screed. I think Shadow's post was to the point and not at all repetitive (or monotonous).

And extra credit goes to someone here who can open a thread without sending us to a link to a long article by some malcontent we've never heard of. Some original text. How novel.

Wow.

That screed is filled with so many falsehoods it's hard to know where to begin.

a) The 'religious right' was neither fictional, nor was it a 'myth'.

It was (and is) a tangible entity and force in American society, as real and discernible as the KKK, or the Boy Scouts or the Chamber of Commerce.

Back when it gained supreme prominence, it was known as the *Moral Majority*. Millions upon millions of devout followers of the movement are still with us today......STILL working toward the same goals of bringing this government and this society under the heel of its Christian ideology and its agenda........and to ceaslessly coerce the Washington political crowd to pass legislation that will codify its superstitions, prejudices and religious edicts into the law of the land. .

b) the Religious right was not in anyway created "by the media" but was dreamed up by, spawned by and created by various religious hucksters such as Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson, and was endlessly cowtowed to by the political classes, led by rightwing political stalwarts such as Newt Gingrich.

c) the Religious Right did weild tremendous power in this society, and ceaselessly sought to abridge various freedoms of American citizens who did not happen to go along with its totalitarianist-leaning, sanctimonius, holier-than-thou agenda.

The small band of advocates for a completely secularist goverment in America is still forced to fight tooth and nail against the dominant Religious Right on various fronts at the ballot box every election, ......on issues like gay rights, abortion and pornograpy.




If we are to count the edicts of the Bible itself as being what *religion tells a person to do* (and I cannot imagine how it could be construed as being otherwsie) , then it is absolutely true and correct to assert that --"Religion tells people to hate gay people, and to inflict violence upon them".


The falsehood is the magic trick in its entirety. I’m simply pointing out the steps between. Part of what you are referring too, is the reality that we have a conservative collection of voters, as well as a collection of religious voters. The illusion happens in the presentation of the media generated word ‘religious right’. They want to turn the perception of something, into reality, but really, did you honestly think for a moment that the elephant truly disappeared into thin air? No, but if you didn’t play along, David Copperfield wouldn’t be a household name.

The reality still stands that the influence of religion on society has continued to diminish from the founding days of our nation and where it has held fast, it has done so with dignity, professionalism, and tact. Take for example, ‘blue laws’, was there massive and violent public demonstrations when these were taken off the books? Did people use their 2nd Amendment right to take to the streets with arms, to defend the very core of their, how did you say that “superstitions, prejudices, and religious edicts”. No. It was peaceful.

The fact remains that part of the system is the right of the individual to express their opinion, and not have their opinion viewed in an alternative light, based upon the prejudices and preconceived notions of others. That’s all the media monikers do, is attempt to justify a reason as to why one opinion is on solid ground, and where another is not. As far as crediting Falwell and Robertson for the moniker, I think you are giving them far to much credit, which is probably exactly what they would like to enjoy, a majority that doesn’t exist, except in myth.

And what name does this ‘small’ collection of heroes go by, that are so vigilant fighting for their “superstitions, and prejudices? Oh, right, that’s supposed to be the ‘us’ group.

Try reading the Bible first, before you make such grossly incorrect accusations. For starters, the OT alone is written in a langue which is considered fluid, or dynamic: meaning that a single word could have multiple meanings. In addition it uses symbols which have both phonetic as well as numeric meaning. Which I mentioned in another thread of the Hollywoodization of the mark of the beast into 666. Which was never a number in the first place, but instead the name for Nero, only I digress, because I jumped into the NT, and another language entirely.

But you really skirted the issue anyway. Are you really suggesting that, as an example, hatred of ‘gays’ springs forth from religious texts?

Free, he does make a great point about the fact that there's something in the American psyche or culture that allows religions to interact better than almost anywhere else in the world.

Also, I looked up screed. I think Shadow's post was to the point and not at all repetitive (or monotonous).

And extra credit goes to someone here who can open a thread without sending us to a link to a long article by some malcontent we've never heard of. Some original text. How novel.


Which was more the meat of what I was trying to point out. Sometimes the veracity of one side over the other excels to the point where we falsely create ‘situations’ that are more embellishments than anything else. When all the while, our systems kick in, and do what they have been doing for hundreds of years.

... as the KKK, or the Boy Scouts or the Chamber of Commerce. ...

Don't believe those 3 groups have ever been placed in the same sentence before. How did you manage that?

Free, he does make a great point about the fact that there's something in the North American psyche or culture that allows religions to interact better than almost anywhere else in the world.

I don't know if one can say "better", I would say, "more perniciously" of this interaction of religion with the people (or with that fanatic 30% of the people), of the United States of North America.
I hope all of you remember that imbecile that right after the bombing of New York on the 11 September 2001, he said: "They have attacked the Nation of God", who or where did he found those words, very well used in a moment of massive hysteria. Anyway, that idea of being "chosen ones", and that they are already "saved" is what drives these extremists into pushing their agenda on the rest of the people, no different than what the Ayatollahs of Talibans do or did to their people. At least they haven't started to cut fingers or hands ... yet!

And extra credit goes to someone here who can open a thread without sending us to a link to a long article by some malcontent we've never heard of. Some original text. How novel.

That's some thinking I can get behind.