So the Pope claims that the religion of Islam was founded by an inhumane and violent person, and to prove him wrong, Muslims are committing violent and inhumane acts in reaction???? What is the reason that the Pope is apologizing to these bastards?

So the Pope claims that the religion of Islam was founded by an inhumane and violent person, and to prove him wrong, Muslims are committing violent and inhumane acts in reaction????

Huh??

""Muslims are committing violent and inhumane acts in reaction"".......?!?!?

What violent and inhumane acts have they committed in reaction to the Pope's comments??

What is the reason that the Pope is apologizing to these bastards?

Well, hey....since he's not going to apologize to the thousands of little boys his clergymen have molested over the years, maybe he feels he should apologize for SOMETHING.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

The Roman Catholic Church in Ireland agreed last week to pay $110 million to settle cases involving hundreds of people who claim they were sexually abused as children by priests, nuns, and other church officials over several decades. Many of the incidents are said to have occurred at state-funded, church-run schools. In exchange for the settlement, the government agreed to indemnify the church against further legal action by sex-abuse victims in Ireland.

These were just the latest in a string of cases that have emerged since the late 1980s. Exactly how large the problem has become is difficult to judge. There is no official tally of victims and abusers, and the church says it doesn't keep track. And while some big settlements have been made public--a $120 million jury award in Dallas in 1997 that later was reduced to $23 million and a $5.2 million award in Los Angeles late last year--many lawsuits are settled out of court with details kept confidential.

But lawyers and sex-abuse experts familiar with many of the cases say those that have been made public represent only a small fraction. Some have estimated that the scandal to date has involved more than 3,000 priests and tens of thousands of victims. At least one noted expert, A. W. Richard Sipe, a retired psychotherapist and author of Sex, Priests, and Power: Anatomy of a Crisis, estimates that since the late 1980s, the church has paid out close to $1 billion in settlements and legal and other expenses. ------- http://www.snapnetwork.org/news/otherstates/usa_unholycrisis.htm

A usual, way to place apples with oranges, FT, in a way to cover the fact that you don't know a damned thing about apples. You can lament that the killing of Italian nun was not "certified" as a Muslim slaying, but get real.

OMG!1!1!!!! 1.5 billion people are responsible for killing a nun. Those savage bastards!!111!11!!!

OMG!1!1!!!! 1.5 billion people are responsible for killing a nun. Those savage bastards!!111!11!!!


If the Pope has to apologize for everything that happened in the name of the Church since before he ever existed, then I think Muslims leaders need to come out against those sort of violent acts that are ocurring now.

A usual, way to place apples with oranges, FT, in a way to cover the fact that you don't know a damned thing about apples. You can lament that the killing of Italian nun was not "certified" as a Muslim slaying, but get real.
You are a Catholic I presume, slightly radical at that maybe.
Catholics have no moral edge on anybody if you look at history!

A usual, way to place apples with oranges, FT, in a way to cover the fact that you don't know a damned thing about apples. You can lament that the killing of Italian nun was not "certified" as a Muslim slaying, but get real.

I had not heard of the killing of the Italian nun. But let us say for the sake of argument that she was killed by Muslims, who did it purely as a reaction to what the Pope said.

Is that then your answer to the question --""What violent and inhumane acts have Muslims committed in reaction to the Pope's comments??""

Because "nun" is singular, and "acts" is plural.

What other act or acts have Muslims committed in reaction?

How can you be traditional, conservative and radical all at the same time? Would (in terms of clarity) the new and exotic changes to the traditional systems of doing things be considered radical?

I am spiritual, but not religious.

If the Pope has to apologize for everything that happened in the name of the Church since before he ever existed, then I think Muslims leaders need to come out against those sort of violent acts that are ocurring now.

a) We all know that the Pope will never apologize for all THOSE innumerable acts.

b) I agree with you 100% that Muslims leaders need to forcefully and unambiguously come out against any sort of violent acts that are ocurring now.

FT- When a freako right wingest blows up an abortion clinic, you have tons and tons of Christians that come out against those whackjobs. I guess I am wondering where are the Muslims that come out against the unspeakable acts committed in the name of their religion.

How can you be traditional, conservative and radical all at the same time? Would (in terms of clarity) the new and exotic changes to the traditional systems of doing things be considered radical?


I am spiritual, but not religious.

I see it in the Far-right conservatives,Ann Coulter/Glenn Beck eg

Believe in god but not religion, do they not go hand in hand?

then I think Muslims leaders need to come out against those sort of violent acts that are ocurring now.

What like arrest those responsible or condemnthe acts?

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The head of security for the Islamic militia that controls much of southern Somalia, Yusuf Mohamed Siad, said one man had been arrested and the second was being hunted. He said the killing might have stemmed from the uproar over the pope but stressed he didn't know for sure.

"They could be people annoyed by the pope's speech, which angered all Muslims in the world, or they could have been having something to do with S.O.S.," he said. "We will have to clarify this through our investigation."
http://www.heraldnet.com/stories/06/09/18/100wir_a3nun001.cfm

Palestinian nationalist and Islamic leaders on Sunday strongly condemned fire-bombing attacks against a few churches in the West Bank, calling the incidents "suspicious" and "incompatible with Palestinian and Islamic culture."
...
"It is either Israeli collaborators or some overzealous fools upset by the remarks of the Pope," said Iqab Darghmeh (Abu Ahmed), in a telephone interview.

Darghmeh and Muslim notables, including representatives of Fatah, Hamas and civic leaders visited the church Sunday morning to show solidarity with the small Christian community in the town.

"Christians here are not a separate sect. They are our flesh and blood. They are our brothers. An attack on their churches is an attack on Islam and the Palestinian people."

The fire-bombings have been widely condemned by religious and political leaders throughout the West Bank and Gaza Strip.

Sheikh Muhammed Hussein, the highest-ranking Muslim clergyman in East Jerusalem described the bombing as "immoral, unethical and injurious to Palestinian unity."

"Those who perpetrated these acts don’t represent the Palestinian people. They are a gang of ignoramuses and fanatics, or suspicious elements." In the Palestinian political lexicon, "suspicious elements" is an allusion to Israeli collaborators and informers.
http://www.uruknet.org.uk/?p=m26748&hd=0&size=1&l=e
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++=

I'm tired of this knee jerk reaction racism. Did you even bother to look for what the reaction of the community has been?

Oh and I'm still waiting on your apology for leaving americas gates open to all you border jumping friends... :eek:

I see it in the Far-right conservatives,Ann Coulter/Glenn Beck eg

Believe in god but not religion, do they not go hand in hand?

Do you think that all people who believe in God believe the same religion?? Is it possible to be spirtual but not ready to accept everything that is force-fed to you from a book?

In Glenn Beck's dreams could he be as intelligent as AnN Coulter. He can get his point accross without (first consulting Rush Limbaugh book on how to be a jackass and secondly screaming at the top of his lungs.

But how are they radical?

Do you think that all people who believe in God believe the same religion?? Is it possible to be spirtual but not ready to accept everything that is force-fed to you from a book?

In Glenn Beck's dreams could he be as intelligent as AnN Coulter. He can get his point accross without (first consulting Rush Limbaugh book on how to be a jackass and secondly screaming at the top of his lungs.

Not the same religion, but is not the bible the "word of God"? I guess you can believe in god and not follow a specific religion, just doesn't seem common.

"intelligent as AnN Coulter" have you read the garbage this woman writes and believes?

What point was the Pope trying to make, surely he or someone in his close company realized this statement would blow up?
Shear stupidity to inflame the moslems more.

Beck's on TV right now:rolleyes:

Diva,

You are correct that the Muslims are having another hate-fest over the Pope's words. The usual rent-a-mobs Muslims are running around in the Middle East over what the Pope said (please keep in mind that there are no spontaneous riots in the middle east). One of the Sheiks in Somalia called for the Pope's execution while preaching at his Mosque in Somalia, he called for Muslims the world over to find and "punish" the Pope. They're burning the Pope in effigy. That nun you referred to was shot to death at a hospital in Somalia. That nun had dedicated her life to helping the sick. No one has yet claimed responsibility. There are some churches that were firebombed by Palestinians, a church was attacked in Syria. I'll link to a site where you can get the skinny on all the goings on with the Muslims and their latest fatwa, or whatever it's called, dammit.


http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2006/09/pope-threatened-churches-torched-riots.html

I see it in the Far-right conservatives,Ann Coulter/Glenn Beck eg

Believe in god but not religion, do they not go hand in hand?


It does in the West, american, dammit.

FT- When a freako right wingest blows up an abortion clinic, you have tons and tons of Christians that come out against those whackjobs.

Yeah.......i DO recall --whenever one of these freako right wingest guys blows up a clinic or shoots a doctor thru the head in front of his wife and kids-- maybe 5 or 6 prominent preachers America saying something like ---"Well, we in this church don't condone such actions".

But I am truly puzzled as to how the Public at large would be informed as to "tons and tons" of Christians coming out against such acts....?!?!?

Even if a huge number of Christians DID feel strong disapproval for said actions, how would all those *tons and tons* make known their reaction publicly?

What Media outlet would be in possession of such information, and how would they gather it? Just pondering.


I guess I am wondering where are the Muslims that come out against the unspeakable acts committed in the name of their religion.

I am still wondering what acts ---other than the Italian nun, which we are provisionally accepting as being done by Muslims in direct reaction to the Pope's comments--- you can name that Muslims have committed in reaction to the Pope's comments?

What border jumping friends would that be?

I am still wondering what acts ---other than the Italian nun, which we are provisionally accepting as being done by Muslims in direct reaction to the Pope's comments--- you can name that Muslims have committed in reaction to the Pope's comments?

The firebombing of churches, the burning of the Pope in effigy, the calls for the Pope's execution, oh and the riots........


The LEAST that can be said is that Muslims don't handle criticism very well, dammit.

What Media outlet would be in possession of such information, and how would they gather it? Just pondering.



They would be very few and far between as we all know that the Media loves to only publish items that are detrimental to the credibility of the right.

They would be very few and far between as we all know that the Media loves to only publish items that are detrimental to the credibility of the right.
Ah... we're back to the Leftwing media control Conspiracy,...as I watch Glenn Beck on CNN!

Maybe the Right really is not credible.

They would be very few and far between as we all know that the Media loves to only publish items that are detrimental to the credibility of the right.

Ok (not that I would agree with that assessment) , how then were you in possession of information that *tons and tons* of Christians came out in opposition whenever an abortion clinic was bombed??

Ah... we're back to the Leftwing media control Conspiracy,...as I watch Glenn Beck!

I don't believe it is a conspiracy. I believe that it is blatant. Thank God for talk radio.

Ok (not that I would agree with that assessment) , how then were you in possession of information that *tons and tons* of Christians came out in opposition whenever an abortion clinic was bombed??

I cannot speak personally for more than 1,000, but I know that at least 600 Christians at my university publicly petitioned against such violence in connection with the "Pro-life" efforts.

I don't believe it is a conspiracy. I believe that it is blatant. Thank God for talk radio.
Do believe the left controled media would allow Ann or Glenn on if they were really in control? The clinton movie?
Really I think the media does a good job overall, just because the right does not like their faults(BUSH) brought to light does not mean the are controlled by the Left. Sometimes the truth hurts.

Thank God for talk radio.

I reiterate.

I am not a big fan of Bush's. So sticks and stones....

I reiterate.

God is probably rolling his eyes .
Talk radio is in most cases the Radical/Extremist right.Please broaden your exposure to the world:thumbs:

What point was the Pope trying to make, surely he or someone in his close company realized this statement would blow up?
Shear stupidity to inflame the moslems more.

Beck's on TV right now:rolleyes:

You just never know what is gonna set them Muslims off so you might as well tape your mouth shut and get their permission to speak.

It is ok for the Muslims to scream that the pope is the dog in rome they are gonna slit the throats of christians and then start out by gunning down a Nun.

The Muslims are already our masters, we can only speak with the approvial of all Muslims.

Theodore Van goh, killed for words offending Muslims. Salmon Rushdie has a 1 million dollar bounty on his head because Muslims didn't like his book.

I cannot speak personally for more than 1,000, but I know that at least 600 Christians at my university publicly petitioned against such violence in connection with the "Pro-life" efforts.

Fair enough, Diva.

I accept that tons of Christians came out against an abortion clininc bombing.

And I extend my sincere condolences that you attend a university --a supposed place of learning and thought-- where there are 600 Christians (?!?!?) in attendance.

__________________________________________

The far Right rants against collectivism of thought while it happily participates in the two biggest thought collectives in the US: fundamentalist Christianity and Rushism. Both are ruthless in crushing individual thought among adherents.

What liberal media? The mainstream news Media is Republican dominated, because its top directors, owners and leaders are supporters of the Republican Party and Republican PACs.

I am not defending the radical muslims, but geeze the pope may as well have gone break dancing in a minefield, he had to known the reaction.

What border jumping friends would that be? Well your name is latina. If you don't condemn people jumping the border then We must assume that you agree with people doing such and disrespect the US and its laws. Same goes for all Mexicans whether they were born here or not.

Right Diva?

The firebombing of churches, the burning of the Pope in effigy, the calls for the Pope's execution, oh and the riots........ OMFG!!11!!!1 1.5 billion people are firebombing churches, burning effigies and rioting !!11!1!!!

Well your name is latina. If you don't condemn people jumping the border then We must assume that you agree with people doing such and disrespect the US and its laws. Same goes for all Mexicans whether they were born here or not.


Right Diva?

I thought you meant something specific. Both of my parents migrated here legally. Although I do think there should be an easier manner for well-meaning immigrants to enter this country. I am a firm believer that we ALL must follow the laws of the lands. An illegal immigrant is a criminal and should be treated as such if he is caught. How the fuck do you think Latina = Mexican?

OMFG!!11!!!1 1.5 billion people are firebombing churches, burning effigies and rioting !!11!1!!!

Ever hear the phrase, one bad apple spoils the bunch?

I've never said that the entire Muslim world supports terrorism or is even behind it, on the other, it's somewhat of a public relations disaster for the Muslim world when critics of Islam wind up dead, threatened with death or burned in effigy throughout the Middle East. Add to that all the terrorist attacks throughout the world in the name of Islam, PLUS a deafening silence from the so-called "moderate" muslims condemning riots, executions and terrorism in the name of Islam.

You'll have to excuse me if I don't buy the idea that Islam is a religion of peace, dammit.

God is probably rolling his eyes .
Talk radio is in most cases the Radical/Extremist right.Please broaden your exposure to the world:thumbs:


Again, I ask you what is so radical about the right?

You do understand that the word radical is not exactly synonymous with conservative, right?

It is ok for the Muslims to scream that the pope is the dog in rome they are gonna slit the throats of christians and then start out by gunning down a Nun.

The percentage of radical Muslims making such comments is probably lower than the percentage of radical Xtians here in America protesting funerals and screaming -- "Death to gays!!" or "Death to non-believers!!" or whoever is the latest object of their superstitious hatreds.

Salmon Rushdie has a 1 million dollar bounty on his head because Muslims didn't like his book.

No, he doesn't.

I am not defending the radical muslims, but geeze the pope may as well have gone break dancing in a minefield, he had to known the reaction.

So, the entire Western world should engage in a form of self censorhip for fear of angering the Muslims?

a) We all know that the Pope will never apologize for all THOSE innumerable acts.
If it is any consulation, John Paul II apologized for many of the terrible crimes the Catholic Church perpetrated over the years. While it does little to heal any wounds, it is a nice gesture. The Catholic Church isn't the tyrannical presence it once was. And the amount of happiness and charity they bring to the Earth is doing it's share of atonement.

Again, I ask you what is so radical about the right?

You do understand that the word radical is not exactly synonymous with conservative, right?

Listen to the likes of Beck and Coulter. They are representative of the radical right. Becks never ending call for war against Iran. Coulters call for invasion, kill their leaders and conversion to Christianity. For example.

Yes, you are right, but is a vocal part of conservatism as the above examples prove.

So, the entire Western world should engage in a form of self censorhip for fear of angering the Muslims?

It's called tact, it keeps you out of bar fights also:drinktoth
It is their anger which is now a problem for the west, no point fanning the flames as the pope did.

And the amount of happiness and charity they (the Catholic Church) bring to the Earth is doing it's share of atonement.

Ok.

Opinions vary.

Islam seems to be intent on convincing the rest of the world that they are a religion that is overly defensive and over-reactive to the most minor offenses. Let's see now, they've gone nuts over cartoons in an obscure European nation and over the pope quoting what someone else said about Islam. It's no wonder that the west perceives them as a bunch of nut baskets.

I found it humorous to see that CNN.com had a poll on this subject earlier today. I believe the question was if you think Muslims would accept an apology by the pope. An overwhemling 80% of the respondents didn't think that they would accept. I wasn't surprised a bit.

Islam seems to be intent on convincing the rest of the world that they are a religion that is overly defensive and over-reactive to the most minor offenses.

LOL.

They will never hold the title in that regard as long as Judaism is still around.

So the Pope claims that the religion of Islam was founded by an inhumane and violent person, and to prove him wrong, Muslims are committing violent and inhumane acts in reaction???? What is the reason that the Pope is apologizing to these bastards?


http://www.cair.com/default.asp?Page=articleView&id=2268&theType=NR

If you look, you'll find that not all Muslims respond in one way.

If you look, you'll find that not all Muslims respond in one way.I would add that speaking to Muslims one on one would be rather enlightening as well. You would find that public silence (which is characteristic to all groups of people) does not equate to approval.

I would add that speaking to Muslims one on one would be rather enlightening as well. You would find that public silence (which is characteristic to all groups of people) does not equate to approval.

I spoke to a couple of Muslims one on one. I asked the first one what he would do if the saw Salmon Rushdie and he said,"I would kill him of course". "How?", I asked. "With anything I can get my hands on", he replied.

The second Muslim I met was a Muslim automechanic harrassing a Jew mechanic about the Jews being the chosen people. The Jew said that they were chosen to be harrassed all over the world all the time. He then asks, "When will it ever end?". I step up to the plate and say, "It will end when the last Jew is dead." The Muslim spins around toward me and picks up a heavy wrench, his knuckes become white because he is gripping the wrench so hard. He gets right in my face and starts sceaming to me about the crusades.
I had wanted to debate the Muslim but in the end I was just happy to just get away with my life.

The third muslim was my boss on a job and after work, he blows his horn and pulls me over and demands to look in my trunk and like a dope I let him. He says someone stole a tool and he was looking for it. A police state?

http://www.cair.com/default.asp?Page=articleView&id=2268&theType=NR

If you look, you'll find that not all Muslims respond in one way.

EXCELLENT googs...a ray of hope.

LOL.

They will never hold the title in that regard as long as Judaism is still around.
You know, you're a very well read, eloquent, fool, FT.

So, the entire Western world should engage in a form of self censorhip for fear of angering the Muslims?
Yes, that's exactly what the self-ascribed "American" is saying here, Darth.

Ironic much, or is it just me???

How did he green-light Muslim contempt for all things west again....oh, yeah, by invoking the "tact" clause, right? Like by praising how "tactful" it is to issue death threats, while recognizing the immense "tact" employed destroying churches, and calling it "tactful" to burn effigies of the Pope, while slaughtering nuns, and by ignoring how "tactful" it was to call for the death of a cartoonist and filmmaker. Boy, the Pope was really out of line when he quoted someone else (in an academic setting) who (700 years ago, no less) said Muslims were inherently violent people.

Some liberals are fucking idiots.

Yes, that's exactly what the self-ascribed "American" is saying here, Darth.

Ironic much, or is it just me???

How did he green-light Muslim contempt for all things west again....oh, yeah, by invoking the "tact" clause, right? Like by praising how "tactful" it is to issue death threats, while recognizing the immense "tact" employed destroying churches, and calling it "tactful" to burn effigies of the Pope, while slaughtering nuns, and by ignoring how "tactful" it was to call for the death of a cartoonist and filmmaker. Boy, the Pope was really out of line when he quoted someone else (in an academic setting) who (700 years ago, no less) said Muslims were inherently violent people.

Some liberals are fucking idiots.

No, its exactly what you are saying, you just don't get it do you. Let me illustrate, take a stick of dynamite in one hand and a match in the other. The tactful thing to do is to keep them a part because, so you understand I'll keep it conservative simple, BOOM.

Yeah, continue on the path we're on as it seems to be working, making the arab world more peaceful and the west safer.:rolleyes:
The pope should have kept his mouth shut and concentrated on alter boys.

Some conservatives are fucking idiots.

Thats why I stay right in the middle ground and see more than either one.

I thought you meant something specific. Both of my parents migrated here legally. Although I do think there should be an easier manner for well-meaning immigrants to enter this country. I am a firm believer that we ALL must follow the laws of the lands. An illegal immigrant is a criminal and should be treated as such if he is caught. How the fuck do you think Latina = Mexican? I'm just making the point of how ridiculous what you were doing was. You can't blame whole groups of people for the extreme actions of a few. And you cannot blame people for not coming out and condemning such acts.

What relation do you have to borderjumpers? None other then that your name says latina and many crossers are of latino decent.

What relation do 1.4999999 billion muslims have to these whackos? none other then sharing the same 'label' as them. They do not think like them, do not approve of what they do, and do not engage in such acts themselves.

So where the hell do you get off labelling them all supporters of such because they hadn't responded with condemnation within hours of these acts?

Thanks prae.


It's called tact, it keeps you out of bar fights also
It is their anger which is now a problem for the west, no point fanning the flames as the pope did.

Doesn't take much to get Muslims angry, now does it, american?

It's one thing to do a madonna and desecrate religious symbols, it's quite another to criticize/critique. As long as it's the Muslims who riot over the smallest provocation and are responsible for the vast majority of terrorist acts, I'm going to criticize them, and look upon them with suspicion, dammit.

Thanks prae.




Doesn't take much to get Muslims angry, now does it, american?

It's one thing to do a madonna and desecrate religious symbols, it's quite another to criticize/critique. As long as it's the Muslims who riot over the smallest provocation and are responsible for the vast majority of terrorist acts, I'm going to criticize them, and look upon them with suspicion, dammit.

Unfortunately, your so right about that.

I spoke to a couple of Muslims one on one. I asked the first one what he would do if the saw Salmon Rushdie and he said,"I would kill him of course". "How?", I asked. "With anything I can get my hands on", he replied.

The second Muslim I met was a Muslim automechanic harrassing a Jew mechanic about the Jews being the chosen people. The Jew said that they were chosen to be harrassed all over the world all the time. He then asks, "When will it ever end?". I step up to the plate and say, "It will end when the last Jew is dead." The Muslim spins around toward me and picks up a heavy wrench, his knuckes become white because he is gripping the wrench so hard. He gets right in my face and starts sceaming to me about the crusades.
I had wanted to debate the Muslim but in the end I was just happy to just get away with my life.

The third muslim was my boss on a job and after work, he blows his horn and pulls me over and demands to look in my trunk and like a dope I let him. He says someone stole a tool and he was looking for it. A police state?Hm. Well I guess you'll just have to meet some more of them, like some of the ones that I know.
Also, I don't see what your boss being Muslim had to do with what he did. He just seems like a run-of-the-mill asshole.

Also, I don't see what your boss being Muslim had to do with what he did. He just seems like a run-of-the-mill asshole.

Assholes are assholes Jester, but if you're a muslim asshole you must be worse than a christian asshole.

Hm. Well I guess you'll just have to meet some more of them, like some of the ones that I know.
Also, I don't see what your boss being Muslim had to do with what he did. He just seems like a run-of-the-mill asshole.

I am 65 and in my whole life, only one person pulled me over and wanted to inspect my trunk. This guy was a former high ranking Egyptian officer. At the time I respected Muslims and was considering becomeing one. I tried to talk to the guy about religion but he seemed bitter and spiteful toward me. I thought it was just that he was an asshole but there seems to be a trend.

Once when I had very bad health and thought I was going to meet my maker, I looked for a group that could assure me of my afterlife. I looked to the catholics but found them to be lacking in faith so I was looking to Islam because they really believed in their god but I couldn't make any contact with Muslims but in the mean time I got better.

Once when I had very bad health and thought I was going to meet my maker, I looked for a group that could assure me of my afterlife. I looked to the catholics but found them to be lacking in faith so I was looking to Islam because they really believed in their god but I couldn't make any contact with Muslims but in the mean time I got better.

Hilarious

Assholes are assholes Jester, but if you're a muslim asshole you must be worse than a christian asshole.
Not necessarily "worse" - just more dangerous.

Hilarious
Agreed

Once when I had very bad health and thought I was going to meet my maker, I looked for a group that could assure me of my afterlife. I looked to the catholics but found them to be lacking in faith so I was looking to Islam because they really believed in their god but I couldn't make any contact with Muslims but in the mean time I got better.

Ah yes - every dying man suddenly become very spiritual when faced with his own undoing. I find it rather amusing that you of all people would turn to Allah for salvation. This was a long time ago, I bet? Would you consider converting now?

Ah yes - every dying man suddenly become very spiritual when faced with his own undoing. I find it rather amusing that you of all people would turn to Allah for salvation. This was a long time ago, I bet? Would you consider converting now?


Yes, it was some 25 years ago and I began to get a little religious while taking night classes at a Catholic College. One evening I was burning up with fever and sweating profusely when I stopped to look at a statute of Jesus and as I meditated on the statute, my fever left me and I became well again.

A few years later with bleeding ulcers I felt I was dying and looking in the staircase window of a Catholic Church was a statute of a Nun and looking at her had great healing properties.

But talking to Catholics didn't do much for me.

Since I have been on the internet I have seen too many religions from birth to the present and I realize that the only power of religion is in the power of the mind. All religions are made by man for that mans benefit.

Today I would fight to the death before accepting Islam.
If forced on me, I would accept Christianity and die from boredom while going to church.

Religion is like fire, it serves man as long as he doesn't misuse it.

I see - thank you for sharing that story.

I looked to the catholics but found them to be lacking in faith so I was looking to Islam because they really believed in their god but I couldn't make any contact with Muslims but in the mean time I got better.
Old Reb X is on the terrorist watch list.

Religion is like fire, it serves man as long as he doesn't misuse it.Well said Reb.
Four days after 9/11 some dumb yahoo in Arizona took his shotgun and killed (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,98721,00.html) the first Arab he saw. Turned out to be a Sikh, but hey, how was Billy-Bob to know? What does that say about all Americans? You tell me Diva. New flash: there are religious fanatics out there that trying to inflame things for their own benefit. This kind of thing has been happening for millenia. And no religion is immune. Best advice for all concerned is keep the religion out of politics, and keep the politics out of religion.

This article (http://www.mercatornet.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=368) would suggest that keeping religion out of politics in Muslim run countries is impossible.

So the Pope claims that the religion of Islam was founded by an inhumane and violent person, and to prove him wrong, Muslims are committing violent and inhumane acts in reaction???? What is the reason that the Pope is apologizing to these bastards?

David Lettermen said it well, he apologises to Al Qaeda but nto the alter boys his priests violated.

This article would suggest that keeping religion out of politics in Muslim run countries is impossible.Then the solution is to build dialog and relations with the moderate Muslim countries (Turkey) and pressure the radicals by taxing and/or boycotting their exports. Much cheaper than invading them all.

Gunmen open fire on Florida mosque; no injuries, damage reported
By The Associated Press

Shots were fired at a mosque in Melbourne, Florida as worshippers celebrated the start of the Muslim holy month of Ramadan, but no injuries or arrests were reported, authorities said Saturday.

A member of the Islamic Society of Brevard County stepped outside of the mosque Friday night to use his cell phone when he heard several gunshots, the Melbourne police department said.

The member, who was not immediately identified, took cover behind a wall as several rounds struck the building's south side, police said. He then ran inside and told mosque members, who called police.

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/766342.html

I can't believe how violent all those non-muslims people are. And look no non-muslims have come out to denounce this event. Typical...

Well said Reb.
Four days after 9/11 some dumb yahoo in Arizona took his shotgun and killed (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,98721,00.html) the first Arab he saw

what a tragedy, I am sure this more then justifys worldwide jihad and islams role in every single conflict going on in the world


it reminds me of my friend who has had a million jobs in his life, and every time he gets fired its not his fault, it was always him getting screwed over. Sort of like the muslims. Its no coincidence that they happen to be involved in every war going on. And Its not becasue they are always getting screwed and are fighting for justice..

what a tragedy, I am sure this more then justifys worldwide jihad and islams role in every single conflict going on in the world
I think the point was that every society has its violent, reactionary idiots.

yes, one guy shooting someone 5 years ago is proof that islam is a peaceful religion?

it reminds me of my friend who has had a million jobs in his life, and every time he gets fired its not his fault, it was always him getting screwed over. Sort of like the muslims. Its no coincidence that they happen to be involved in every war going on. And Its not becasue they are always getting screwed and are fighting for justice..
Yeah, funny how Msulims didn't start a single one of those wars.
I think the point was that every society has its violent, reactionary idiots.

yes, one guy shooting someone 5 years ago is proof that islam is a peaceful religion?

Well then obviously the point is that Americans are blood thirsty savages. Why do you hate America, apple pie and Trav, Fluffer?

yes, one guy shooting someone 5 years ago is proof that islam is a peaceful religion?1. He wasn't nearly the only victim of violence after 9/11.

2. Such incidents demonstrate that it's ridiculous to draw conclusions about huge groups of people based on isolated incidents.

3. Such incidents show that it's also ridiculous to claim that a lack of vocal, widespread condemnation can be assumed to be signify approval.

Can you people NOT see the difference in numbers between the two groups, or do you just like ignoring the ratio?