Will GOP Lose Control of the Senate?
By Paul Strand


- CAMP HILL, Pennsylvania -The most watched Senate race in the country this year pits Senator Rick Santorum (R) against Pennsylvania State Treasurer Bob Casey (D).

Democrats would love to avenge the defeat of their Tom Daschle by knocking the high-level, high-profile Santorum out of power.

But there is much more on the line here, possibly control of the U.S. Senate itself.

Rick Santorum feels, as the number three-ranking Republican in the Senate, that he has a big bulls-eye on his back, put there by the Democrats.

"This is the race where they're going to knock off a Republican leader in a state where John Kerry won," said Santorum.

And the stakes couldn't be higher.

This campaign is right at the center of the nation's interest right now, because if Santorum goes down, so could Republican control of the U.S. Senate.

So many polls had Santorum down so far, for so long, it gave Democrats real hope they really could defeat Santorum -- and the five other Republican senators they need to bump off to re-take the Senate.

Sandy Snyder, a Pennsylvania Democrat, said, "I hope that we can re-take the majority and run all the committees."

And the Democrats could hardly have been more clever in who they've thrown up against Santorum: pro-life Catholic Robert Casey Junior. Casey is the state treasurer, but also son of the popular Governor Bob Casey, so fiercely pro-life that Democrats slapped him down by denying him a chance to address their 1992 national convention.

Casey talked about his famous father recently at his alma mater, Catholic University.

"And those of you with long memories can recall a dark night in 1992 when the national Democratic party insulted the most courageous pro-life Democrat in the land," Casey said.

With a chance to take back the Senate and knock off a key Republican, many pro-choice Democrats are willing to ignore Casey's pro-life leanings.

Snyder said, "I would prefer that he were pro-choice and he's not. But he's far better than Santorum on so many other issues."

More important, though, many pro-life Democrats who in the past pulled the lever for Santorum are probably now flirting with a Casey vote.

But Santorum asks just how pro-life Casey is, pointing out that the Democrat backs the morning-after pill, which Santorum says will lead to many uncounted, unseen abortions.

And, said Santorum, "He has already come out and said he would filibuster judges for the federal court. And that, as you know, filibustering judges by the Democrats is an attempt by the left to block pro-lifers to get on the court. So, he may say he's pro-life. He's not following through."

We asked Casey why Republicans should back him over Santorum. He said he'll deal with some of their top concerns, like soaring federal deficits and a ballooning national debt.

"I think they're very concerned about that question of fiscal responsibility," he said. "I think they're also very concerned about ethics. And they see what happens in Washington: all of the dishonesty and the deceit."

But on one of the issues dearest to conservative hearts these days -- stopping same-sex marriage -- Santorum says Casey doesn't measure up.

"He is not for a constitutional amendment either in Washington or here in Pennsylvania, to protect the institution of marriage. He's for civil unions, he's for gay adoption. He spoke to the national Human Rights Campaign and has been courting the gay community very actively," Santorum said.

As for other slams against Santorum, Casey accuses him of backing President Bush, who isn't very popular in Pennsylvania, almost 100 percent of the time, and caring more about his own climb up the political ladder than the state he represents.

Casey said, "I think he left behind a lot of the priorities of the people of Pennsylvania and America, and I think people have an understanding that when you vote one way 98 percent of the time, you're not independent enough."

But one klatch of voters Santorum shouldn't have to worry about may cause him some trouble this November: ardent economic conservatives, like Charlie Clift.

"I will not vote for Santorum," Clift said, "I will not support Santorum, I will not help Santorum."

Many conservatives like Clift backed the conservative Pat Toomey against the moderate to liberal incumbent Arlen Specter in the 2004 Republican Senate primary. And fearing a Toomey victory could lead to Democrats taking the seat away from the GOP, Santorum threw his support behind Specter.

Two years later, Toomey's defeat still stings.

"I feel like I still have a knife stuck in my back, and I'm still bleeding," Toomey said.

Well, Toomey himself doesn't appear to bear a grudge, very publicly endorsing Santorum.

Toomey said, "It'd be a huge setback for conservatives, for the movement, for the Republican Party, for the country, if Rick were to lose this race."

Toomey calls Casey "a big tax-and-spend liberal right out of central casting."

"He clearly went to the Ted Kennedy school of economics," Toomey added, "where there's no tax that's high enough and there's no government program big enough."

But Brett Lieberman of the Harrisburg Patriot News thinks Pennsylvania voters aren't concentrating on Casey at all, but on the controversial Santorum.

Harrisburg Patriot-News Washington correspondent Brett Lieberman said, "Supporters of his are very passionate for him, and critics are very passionate against him. He generates a lot of enthusiasm and a lot of anger."

Despite Casey's early 20-point lead in the polls, Lieberman says it's likely to be a very tight race.

"In the end," Lieberman said, "everyone expects it to be a one- or two-point race, probably."

But no matter what the polls show, one thing's for sure: come election night, the eyes of the nation are going to be on Pennsylvania, when Santorum will find out if he's still Senator Santorum.

I wonder what it would take to get a government that is more concerned with governing well than with beating their opponents? It isn't supposed to be about partisan politics. It is supposed to be about governing in the interests of the people. Both parties are equally responsible for this. Both parties need to be reminded of who the real bosses are.

All incumbents should be shaking in their boots over the upcoming elections.

Santorum (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santorum_%28sexual_slang%29)

Oh my...

The GOP is going to get an ass kicking in Nov. Then Bush will be a final 2 years lame duck + his party will want to distance themselves from him big time. By December - just watch - Bush will have political leprosy.

Will GOP lose the Senate?

I'll stick my neck out and go further than that.
Right now, the way the Democrats are conducting themselves, I would venture to say that the GOP will not only keep the Senate they will continue to control the House.

Will GOP lose the Senate?

I'll stick my neck out and go further than that.
Right now, the way the Democrats are conducting themselves, I would venture to say that the GOP will not only keep the Senate they will GAIN the House.

Huh?? The Republicans have controlled the House since 1994.

The American Public would have to be truly brain dead to allow the dishonest and clueless Republicans in Washington keep control of Congress after the horrific job they've done.

Fortunately for the Republicans, that happens to be the case.

Santorum (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santorum_%28sexual_slang%29)"That's Latin for asshole." - Bob Kerrey

Huh?? The Republicans have controlled the House since 1994.

The American Public would have to be truly brain dead to allow the dishonest and clueless Republicans in Washington keep control of Congress after the horrific job they've done.

Fortunately for the Republicans, that happens to be the case.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Corrected my post Free, was in a discussion with a friend from Ala. about Republicans gaining power in Alabama, after many years, and the discussion carried over into my post.

Corrected my post Free, was in a discussion with a friend from Ala. about Republicans gaining power in Alabama, after many years, and the discussion carried over into my post.

No prob....i knew SOMETHING was strange, because I knew that you knew more about who controlled what than to have made a comment like that....

The GOP is going to get an ass kicking in Nov. Does that mean they will lose control of the congress or that they will lose many more seats than the president's party typically loses in it's sixth year?

The dems should take the house easily. They will take 3 seats in OH and 3 more in IL which is 6 just in 2 states. There are easily 9 more sure-ones around the country to put them over the top.

On the senate side it will be close. They should take RI, PA, MT and OH with strong shots at TN and VA. But the real danger for the republicans in the senate ... even if the dems miss taking the senate by 1 or 2, the dems will have strengthened their side to where the fillibuster is once again a safe maneuveur and the republcans will not be able to go nuclear for fear of losing the senate totally in '08 (which they will) and then find themselves as the victims of thier own nuclar option.

It's a win-win for the dems.

The dems should take the house easily. They will take 3 seats in OH and 3 more in IL which is 6 just in 2 states. There are easily 9 more sure-ones around the country to put them over the top.


I think you're WAY too optimistic about the dimwitted American Public being fed up enough with the abysmal Republican-led government to throw the bastards out.

That and the fact that the Democrats are so goddamned mealy-mouthed and afraid of their own shadow and so afraid of Joe Sixpack ever seeing them as being NOT like a godly, tuurrist-fighting Republican that they have no character and presence of their own.

I think you're WAY too optimistic about the dimwitted American Public being fed up enough with the abysmal Republican-led government to throw the bastards out. Without Googling you couldn't name the people in Ohio or Illinois to whom he is referring. So this is just knee-jerk "all da republicans is bad" blather.

A couple more that republicans should lose ...

AZ district 8 (Graf the republican was totally dumped by the RNC this morning) -- now probably a pickup for the dems.

2 seats in TX, possibly 3 ... a seat or 2 from the re-re-districting by the courts and Bugman's seat ... rotf.

What are we up to now? 8? 9? and we haven't even dug in yet.

The most disturbing news for the American public- is the simple fact, that in the end, Congress will once again be controlled by either the Democrats or Republicans.
Its hallowed halls shall ring of the hissing, venomous voices of slithering lobbyists.
And the great and noble elected shall stand strong in the face of adversity, palm out, defending the great nation which has elected them, by casting each and every vote with the knowledge, that the cause of the highest bidder shall thiumph over justice for all.

Almost forgot Christine Jennings in FL-13 -- she will probably take Harris' seat. Another dem pickup.

Without Googling you couldn't name the people in Ohio or Illinois to whom he is referring. So this is just knee-jerk "all da republicans is bad" blather.

Noooo....it is more in the vein of --"Any voter in the U.S. who --in light of what has befallen this country under ConservaFascist rule for the past six years-- would willingly choose a hard-core Rightwing Republican to run the government is a complete imbecile" -- blather.

The omnipresent, anti-human **Gawd-Guns-and-Guts** ideology of the Right...........that is all that the dimwitted Conservative sheep in this country have room in their brains for. It is what they have been --since birth-- indoctrinated to believe and to favor.

Nothing will change for the better........the country will continue going down the tubes......because the Public chooses the political leaders, and the American Public, collectively, is unbelievably ignorant and gullible.

I don't believe that 'nothing will change for the better'.
Things can always change for the better if you are willing to exercise a little initiative.
I myself volunteer in the community.

My public service club (I don't want to name them for fear that one of you Einstein’s will inform me of their nefarious historical connection to Rudolph Hess or Charles Manson) regularly builds handicap ramps for ALS patients who can no longer negotiate the stairs to their homes.

We also raise money so that we can donate library books to the local elementary schools.

I donate a small portion of my meager paycheck, on a regular basis, to the local volunteer fire department, the local volunteer rescue squad, and to one of our town's homeless shelters.

I pay attention to the voting records of the various candidates for office, and I vote with my heart and my conscience, and never-ever along any party lines.

I'm not telling you all this so that you'll think I'm a great guy, or so that you'll be more endeared to former Army aviators, gun owners, motorcyclists, and right-wing-leaning petroleum consumers.

I'm telling you all this because I want you to realize that there are alternatives to angrily complaining about the state of the world. (And bitterly criticizing your elected leaders.)

You want to make a better world?
Get your ass off that chair, step away from the computer keyboard, and get out there and make a difference!!

Want to save the world from going down the tubes?
Set an example for your kids, and all the kids in your neighborhood.
Set an example of leadership, moral courage, community service, and selflessness.

Form a neighborhod watch group, and drive out some drug-dealers.
Clean up the local roadways of litter on a Saturday morning.
Visit an old-folks home, and see if they need any repairs done. For free.

Those kids will respect that much more than they will angry diatribes and furious web-postings. In just a few years, they just might grow up into solid leaders, and they'll change this world for the better.

Just food for thought. Take it or leave it for what it's worth.
:eek:

There could easily be a shift in Mark Green's old district in Wisconsin. He is not running, since he is running for Governor here. The district is close to even in Republican and Democratic voters. It all depends on how the independents go. I'm not betting on a Republican victory.

PS. I am also thinking that Green will not win the Governor's race. I'm not a big fan of our current Democratic governor, but Green is worse.

Those kids will respect that much more than they will angry diatribes and furious web-postings. In just a few years, they just might grow up into solid leaders, and they'll change this world for the better.


No matter what you or I or anyone else does, *they*, the future electorate, will grow into adults who, whether they become **solid leaders** or not, will either --

a) not vote at all, or

b) who will vote for one of the two wings of the conservative Corporatist Party that runs America.

IOW, *they* --the future citizens-- will accept exactly the same type of governance that their fathers, and their grandfathers accepted; a government that cares very little about the People, but who is slavishly subservient to the needs and desires of Corporations.

As long as the present electorate, or any future electorate, continues to accept (and to even actively support!) a Corporate oligarchy [a nicer way of calling it what it actually is; fascism] as their form of governance, this nation will continue to falter and fail.

(I also believe that in its death throes, the Great Whore will feel it has no choice but to unleash the massive nuclear arsenal that the citizenry was charged trillions in taxdollars to construct, in a mad attempt to retain the control and dominance it has held for lo these many decades, and that human society across the world will at that time be, for all intents and purposes, destroyed.....but that is a topic for another thread.......)

So,

I should just give up on this pie-in-the-sky Pollyanna attitude about building a better world for our kids and grandkids and go throw myself off the nearest tall building?
:(

Man, I bet you're a hoot at cocktail parties.
Do you do weddings?
:rolleyes:

So, I should just give up on this pie-in-the-sky Pollyanna attitude about building a better world for our kids and grandkids .........

As long as the ConservaFascists remain in control? Yes.

....and go throw myself off the nearest tall building?

It will likely be less painful than what will happen when the fascists in Washington succeed in getting WWIII started.

Man, I bet you're a hoot at cocktail parties.


I never broach the subject of politics at parties.

The average man-on-the-street is completely clueless to the political realities facing the People of America....and PREFERS it that way. No need in upsetting the herd by exposing them to reality. No need in informing them of the countless horrors that United States’ war machine has perpetrated, in their names, around the world for the past century, or that we have a genocidal, corrupt and antihuman elite currently governing the United States.

No need to inform them that day-by-day the Bush-Rove-Cheney-Rumsfeld crew is moving America ever closer to a militarist, authoritarian, one-party State, led by a ruler in whom virtually all power is vested.

It would only frighten and anger them.

Noooo....it is more in the vein of --"Any voter in the U.S. who --in light of what has befallen this country under ConservaFascist rule for the past six years-- would willingly choose a hard-core Rightwing Republican to run the government is a complete imbecile" -- blather.
Yeah, yeah. In response to six specific congressional races someone sited, you automatically go into your prepared rant.
You don't know anything about these particular candidates. Without googling you couldn't even tell if they're conservative.
I guess having an inventory of prepared diatribes is some of this "free"thinking you're so proud of.

Without googling you couldn't even tell if they're conservative.

If they have the slightest possibility of being elected to public office in the United States, then YES, they are conservatives.

They may be the milder, 95% conservative Democratic variety, or the full-blown, 110% conservative Republican variety, but they WILL be conservative.

As long as the ConservaFascists remain in control? Yes.
I'm sure you find it knee-slappingly hilarious everytime you say "ConservaFascist", but give it a rest, at least for the weekend.
I never broach the subject of politics at parties.

FT:"This beer you are serving, it is so foul that I would not even feed it to the vile GWB, and the rest of his anti-human cabal, much less my own dog."
Party-goer:"Want some peanuts?"

Yeah, yeah. In response to six specific congressional races someone sited, you automatically go into your prepared rant.

a) I have no "prepared" rant.

b) My response was not in any way aimed at refuting predictions about any particular individual race.

c) I was responding to the comment by Lungdop Philing that --

The dems should take the house easily.

I'm sure you find it knee-slappingly hilarious everytime you say "ConservaFascist"

No humor involved.

Simply calling a spade a spade.

_______________________________________________


Me, at a party: "Could I get one of those beers?"
Evakian: "Sure, here you go". "So are you voting for the Democrat or the Republican in 2008?"
Me: "Uhhh....probably neither." --- "Did you see the Braves game last night?"
Evakian: "Aaaaargh!!...WHY do you people demonstrate such hatred for Republicans?!?!?"

Well, it looks like Allen (R-VA) is doing everything he can to give the senate seat to the dems. Not only does he do the Maccaca routine on television but apparently he also uses the N word.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060925/ap_on_el_se/virginia_senate;_ylt=ArIicmWWY9duI.Ox49PJBlKyFz4D; _ylu=X3oDMTA2Z2szazkxBHNlYwN0bQ--

Yeah, George Allen has been a public figure for many years now and this guy suddenly remembers this as Allen is a potential presidential candidate.
There were other men on the team who have no recollection of any of these stories.

By the way, shouldn't the Democrats be more interested in a story about what's good about Webb?

There was already a real-life person (not an audio tape made in a cave) on Hardball today that verified Allen uses the N word.

There was already a real-life person (not an audio tape made in a cave) on Hardball today that verified Allen uses the N word.

Wash his mouth out with soap.

Allen put a deer's head in the mailbox of a black family.

http://www.salon.com/news/wire/2006/09/25/allen/

Wash his mouth out with soap.
Oh yeah, you are from Georiga. Figures.

http://www.cultural-expressions.com/thesis/confederate.gif

Me, at a party: "Could I get one of those beers?"
Evakian: "Sure, here you go". "So are you voting for the Democrat or the Republican in 2008?"
Me: "Uhhh....probably neither." --- "Did you see the Braves game last night?"
Evakian: "Aaaaargh!!...WHY do you people demonstrate such hatred for Republicans?!?!?"
A) I wouldn't give you a beer. You'd have to do karaoke to get one at my party.
B) No one cares about the Braves.
C) I have equal dislike for democrats and republicans.

Wrong as usual, OD. I'm not from Georgia, I merely moved here after many, many years of living in other places.

Way to much is made of the dreaded "n" word, just like so much is made of many other words the pc crowd find so distressing. Some words are ok for some groups to use, yet not all groups. Just like that goddamn stars & bars you're flying in your post above. Not my flag - I own nothing that displays that - although I do find it to be an attractive emblem.

Wrong as usual. I'm not from Georgia, I merely moved here after many, many years of living in other places.
And it would see fitting that a man of your nature would move to a state that thinks that flag should be flown at their state courthouse.

Way to much is made of the dreaded "n" word, just like so much is made of many other words the pc crowd find so distressing. Some words are ok for some groups to use, yet not all groups. Just like that goddamn stars & bars you're flying in your post above. Not my flag - I own nothing that displays that - although I do find it to be an attractive emblem.
More crap you like to spew. Thanks for that "PC crowd" rant.

PS: The wrong as usual bit was a pretty big laugh. Because it is you who is typically wrong on most, well, every issue.

You're the only one laughing there boy-san. Spew your rants onto somebody that actually gives a flying-fuck about what your opinion might be. It's more fun throwing rocks at you.

Oh, and FT, no one cares about the Braves.

You're the only one laughing there boy-san. Spew your rants onto somebody that actually gives a flying-fuck about what your opinion might be. It's more fun throwing rocks at you.
Go ahead and "throw your rocks" at me because that's all you can do. You can't have an actual debate with me because you are afraid of looking like a fool. But hey, please respond and say it is because I'm "stupid, immature" and "not worthy of your time" I'm dying to hear that excuse again. Anyway, I'm glad I provoked you in this thread. I even got you to curse at me! But hey, I'm 17, I have an excuse for acting immature. Do you?

You've got a lot to learn, buddy boy.

Lungdop Philing: Allen put a deer's head in the mailbox of a black family.

No one else on the team, in an age group that would brag, remembers anything about it.
In fact, the guy's roommate never heard a word about it from the "shocked" Mr. Shelton.

You've got a lot to learn, buddy boy.
Pointing out the obvious much? But I'd like to pose a question...do you think you don't have a lot to learn?

Of course I do.
We are all learning and evolving organisms. Anybody who thinks they've got it all figured out just hasn't been kicked in the stomach lately.

But there's a difference between
a. youthful arrogance
and
b. showing your ass to your elders & disrespecting the State where someone lives. I can respect the former, but personally have no use for the latter.

Just think for a few seconds before you post, okay?

b. showing your ass to your elders & disrespecting the State where someone lives. I can respect the former, but personally have no use for the latter.

Just think for a few seconds before you post, okay?
ES was the one who does not care if someone uses the word "nigger". Personally, I think he is being disrespectful to an entire race of people. However, I wouldn't expect you to point out his flaws. Pointing out mine is all you can seem to do. Secondly, I will disrespect a state, where the majority or a fair amount of people in that state want to have that flag on their state courthouse. And I will disrespect someone even more who lives in a state such as that and does not care about someone using the word "nigger".

Not to mention, many of you have given me tons of shit lately (Decka, ES, Frogger, and Prae) And most of this hate has come from the debate in the Madonna threads. You have all brought it with you into the political forums and have since been acting like complete assholes. ES even admitted he liked to provoke me and does so on purpose. If that isn't asking for a snide comeback (like I presented in this thread) I don't know what is.

Seriously, an "adult" can be an asshole to me but I can't be an asshole back. Nice double standard. Anyway, you get what you give.

Wash his mouth out with soap.

You sure made a lot of assumptions based upon 1 short sentence.

ES was the one who does not care if someone uses the word

Way to much is made of the dreaded "n" word

Again, you're making assumptions about what I may or may not care about. What's written is exactly what I meant.

Anyway, you get what you give.

Not to mention, many of you have given me tons of shit lately (Decka, ES, Frogger, and Prae) And most of this hate has come from the debate in the Madonna threads. You have all brought it with you into the political forums and have since been acting

You invite controversy. Simple as that. Drawing conclusions without any supporting evidence is one thing you do very well. You do not accept criticism - at least from what's been seen on this Forum - well at all. Every topic gets twisted & turned into an OD spin until you're able to feel like you won the contest. Why debate with you when the outcome is predictable?

Damn, overdose.
So much anger and animosity for someone of your tender years.

Back in the days when I played competitive tennis, I came to realize two simple truths:
1. Most of my opponents were younger and therefore much faster and more talented than I was.
and
2. I could still beat them if I played with their heads. Get them pissed off over the interpretation of one or two line calls, drop one or two junk shots in on them, and they were mine.

I don't give a rats ass if you idolize Paris Hilton (or her grandmother, Madonna).
But I owe it to you (as a senior mentor and web-sage of some repute) to tell you when you are fucking up.

Think before you post.
Think hard about who you choose to do battle with.
Consider the short term gain versus the long term loss of credibility.
Step back every now and then and examine whether somebody is just yanking your chain, and whether you would be wiser just to laugh it off.
(And if you haven't figured it out yet, I am not talking about allforums.net, I am talking about life here.)

Keep a cool head when all others around you are losing theirs, and you will win the day.
Or words to that effect.
:cool:

You sure made a lot of assumptions based upon 1 short sentence.

Again, you're making assumptions about what I may or may not care about. What's written is exactly what I meant.
No, it wasn't an assumption. You made a sarcastic comment about someone using the word "nigger" You either don't find it disrespectful/offensive or just don't care when someone uses it. Either way is not okay in my book.

You invite controversy. Simple as that. Drawing conclusions without any supporting evidence is one thing you do very well. You do not accept criticism - at least from what's been seen on this Forum - well at all. Every topic gets twisted & turned into an OD spin until you're able to feel like you won the contest. Why debate with you when the outcome is predictable?
1. I didn't draw a conclusion without any evidence. You made a sarcastic comment in regards to someone using the word "nigger" Basically you are a liar. I did have evidence to base my claim.

2. The last debate I was involved in I didn't invite any controversy and I asked everyone what I did to specifically spark the personal attacks. I got no reply. Thus proving my point that people try and provoke me.

3. You admit that you like to provoke me. May I remind you of the "throwing rocks" comment? You feed off of pushing my buttons. It is you who invites controversy and helps turn threads into an OD contest. I find this happens a lot on this forum. Such as when people bring up my sexuality and mock it. Then they blame me for bringing it up and causing a huge flame-war over it. Laughable, really.

5. You are afraid to debate me, plain and simple. However, deny it all you want.

6. For someone who dislikes me so much and for someone who thinks debating with me is pointless, you sure do spend a lot of time talking to me.

--------
PS: Sparky, you didn't reply to any of my points and went off on your own rant. Good job dude.

*sigh*
I really was just trying to offer you some good advice. But if you need a point-by-point debate I guess I've got a few minutes.

I will disrespect a state, where the majority or a fair amount of people in that state want to have that flag on their state courthouse. And I will disrespect someone even more who lives in a state such as that and does not care about someone using the word "nigger".

I live in the south because this is where the job market brought me. If I had my way, I'd be living on Oahu, and surfing the North Shore every morning.

Does the word, 'nigger' offend me?
Sure. As do the words, 'kike', 'spic', 'homo', 'chink', and 'Ted Kennedy'.
But they are the unfortunate & unavoidable cultural by-products of generations of human hate, fear, and ignorance. Those words do NOT define a State or region though, not by a long-shot. (OK, I take part of that back. 'Ted Kennedy' has unfortunately defined the State of Massachussets for many, many years.)

Does the rebel flag flying at somebody's State Capital offend me?
Sure. But I am comforted by the American Flag flying right next to it, but slightly higher up on the flag pole.

Not to mention, many of you have given me tons of shit lately (Decka, ES, Frogger, and Prae) And most of this hate has come from the debate in the Madonna threads.

That's not hate, young man. That's just good old fashioned ribbing. And you brought it on yourself (In my objective opinion) with your obsessive posting on the subject of Ms. Ciccone. You left yourself wide open for it, trust me.

Seriously, an "adult" can be an asshole to me but I can't be an asshole back. Nice double standard. Anyway, you get what you give.

Fair enough then. If you want to allow someone else to yank your chain to the point where you respond with anger and emotion (instead of reason and good humor), then I have a feeling that the next seventeen years aren't going to be much more fun than your last.

That was 40-Love. Your serve, sir.
;)

Yet another testimony to Allen using the N-word.

http://jabbs.blogspot.com/2006/09/another-day-another-person-alleges-sen.html

Isn't this old news? I mean, it's some thirty years in the past! Woulnd't you expect a "statute of limitations" of sorts to take effect after 10 or so? IMO, this is showing the same level of lunacy that took place a few years ago when it was revealed that hilary klinton was alleged to have made some remarks about Jews.

Does the word, 'nigger' offend me?
Sure. As do the words, 'kike', 'spic', 'homo', 'chink', and 'Ted Kennedy'.
But they are the unfortunate & unavoidable cultural by-products of generations of human hate, fear, and ignorance. Those words do NOT define a State or region though, not by a long-shot. (OK, I take part of that back. 'Ted Kennedy' has unfortunately defined the State of Massachussets for many, many years.)
1. I'm glad you are offended by all those words. However, just because they are "unavoidable" does not mean we should ignore it when people use those words. That was the only point I was trying to make.
2. I never said these words defined a state. What I said defines a state is their laws, which can imply the sort of language they find "OK" and "not OK" throughout their state.

Does the rebel flag flying at somebody's State Capital offend me?Sure. But I am comforted by the American Flag flying right next to it, but slightly higher up on the flag pole.
I'm not comfortable having that flag anywhere near a state courthouse. But I'm thankful for your opinion.

That's not hate, young man. That's just good old fashioned ribbing. And you brought it on yourself (In my objective opinion) with your obsessive posting on the subject of Ms. Ciccone. You left yourself wide open for it, trust me.
Wrong. There were 3 Madonna threads that were posted recently. 2 were posted by other members and asked for my opinion. How is that bringing it on myself when I was asked to share my opinion?

I should not be attacked by members for "bringing up Madonna" when I was only responding to the threads they posted and the questions they asked me. Basically, everyone blames me for "bringing things up" when really, it is others who tend to bring these topics up.

Fair enough then. If you want to allow someone else to yank your chain to the point where you respond with anger and emotion (instead of reason and good humor), then I have a feeling that the next seventeen years aren't going to be much more fun than your last.
You cannot reason with people like ES. They are so far backwards that there is no hope left for them.

There were 3 Madonna threads that were posted recently. 2 were posted by other members and asked for my opinion. How is that bringing it on myself when I was asked to share my opinion?

Three threads about Madonna......?!?!?

Wow. Who knew she (or any other celebrity, for that matter) was that captivating.

Game, set, match.

Game, set, match.
No reply to my post that refutes all of your points?

No, no reply, young sir.
I concede the match to you.

You are the master-debater.
And I am but a stumbling, demented oldster who is losing control of all his faculties. Clearly, you have the upper hand in this contest, and I would be wise to retire and withdraw.

You've got it going on, Overdose.
Keep on doing what works for you.
:thumbs:

PS Oh yeah.
I laid Madonna back in 1983.
She was a lackluster and profoundly unskilled sex partner, and unusually hairy. (And to be honest, she was a tad unwashed.) I faked an orgasm, and then sent her home in a cab.

Still, Madonna admired my skills as a lover and mentor, and consults with me regularly on matters of politics, business, digital guitar effects processors, sampled rhythms, and studio hardware and software. (Don't ask.)

I look upon her as a bad penny that will not go away, but I don't have the heart to hurt her feelings. Since you are clearly her biggest fan, can you carry this message to her for me?

Madonna, darling. A Tic-Tac wouldn't hurt.
Your tits have held up really well, but your breath is like an old gym sock.
Work on that, will you?
:(

That a bratty, tree hugging, snot-nosed, sexually confused, distraught, histrionic child throws insults at anyone is nothing new. It's very safe to do such from behind a screen. That he would make a series of accusations based upon stereotypical assumptions of a geographical location is ludicrous. Some might see that as "stupid"
The dreaded “n” word offends me such that I’ll not even type it out. While raised in an “archie bunker “ style household in western NY state (one of the more racist areas in this great land) I left there within weeks of my HS graduation (at age 17) for a twenty year career in the military. I've not spent a lot of time in that area since 1968. The majority of my closest friends over the years have been those of "color". They attended my wedding(s), witnessed the birth of my son, and have always been welcome in my home.
That a socially ignorant child might be acknowledged in an otherwise adult environment might be viewed as acceptable in this advanced era of Internet communications is one thing, to view those immature rants as anything other than background noise is another. When and if that child has a few more miles under his belt, perhaps those rants may be seen as having some validity. By that time those rants could have mellowed to a point where they might be making some sense.
While I reside in the South for a variety of reasons, that residence should in no way be an indicator acceptance of ancient and obsolete cultural standards.. I have found many areas in the North to be much more racially phobic than what I’ve experienced below the Mason-Dixon Line.

:upyours: :rant:

OMG sparky... stop man you're making me laugh.

And OD.. i never tried to "start shit" with you... i mean and meant every word i said... if anything, you deserved and asked for the attention and criticism you received and are receiving...

New Report That Senator Uttered Slurs

http://tinyurl.com/jxgeu

And corroboration on the deer head in the mailbox story.

http://www.tnr.com/blog/theplank

Is that toast I smell?

1. And corroboration on the deer head in the mailbox story.
2. Is that toast I smell?
1. Read before you post:
Beam was roommates with Billy Lanahan, now deceased, who along with Allen and Shelton, was the third member of the now infamous hunting party. According to Beam, Lanahan later told him the bizarre story of the three men stuffing the deer head into a mailbox. He says Lanahan did not tell him that the prank had any racial overtones.

"Lanahan told me they went hunting and killed a deer.... He didn't say it was racial -- just said they stuck it in a mailbox as a prank."

Beam says he has no knowledge of Allen ever using racially offensive language at UVA. ..."A lot of little incidents where he just acted more like a Southern redneck than the people who actually grew up in the South."

2. No, just some more D.S. (Dopshit).

1. Read before you post:
Beam was roommates with Billy Lanahan, now deceased, who along with Allen and Shelton, was the third member of the now infamous hunting party. According to Beam, Lanahan later told him the bizarre story of the three men stuffing the deer head into a mailbox. He says Lanahan did not tell him that the prank had any racial overtones.

"Lanahan told me they went hunting and killed a deer.... He didn't say it was racial -- just said they stuck it in a mailbox as a prank."

Beam says he has no knowledge of Allen ever using racially offensive language at UVA. ..."A lot of little incidents where he just acted more like a Southern redneck than the people who actually grew up in the South."

2. No, just some more D.S. (Dopshit).


Of course not ... no racial overtones ... people always ask where's the closest n-word family so I can stuff this deer head in their mailbox..

ROTF

Of course not ... no racial overtones ... people always ask where's the closest n-word family so I can stuff this deer head in their mailbox..Well if you're now admitting that this dead witness "states" there were no racial overtones, how is it "corroboration" of the racist deer head story.
More D.S.

Not to mention, many of you have given me tons of shit lately (Decka, ES, Frogger, and Prae)
I think I responded to you once when you spouted off (in your typical whiney, "I'm right - you're wrong, so nana-nana, boo-boo, PROVE IT" fashion) to Brooks, you drama queen. For being the raging tight ass you are, I'd be extremely surprised if you weren't the bell of the ball at your nightclubs.
And most of this hate has come from the debate in the Madonna threads.
Oh, there's a shocker....:rolleyes:
Secondly, I will disrespect a state, where the majority or a fair amount of people in that state want to have that flag on their state courthouse.
Do you ever take the time to actually listen to yourself before you type? "I will disrespect a state"...."The majority of a fair amount"??? Where do you get this shit??? It's pure gold. Now, let’s think about what you just said, but first – let me grab my gibberish translator......

Okay, I got it....

Ahh, I see - if you can't give specifics about the "majority" or "fair amount" of Southerners out there, then perhaps you should just shut up. If you wanna call MOST people in Alabama "racist", then fine, but know this from the start: if you're dead-set on being an ignoramus, then the least you could do is fake a stroke first. It used to be their STATE flag, and to most southerners, it's not about racism; it embodies a history they’re proud of. The Civil War wasn't entirely about slavery, OD. The South fought for slavery because it was a sure-fire way to pad their tobacco, cotton, and crop yields while keeping the aristocrats rich in the process. If you wanted to bring about a good reason for why the Confederate Flag should be taken down, then ditch the racism issue. One could strongly argue that it's a flag of treason, and as such, it has no business being flown, period.

According to this statement ...

"Some time drinking a beer at U Heights," Beam says, referring to the campus housing complex where Beam, Lanahan, and Allen all lived, "Lanahan told me they went hunting and killed a deer. All I know is they cut off a deer head and stuck it in someone's mailbox. ........."

2 people have now mentioned the deer head ... Lanahan and Beam.

Yes, but the story was originally presented as having been done to a black family. If not for that fact, it's about as interesting as cow tipping.

Now this new "witness" has said there were no racial overtones in this incident.

When you're talking to Dop, there are always racial overtones.

If you want to give Allen a pass ... fine ... that's your choice.

If you want to give Allen a pass ... fine ... that's your choice.A pass for what appears to be a politically motivated 30 year old story? I mean you're "corroborating" your story with a version of events that makes claims that are opposite of the original story.
I don't understand the significance of any of this.

PS - Do you have any links to stories with reasons to vote for Webb?

PS - Do you have any links to stories with reasons to vote for Webb?

Only thing I need to know about Webb is ... he's not Allen.

Only thing I need to know about Webb is ... he's not Allen.The Dems generally run on this platform.

I don't follow ancient politics, but I do know that this 'dear head in the mailbox' story stinks to high heaven. It sounds like an election year assasination attempt, in my opinon.

And think about this for a moment;
Who has a mailbox big enough to even fit an entire deer's head in it?

The standard rural mailbox is 9"H X 6 1/2W X 19"L.

A small-to medium sized deer had is approximately 10"H X 11"W X 15"L, depending upon where you sever the skull from the C-spine.

If you discount the possiblity that the deer had horns, then the only way that the head would fit in there would be if the poor unfortunate prank victim had one of those gargantuan 'package-capacity' mailboxes.
(And let's face it; how many agrarian minorities in the early 1970's could even afford the deluxe high-capacity mailbox, at $15- $17 a pop? The basic mailbox went for $3.50, and was therefore more likely the local standard.)

I've gone back and read the reports and 'testimony' on this alleged incident, and I didn't see anything to indicate that the hunters had blasted a small baby deer, nor was there any evidence that the prank victim had an unusually large mailbox.

Conclusion?
This story is bullshit.

If you discount the possiblity that the deer had horns, then the only way that the head would fit in there would be if the poor unfortunate prank victim had one of those gargantuan 'package-capacity' mailboxes.
(And let's face it; how many agrarian minorities in the early 1970's could even afford the deluxe high-capacity mailbox, at $15- $17 a pop? The basic mailbox went for $3.50, and was therefore more likely the local standard.)
ROTFLMAO!

I don't follow ancient politics, but I do know that this 'dear head in the mailbox' story stinks to high heaven. It sounds like an election year assasination attempt, in my opinon.

And think about this for a moment;
Who has a mailbox big enough to even fit an entire deer's head in it?

The standard rural mailbox is 9"H X 6 1/2W X 19"L.

A small-to medium sized deer had is approximately 10"H X 11"W X 15"L, depending upon where you sever the skull from the C-spine.

If you discount the possiblity that the deer had horns, then the only way that the head would fit in there would be if the poor unfortunate prank victim had one of those gargantuan 'package-capacity' mailboxes.
(And let's face it; how many agrarian minorities in the early 1970's could even afford the deluxe high-capacity mailbox, at $15- $17 a pop? The basic mailbox went for $3.50, and was therefore more likely the local standard.)

I've gone back and read the reports and 'testimony' on this alleged incident, and I didn't see anything to indicate that the hunters had blasted a small baby deer, nor was there any evidence that the prank victim had an unusually large mailbox.

Conclusion?
This story is bullshit.


I believe the actual story states the deer head was attached (tied?) to the mailbox ... semantics don't make the racism charge dissapear.

It's on record that he wrote racists remarks in the locker room in high school to fire up racial tensions, several people have accused him or using the N-word, then we have the deer head incident, the confederate flag on his golf cart, the hangman's noose in his office, a relative named after a KKK grand wizard and of course the biggie ... Macaca incident.

Given all this bad behaviour, regardless of how many years have gone by, how anyone can give him a pass is beyond me.

The sad part for me personally is this dude was born and raised in South Bay (Los Angeles) my neighborhood. FWIW: You outta hear what some of his high school (Palos Verdes) classmates say about how he acted. They pretty much all confirm his racial attitude.

To Sparky and Decka: Both of your replies had little to no substance and were a waste of bandwidth.

Well, my goodness.
Thank you for your expert opinion on things of substance.
(Mr. "I love Paris Hilton and her hairy grandmother, Madonna"-boy.)

I give you my best advice,
I avoid the obvious insults and spurious inflammatory remarks,
I take the high-road for Christ's sake,
and this is the thanks I get??!!?

Well, see if I ever offer to help you ever again.

:mad:

That a bratty, tree hugging, snot-nosed, sexually confused, distraught, histrionic child throws insults at anyone is nothing new.
1. Thinking I’m “bratty” is your opinion. Luckily this is an opinion most at my school and in my community don't hold.
2. Why you think I care about what you think of me is beyond me.
3. How am I a "tree hugger"? Half the time I throw trash on the ground in my area. Plus, I've gotten in maybe one debate over the environment while on Allforums. I suggest you should stop making pathetic assumptions.
4. How am I sexually confused? I haven't been since about 2 years ago.
5. "Histrionic child" isn’t even worth replying to.

It's very safe to do such from behind a screen. That he would make a series of accusations based upon stereotypical assumptions of a geographical location is ludicrous.
1. All of what you just said is laughable when you just made a list of assumptions about me ("tree hugger"?). You are a true hypocrite.
2. You live in a state where they want the Confederate flag flown at their state courthouse and has had a history of racism. That is a stereotype, yes, however most stereotypes are there for a reason. And this stereotype was suggested by your lack of care for someone using the word "nigger".

The dreaded “n” word offends me such that I’ll not even type it out. While raised in an “archie bunker “ style household in western NY state (one of the more racist areas in this great land) I left there within weeks of my HS graduation (at age 17) for a twenty year career in the military. I've not spent a lot of time in that area since 1968. The majority of my closest friends over the years have been those of "color". They attended my wedding(s), witnessed the birth of my son, and have always been welcome in my home.
Then why did you make a sarcastic, un-caring comment about someone using the word "nigger"? If you don't want people to think certain things about you, then you shouldn't make certain comments.

When and if that child has a few more miles under his belt, perhaps those rants may be seen as having some validity. By that time those rants could have mellowed to a point where they might be making some sense.
You are ranting yourself, maybe you are also trying to reach some sort of validity in your life. You may also be trying to find validity by trying to provoke me as you admitted to in the past. Oh! And lets not forget you refuse to reply to the points I have brought up, but decide to ignore them and keep living in ignorance.
------------------------------------
To Sparky and Decka: Both of your replies had little to no substance and were a waste of bandwidth.
------------------------------------

I think I responded to you once when you spouted off (in your typical whiney, "I'm right - you're wrong, so nana-nana, boo-boo, PROVE IT" fashion) to Brooks, you drama queen. For being the raging tight ass you are, I'd be extremely surprised if you weren't the bell of the ball at your nightclubs.
I’m the drama queen? Those living in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones.

Do you ever take the time to actually listen to yourself before you type? "I will disrespect a state"...."The majority of a fair amount"??? Where do you get this shit??? It's pure gold. Now, let’s think about what you just said, but first – let me grab my gibberish translator......
Please look at this. 60% said they view the confederate flag as a symbol of pride not slavery/racism.

http://www.georgiaheritagecouncil.org/site2/news/GA105SCVPoll.pdf#search=%22georgia%20confederate%2 0flag%20poll%22

As for your little rant, well, it does nothing to sway me. When African Americans and others see that flag it brings back a time where slavery/racism was prevalent. I mean, no matter what, slavery was an issue in this civil war. Period.

Not to mention, in the 60’s what flag was shown when they were trying to keep blacks and whites segregated?

Well, see if I ever offer to help you ever again.
You have never offered any help that is worth looking into. So stop trying.

Someday you'll thank me for at least extending the gesture.

Someday after you've grown up a bit, accomplished something, lost something, gone to war for your country, fathered a child, succeeded at work, buried a few friends, been fired at least once, made a stand for justice and truth, suffered the loss of a parent, stared death straight in the eye once or twice, and then came out on top in spite of it all.

Someday you'll thank me for at least extending the gesture.

Until then, carry on young man.
Clearly you know something that someone of conscience thirty years your senior just can't comprehend.

Clearly you know something that someone of conscience thirty years your senior just can't comprehend.
Meet Overdose, Sparky.

Please look at this. 60% said they view the confederate flag as a symbol of pride not slavery/racism.

http://www.georgiaheritagecouncil.org/site2/news/GA105SCVPoll.pdf#search=%22georgia%20confederate%2 0flag%20poll%22

Yes, exactly...60% (or if you prefer, THE MAJORITY) of the people in Georgia view the Confederate flag as a symbol of pride and heritage, not racism. That's exactly what I was saying in the first place with regards to how MOST southerners view the stars and bars.

When African Americans and others see that flag it brings back a time where slavery/racism was prevalent.
That's because blacks see racism in everything. They intentionally look for it to bolster their collective notion of being fucked over by the man. I think it helps them sleep better at night.

You know where I see racism: B.E.T., Miss Black America, Latino T.V., Black Pride Month, Mexican Awareness Month, affirmative action, and racial quotas. Do I get an entire month, or much less even a T.V. station in which caters to my heritage? Absolutely not, because that'd be racist, right? Do I get a hand up in college? Nope - not on your life. Why, you ask...because I'm white. It's been "white awareness month" for 230 years (or so I’ve been told), but apparently the committee responsible for planning it forgot the parades. Which is totally understandable considering the fact that white folk don’t actually have to work for anything. I mean, seriously, when I went to college, they just gave me a degree. When I went to buy my first condo, “The Man” simply handed me a briefcase full of money and then told me to pay it back when I could. THAT'S how fucking good it is to be white, so I guess we don’t deserve a month, or a T.V. station, or a beauty pageant, or a special loan, or any preferential job treatment. We’re white. We have it easy.

Good post Prae -

If we are going to prevent racism, we can't fight it with laws (affirmative action) that are by their very definition, racist.

That's because blacks see racism in everything. They intentionally look for it to bolster their collective notion of being fucked over by the man. I think it helps them sleep better at night.
I know a lot of black people see racism in places where there isn't any, but I think that the vast majority of that mentality occurs in poor areas. I know a few rich black men who got where they were from working their asses off, and I have never heard them complain about racism; they actually complain quite often about people using the race-card instead.

I know a lot of black people see racism in places where there isn't any, but I think that the vast majority of that mentality occurs in poor areas. I know a few rich black men who got where they were from working their asses off, and I have never heard them complain about racism; they actually complain quite often about people using the race-card instead.
Totally true. I've known a few wealthy ones myself, and the ones who busted ass by working in college and life almost NEVER complain about racism. My point is we don't hear the ones who don't talk; we hear the ones who do. Unfortunately, their voice is piercing.

Another teammate confirms Allen used "N-word"

http://tinyurl.com/zbcu8

Plus a woman on Hardball states she heard him say the N-word several times at UVA and over the years has reported but to no avail as everyone covered for him. Chris Matthews guarantees the woman was thoroughly vetted by both MSNBC and himself and she is telling the truth.

NIGGER!

*ducks and covers*

Ha ha ha ha HAAAA!!
:lolhit:
You crack me up, 500lbguerilla.

(What can I say? I like irreverent, politically-incorrect humor.)

THE GOP will lose either the House, the Senate or both if the national news media have anything to say about it.

True, this.
:(

THE GOP will lose either the House, the Senate or both if the national news media have anything to say about it.

If the republicans lose either house, it is from their own doings and the media will have nothing to do with it. The media didn't tell Allen to call that dude Macaca or use the N-word nor did the media tell Foley to go kinky on a teenage boy nor did the media tell any of the republicans to be a pro-war bushbot.

Ah US Domestic politics,its all black and white to me.

Sorry to disagree, Lungdop Philin.
But you know full well sir that your statement is not true.

Washington area wrong-doing and inappropriate behavior (on the part of both the Democrats and Republicans) has long been the rule, not the exception, for many more years than you or I have been alive.

And the difference between an ugly rumor and a full-blow investigation and impeachment has always hinged upon the whimsy or machinery of the mainstream media, and whether or not the American public was allowed to be privy to the information.

Some Senator wants to bugger a young boy?
A Congressman murders his young lover, and discards her body in a metropolitan park?
An American President wants to have his dick sucked by an intern half his age?
The gold standard of Beltway Business As Usual, in my observation.

Whether or not we even hear about it?
Pure caprice. Who's in charge at the Washington Post, or CNN, or Fox News (in recent years)? Who holds their ticket?
Who pulls the strings of the media money guys?

THAT determines whether you are privy to the real dirt or not, sir.
And I say that without fear of contradiction.

Who's in charge at the Washington Post, or CNN, or Fox News (in recent years)? Who holds their ticket?
Who pulls the strings of the media money guys?


The 3 biggest media moguls in the entire world are Ailes, Murdoch and Walsh ... all are avid neocon-style conservatives and major contributors to the republican agenda.

The 3 biggest media moguls in the entire world are Ailes, Murdoch and Walsh
With what yardstick?

I'd say it is more a case that the GOP will manage to retain control of both the House and the Senate if the mainstream, Corporate owned news media have anything to say about it.

Yes, exactly...60% (or if you prefer, THE MAJORITY) of the people in Georgia view the Confederate flag as a symbol of pride and heritage, not racism. That's exactly what I was saying in the first place with regards to how MOST southerners view the stars and bars.
Do you honestly think they believe that? Or do you think they just use that as an excuse to still fly the flag they know represents racism?

That's because blacks see racism in everything. They intentionally look for it to bolster their collective notion of being fucked over by the man. I think it helps them sleep better at night.
I see racism in that flag and I'm white. Honestly, it was used in the 60's in the South when they tried to put blacks in white schools. You saw the rallies of people with the Confederate flags flying and beating up blacks who were trying to go to white schools.

You know where I see racism: B.E.T., Miss Black America, Latino T.V., Black Pride Month, Mexican Awareness Month, affirmative action, and racial quotas. Do I get an entire month, or much less even a T.V. station in which caters to my heritage? Absolutely not, because that'd be racist, right? Do I get a hand up in college? Nope - not on your life. Why, you ask...because I'm white. It's been "white awareness month" for 230 years (or so I’ve been told), but apparently the committee responsible for planning it forgot the parades. Which is totally understandable considering the fact that white folk don’t actually have to work for anything. I mean, seriously, when I went to college, they just gave me a degree. When I went to buy my first condo, “The Man” simply handed me a briefcase full of money and then told me to pay it back when I could. THAT'S how fucking good it is to be white, so I guess we don’t deserve a month, or a T.V. station, or a beauty pageant, or a special loan, or any preferential job treatment. We’re white. We have it easy.
Wow, that sure is a list. One that I, for the most part agree with. I don't get how this proves the Confederate flag is OK to be used though.
-------
Sparky, you again resort to my "age" and it proves you can't argue against what I've said. Resorting to my age proves nothing as many adults who I know agree with a lot of what I've said. So please, save me your bullshit.

Youngster,

You wouldn't know bullshit if it walked up and lifted your wallet.
(And truth be told, I don't care to engage in internet debate with under-aged, hysterical, Drama Club secretaries.)

Go off somewhere for a few years, move out of your mommy's house, earn a wage, impress somebody with your work ethic and credentials, and then come back here and presume to wade in amongst the debate of true adults.

Until then, go off to the dance clubs, adore Madonna and her granddaughter Paris Hilton, rub bodies with the beautiful boys and girls, and in general, just shut the hell up.

You are out of your league, Junior.
Really, stop.
You're embarassing yourself.
:thumbs:

With what yardstick?

I guess you would measure this stuff by stations owned, networks owned, media outlets controlled, newspapers owned, total vierership etc etc.

If you question my premise, why not offer some names that out rank my guys.

If you question my premise, why not offer some names that out rank my guys.
I'm not questioning your premise, I was just curious as to how you picked those three as the "biggest media moguls."

its funny watching OD call all those georgians down there cold blooded racists... what an idiot...

the confederacy wasnt all about "race".. while that was an issue.. the flag itself doesnt stand for racism.. unless there's someone like you who is a bigot and takes it that way.

Youngster,
You wouldn't know bullshit if it walked up and lifted your wallet.
(And truth be told, I don't care to engage in internet debate with under-aged, hysterical, Drama Club secretaries.)
Proves yet again I am not talking to an adult. The way you word your posts makes me question you as an adult and if you are mature enough to be attacking my maturity. Basically you are a hypocrite. I've attacked people based on actual reasons and evidence. You, however, decide to personally attack me with foul language and resort to basically calling me a "drama queen". Nonsense? I think so.

Go off somewhere for a few years, move out of your mommy's house, earn a wage, impress somebody with your work ethic and credentials, and then come back here and presume to wade in amongst the debate of true adults.
How does "life experience" have anything to do with what we are talking about? Never did I say I was "mature" nor does this debate have anything to do with "life experience". If we were having a debate about taxes etc. then I could see your point, but the debate we are having now has nothing to do with life experience.

Until then, go off to the dance clubs, adore Madonna and her granddaughter Paris Hilton, rub bodies with the beautiful boys and girls, and in general, just shut the hell up.
"Shut the hell up" I thought you were an adult? Honestly, you are far from a mature adult. I don't know of any "adults" who would resort to such crude words and immature posts.

You are out of your league, Junior.
Really, stop.
You're embarassing yourself.
:thumbs:
LOL.

------------------

its funny watching OD call all those georgians down there cold blooded racists... what an idiot...
When did I say all of them were racists? That's a lie you are spewing.

the confederacy wasnt all about "race".. while that was an issue.. the flag itself doesnt stand for racism.. unless there's someone like you who is a bigot and takes it that way.
The flag didn't start off just being about racism, but in today's society that is what it has evolved into being.

Yes, exactly...60% (or if you prefer, THE MAJORITY) of the people in Georgia view the Confederate flag as a symbol of pride and heritage, not racism. That's exactly what I was saying in the first place with regards to how MOST southerners view the stars and bars. stars and bars = American flag

And please do show the wide spread use of the confederate flag by black people proud of the south...