Originally posted by She-devil
:D Yes, let's recap, shall we? You said it won't work because companies won't have any incentives to give the cheap laborers jobs anymore so they'll be worse off than they are now. To explain that one away....I told you that if my logic were put into place, the companies would move there, seeking out the millions of new consumers who can actually afford their products. The employees in already wealthy nations wouldn't be able to keep up with the new found demand.

The companies already are there dullard. You really have no clue do you.. Here again is why that idea of yours is baloney. In markets like China there are often 10 or 20 factories making a specific product for the local markets & maybe 1 western company employing chinese. The western company improves quality so the products can go to the west. How does paying these people in the western owned factory 10x what the going rate is - how does that help them sell more in the local market? er....it doesn't. Plus - the workers getting paid more in your "theory" are an insignificant number - the impact of their increased spending power would have zero impact on the market. Your idea hinges on the creation of this new market - that idea is totally nuts & so far off reality it's just funny.

You said it won't work because of all the bureaucratic red tape that companies would have to endure. I said, there couldn't be anymore bureaucratic red tape than what they already face.

You said it won't work because there is no system in place for such a concept and it would be too big of a job to get one. I explained to you that such a system already exists in the form of the World Bank and universally accepted currency such as the U.S. dollar or even Euros....take your pick. Plus, my system would actually expect U.N. employees to do the jobs they actually get paid for. Imagine that.

So - the UN is going to set wage rates across the globe? Yeah right. And the crazy thing is you really do believe that is a workable idea.

My absolute favourite lame excuse of yours was your implication that companies would have to carry around a huge book a mile thick with lists of pay scales in it....lmao....still laughing about that one. :D First of all, the companies already have a listing of pay scales for their current employees in wealthy nations....2nd, have you ever heard of this wonderful new invention called a computer and the internet? ;) Imagine how easy it would be to enter a job title or commodity value in a computer and come back with an answer in mere fractions of a second. Geesh, if the Google boys had decided that loading so much information into their database was overwhelming where would we be. ;)

Clearly you do not understand sarcasm, but anyway - yes a UN computer system could handle it - but my point is - there are thousands upon thousands of jobs in the world - who is going to determine the correct rate? What if workers in one town have a higher cost of living than another - then you need to adjust the rate for that. It would take 100 years just to negotiate all the rates. In short it would be a total cluster fuck of a system that would end in flames, not to mention the point that nobody would ever be able to get a performance based raise ever again...or would the UN have to approve a persons pay raise now too? This stuff is some crazy ass shit. Blows my mind that somebody could actually believe this was a valid idea.

The difference between an idealist & a realist - is an idealist can have all these "ideas" but that's all they are - they have clue how it could be implemented, they just think flick a switch & there you have it.

Your ideas suck, they are plain stupid, ill-concieved, could never work and have no chance of ever being considered let alone implemented.

Originally posted by DrewM
The companies already are there dullard. You really have no clue do you.. Here again is why that idea of yours is baloney. In markets like China there are often 10 or 20 factories making a specific product for the local markets & maybe 1 western company employing chinese. The western company improves quality so the products can go to the west. How does paying these people in the western owned factory 10x what the going rate is - how does that help them sell more in the local market? er....it doesn't. Plus - the workers getting paid more in your "theory" are an insignificant number - the impact of their increased spending power would have zero impact on the market. Your idea hinges on the creation of this new market - that idea is totally nuts & so far off reality it's just funny.



So - the UN is going to set wage rates across the globe? Yeah right. And the crazy thing is you really do believe that is a workable idea.



Clearly you do not understand sarcasm, but anyway - yes a UN computer system could handle it - but my point is - there are thousands upon thousands of jobs in the world - who is going to determine the correct rate? What if workers in one town have a higher cost of living than another - then you need to adjust the rate for that. It would take 100 years just to negotiate all the rates. In short it would be a total cluster fuck of a system that would end in flames, not to mention the point that nobody would ever be able to get a performance based raise ever again...or would the UN have to approve a persons pay raise now too? This stuff is some crazy ass shit. Blows my mind that somebody could actually believe this was a valid idea.

The difference between an idealist & a realist - is an idealist can have all these "ideas" but that's all they are - they have clue how it could be implemented, they just think flick a switch & there you have it.

Your ideas suck, they are plain stupid, ill-concieved, could never work and have no chance of ever being considered let alone implemented.

The local market employees would be making more money in the Western companies. The other employees would be lining up to earn more money. Over a period of time, the citizens become wealthier and able to afford Western products. To make the system work, the U.S., Canada, Britain, etc....would need to refuse to buy the cheap Chinese imports for example. That forces them to up their own anty....to allow our companies to export to them. In case you didn't notice....those Chinese employees, working for the Chinese companies, can't afford to buy the products. The products they make get shipped over here and we're stupid enough to buy them....which is supporting slavery.

I didn't say the U.N. should do it. I said they're already supposed to do that sort of thing and they don't.

New York City residents have a higher cost of living than other areas of the U.S. However, does a person working at McDonalds make enough money to be able to live in a good apartment in NYC? No! :rolleyes:

So now the idea involves boycotting goods made in China unless they were made in a western factory? And how exactly would that addition be managed? Your idea gets weaker and weaker & more bizarre by the moment. Why not throw in that the goods would be transported by alien spaceships from China to the US - it wouldn't make the idea any less bizarre or unworkable.

China is a country with 1.3 billion people. The amount of western employed people in that country is a tiny tiny fraction. Your idea to boycot Chinese goods not made in western/high wage factories would essentially wreck the Chinese economy and plunge millions into poverty.

You are also wrong that Chinese workers cannot afford the products they make - they cannot afford to pay US retail prices, but they can afford to pay local Chinese prices for comparable goods that perhaps doesn't have the nike logo on it.

Overall your economic theories would destroy millions of jobs, create a whole new beaurocracy to be politicied and plunge millions into poverty. Nice idea you've got there. Keep up the good work thinktank.

Why else would Home Depot, along with many other U.S. businesses be so eager to open stores in China?

She-devil - guess where this store is ?

http://www.wal-martchina.com/samsclub/images/outside.gif

It's that great Chinese owned company Wal-Mart! - Boy I hope they open some of those stores over here in the US soon - they look great. Check out that case of dutch beer getting offloaded from the truck by those poor exploited slaves!

I guess the aisles are empty at the Chinese stores given that nobody can afford to buy any of the goods on a slaves pittance :rolleyes:

Oh well - when everybody in China gets on that UN managed scheme where their wages are set the same as workers in Minnesota, then the stores will be filled with eager shoppers & maybe then we'll get some of those Wal-marts here in my town and maybe even some of that Dutch beer.

Also - I wish we had Kentucky Fried Chicken here in the US. They have over 500 KFC stores in China and all that chicken is going to waste as none of the slaves over there can afford to buy any.

Originally posted by DrewM
So now the idea involves boycotting goods made in China unless they were made in a western factory? And how exactly would that addition be managed? Your idea gets weaker and weaker & more bizarre by the moment. Why not throw in that the goods would be transported by alien spaceships from China to the US - it wouldn't make the idea any less bizarre or unworkable.

China is a country with 1.3 billion people. The amount of western employed people in that country is a tiny tiny fraction. Your idea to boycot Chinese goods not made in western/high wage factories would essentially wreck the Chinese economy and plunge millions into poverty.

You are also wrong that Chinese workers cannot afford the products they make - they cannot afford to pay US retail prices, but they can afford to pay local Chinese prices for comparable goods that perhaps doesn't have the nike logo on it.

Overall your economic theories would destroy millions of jobs, create a whole new beaurocracy to be politicied and plunge millions into poverty. Nice idea you've got there. Keep up the good work thinktank.

No, the idea involves truly free and fair trade. Which in case you missed the memo, means that our manufacturers will actually be competing on a fair level with China among others. In order for Chinese goods to be sold in our countries, the Chinese have to pay their employees on the same pay scale as our companies pay. That eliminates the unfair advantage they have over us.

I'm well aware of China's population....all the more reason to deal with them now, before they're the superpower that just happens to be Communist in case you forgot. :rolleyes: Also, your military is in tough in Iraq....just imagine when your military is fighting a nation with such a huge population....capable of sending many more millions of troops to fight you.

Oh thank you for admitting that they can't afford to purchase our goods. Duh! That's what I've been trying to tell you. Why should we purchase theirs with their unfair advantage...paying cheap labourers....and then in return, they can't purchase ours? You see now?????

They must be buying our goods - the US exported 2.6 Billion$ of goods to China in 2005. (Isn't that more than the GDP of Canada? :D)

We already have free & fair trade fruitcake.

Fire up those Alien spaceships - we've got some products to ship.

Originally posted by DrewM
They must be buying our goods - the US exported 2.6 Billion$ of goods to China in 2005. (Isn't that more than the GDP of Canada? :D)

We already have free & fair trade fruitcake.

Fire up those Alien spaceships - we've got some products to ship.

No, the Canadian GDP is approximately $1 trillion....roughly per capita with that of the U.S. By the way, I already know but why don't you do us all a favour and post how many billions China exported to the U.S. The trade deficit with China is alarming.

On a side note...how sad is it, that you only exported $2.6 billion to China....and Bush and his peeps spent $1.6 billion of American taxpayer money to pay for their propaganda...selling their decisions to the American people? :p

With Iran and China gunning for you....look out!

Originally posted by She-devil
No, the Canadian GDP is approximately $1 trillion....roughly per capita with that of the U.S. By the way, I already know but why don't you do us all a favour and post how many billions China exported to the U.S. The trade deficit with China is alarming.

On a side note...how sad is it, that you only exported $2.6 billion to China....and Bush and his peeps spent $1.6 billion of American taxpayer money to pay for their propaganda...selling their decisions to the American people? :p

With Iran and China gunning for you....look out!

Yes I realise the GDP of Canada is not 2.6 Billion. Duh.

Actually the GDP per capita of Canada is well below that of the US. The US is No.4 and Canada is No.16 at only about 75% of the US level. But anyway - GDP per capita is a bit meaningless for this type of comparision (which is perhaps why you chose it) - Equatorial Guinea is No.2 & nobody would suggest Equatorial Guinea is a world power.

When you look at the reality - Canada is the 2nd largest country on earth, huge level of natural resources. What has it done with this gift? pretty much nothing. It's just one of those sit on the sidelines type of countries, nothing much to offer & nothing to contribute. Mexico is far far more interesting - they make no bones about being where they are at & what a far far more interesting country. Canada is like a poorly made clone of the US but Mexico has it's own interesting & unique culture.

Originally posted by DrewM
Yes I realise the GDP of Canada is not 2.6 Billion. Duh.

Actually the GDP per capita of Canada is well below that of the US. The US is No.4 and Canada is No.16 at only about 75% of the US level. But anyway - GDP per capita is a bit meaningless for this type of comparision (which is perhaps why you chose it) - Equatorial Guinea is No.2 & nobody would suggest Equatorial Guinea is a world power.

When you look at the reality - Canada is the 2nd largest country on earth, huge level of natural resources. What has it done with this gift? pretty much nothing. It's just one of those sit on the sidelines type of countries, nothing much to offer & nothing to contribute. Mexico is far far more interesting - they make no bones about being where they are at & what a far far more interesting country. Canada is like a poorly made clone of the US but Mexico has it's own interesting & unique culture.

I see that you didn't want to humiliate yourself any further, so you ignored my question about how many billions China exports to the U.S. I don't blame you.

Yes, it would be much smarter of Canada to deplete its natural resources so that we have nothing left for the future. :rolleyes: Do you expect 30 million people to be able to manufacture/sell as many things as America's 300 million people? :rolleyes: Of course not! That's why GDP per capita is pretty damned relevant!

Originally posted by She-devil
I see that you didn't want to humiliate yourself any further, so you ignored my question about how many billions China exports to the U.S.This is sort of funny. It's almost as though Mr. Buchanan has been following along with your conversation:

Our hollow prosperity

By Patrick J. Buchanan

02/15/06 -- -- Now that the U.S. trade deficit for 2005 has come in at $726 billion, the fourth straight all-time record, a question arises.

What constitutes failure for a free-trade policy? Or is there no such thing? Is free trade simply right no matter the results?

Last year, the United States ran a $202 billion trade deficit with China, the largest ever between two nations. We ran all-time record trade deficits with OPEC, the European Union, Japan, Canada and Latin America. The $50 billion deficit with Mexico was the largest since NAFTA passed and also the largest in history.

When NAFTA was up for a vote in 1993, the Clintonites and their GOP fellow-travelers said it would grow our trade surplus, raise Mexico's standard of living and reduce illegal immigration.

None of this happened. Indeed, the opposite occurred. Mexico's standard of living is lower than it was in 1993, the U.S. trade surplus has vanished, and America is being invaded. Mexico is now the primary source of narcotics entering the United States.

Again, when can we say a free-trade policy has failed?

The Bushites point proudly to 4.6 million jobs created since May 2003, a 4.7 percent unemployment rate and low inflation.

Unfortunately, conservative columnist Paul Craig Roberts and analysts Charles McMillion and Ed Rubenstein have taken a close look at the figures and discovered that the foundation of the Bush prosperity rests on rotten timber.

Rest of article (http://informationclearinghouse.info/article11938.htm)

Originally posted by sedan
This is sort of funny. It's almost as though Mr. Buchanan has been following along with your conversation:


What's so funny about it? It just goes to show that something needs to be done to keep a vibrant manufacturing industry in Canada/U.S. etc. Once it's gone, we'll have to close our borders entirely just to keep our own citizens in work. Cheap labour abroad is the death of the middle class unless something is done....such as the idea I suggested. ;)

Why do we need to keep a vibrant manufacturing industry? The answer is - we don't need to manufacture things here that can be made cheaper elsewhere.

Originally posted by DrewM
Why do we need to keep a vibrant manufacturing industry? The answer is - we don't need to manufacture things here that can be made cheaper elsewhere.

Okay brainiac....let's allow North America to disintegrate and become new land for the Chinese to feed their massive population then!

Do you seriously believe that once we've trained the Chinese and given them all of our technological know-how....that they'll continue to sell us their products so cheap? :rolleyes: Newsflash but working for a retail outlet for minimum wage, won't afford us to be able to keep a roof over our heads, let alone the money left over to buy things! :rolleyes:

The middle class created our economies....without them, our economies are abysmal...non-existent! How can someone be so stupid? Yeah, it makes sense to give foreigners our jobs, and then continue to finance them rather than our own workers, doesn't it? :rolleyes: You forget that the CEO's of the world are a small fragment of the population.....which leaves cashier and warehouse employee jobs for the rest of us. Sounds brilliant! :rolleyes: Won't it be fun, serving the Communist Chinese?

China isn't the only place in the world with cheap labor.

You seem to think that there are 3 kinds of jobs - manufacturing, working at a retail job and being a CEO as the 3rd one.

Just how stupid are you? It seems your stupidity has no limits.

Yes, I'm well aware that China isn't the only place with cheap labour. I've mentioned other nations in this thread as well. However, China is the biggest threat to our work force. China is Communist and they have a huge population. When they usurp the U.S. as the super power, what do you think will happen? Once people get a taste of power, they abuse it. They go outside of their borders in an attempt to sustain their future grasp on power. (U.S. is exhibit A and England is exhibit B to prove that.) Do you think the large population of China that's currently living in the dark ages, will continue to live that way? Of course not! So, to sustain their appetites for food and resources, they'll be very willing to invade North America to get it.

That doesn't make the Chinese horrible people....it makes them human. Everybody looks out for themselves and if need be, they're willing to kill to get what they want.

If Canada/U.S. loses its manufacturing sector altogether, do you think our stock markets will be able to sustain us? Stocks aren't physical assets. Look at the Enron employees...they thought their retirement was taken care of. Then, all of a sudden...where did their stocks/investments/shares go? They were gone because they have no ownership of anything physical that they can put their hands on. When a stock market crashes, you're left with nothing. It's not like owning land, forests, mines, oil wells, crops, etc. Those types of things are what make people truly wealthy.

Take Japan for example....they have a healthy economy at the moment. However, they're completely dependent on other nations to feed their large population. They live on a relatively small island. They have absolutely nothing physical to sustain their economy/wealth. We're currently setting ourselves up to be completely dependent on China. We're giving them our resources, paying them to manufacture things with those resources, then we're dumb enough to pay them for doing so.

Anyway, what I'm getting at is....once China increases its wealth because we continue to finance them by purchasing all of their cheap crap like the stupid dweebs we are....we'll no longer be able to keep them from seizing control of our physical wealth (our resources). They have like a billion more people to fight us....we're financing their military buildup by buying cheap crap and the Communists use the profit for their military/nukes. They have spies who steal our intellectual property and in turn, they use it against us.

Do you honestly think that once we sacrifice our own middle class in favour of nations like China, that China will continue to allow us to be wealthier than them? That they'll starve their own citizens so we can continue to hog the Earth's resources for ourselves and our citizens will remain in control of the companies, etc.? :rolleyes:

Also, of course there are more than just manufacturing/retail/CEO jobs. There're also stock traders. I told you the problems with that. There're also truck drivers, warehouse workers, medical workers, etc. However, there are about a billion Chinese citizens who need jobs. Do you think they'll allow us to keep those jobs if we keep setting them up with our wealth? :rolleyes:

You're incredibly naive!

I maybe naive, but you are just plain dumb.

China will develop at it's own pace, and although it is currently a long way behind the US, it will in maybe 50 years or so be a world superpower. You seem to be holding the silly notion that we can impact this by not buying cheap chinese made goods.

And how on earth could China ever take away medical workers, truck drivers & warehousing worker jobs in the US?

Originally posted by DrewM
I maybe naive, but you are just plain dumb.

China will develop at it's own pace, and although it is currently a long way behind the US, it will in maybe 50 years or so be a world superpower. You seem to be holding the silly notion that we can impact this by not buying cheap chinese made goods.

And how on earth could China ever take away medical workers, truck drivers & warehousing worker jobs in the US?

Fifty years or so??? You're not for real are you?

By purchasing cheap made Chinese goods, we're financing China's military buildup. I already explained that! China is Communist and has no intentions of being anything other than that....which means, that when we pay for Chinese goods, we're paying the Chinese government! The Chinese government then in turn, spends that money on its nuclear arsenal, military soldiers, etc. In other words, we're paying them to become a super power...a Communist super power. :eek:

Were you ignoring what I said, per usual? :rolleyes: China has like a billion more citizens than Canada/U.S./Britain. Which means, they have a billion more people to feed. When those people get a taste of wealth, they'll want more and more. They won't want to go back to going hungry with little more than the clothes on their back as their wealth. In order to keep up with their new demand, they'll go beyond the Chinese borders to get it.

Prae rationalizes the Iraq war as a necessity to ensure resources for America's future....do you think the Chinese won't want to do the same? What better place to find that, than North America? They'll take our land, our jobs, etc.

Do you think they're building up their military, stealing our intellectual property, and financing your government's loans out of the goodness of their hearts? They're doing it for themselves and their own Communist interests! :rolleyes:

The only way to stall that, is to ensure that we're not willing to purchase their goods, unless we're on equal footing....unless our businesses can actually compete with their cheap labour! In other words, we shouldn't be paying them to dominate us someday.

It'll take at least 50 years for China to become a superpower. They have 1.3 billion mouths to feed.

Originally posted by She-devil
1. China is Communist and has no intentions of being anything other than that....

2. When those people get a taste of wealth, they'll want more and more.
These are mutually exclusive. The latter will eventually overthrow the former, or the former will crush the latter, but you can't have both for long.

Originally posted by Brooks
These are mutually exclusive. The latter will eventually overthrow the former, or the former will crush the latter, but you can't have both for long.

I never said you could have both. You simply used some selective editing. I was referring to the massive population of Chinese....that even under the Communist system are still going hungry because they're not yet part of the Chinese manufacturing industry.

Originally posted by DrewM
It'll take at least 50 years for China to become a superpower. They have 1.3 billion mouths to feed.

Oh my gosh! Wonders never cease! So are you admitting that China is a concern???

Although, at the current pace, it won't take nearly 50 years for them to become a superpower.

At current growth rates - it'll take at least 50 years, and that's a wildly optimistic estimate. The US economy is about 8 times bigger than the Chinese economy. 4% of a large number is still more than 10% of a small number when it comes to growth. Do the math before you talk out of your ass.

I don't see China as a concern - you are the one that see's China as a concern, not me.

Originally posted by DrewM
At current growth rates - it'll take at least 50 years, and that's a wildly optimistic estimate. The US economy is about 8 times bigger than the Chinese economy. 4% of a large number is still more than 10% of a small number when it comes to growth. Do the math before you talk out of your ass.

I don't see China as a concern - you are the one that see's China as a concern, not me.

You seem to think that a nation's growth rate stays consistent over a 50 year period. Then you say that I'm talking out of my ass!? :rolleyes:

If it took 47 years before a man could retire very wealthy...does that mean that his children will have to wait 47 years to be wealthy? Or, does it mean that once wealth has been achieved for one, it has a trickle down effect that increases the wealth of many? To say nothing of the fact that America's economy won't sustain it's current rate if they keep giving the Chinese their manufacturing jobs and running huge debts to the Chinese.

You also have to factor in that the U.S. only has 300 million people and of those 300 million, only about 100 million (guess)...one third...actually work. That means that to be America's equal, China only needs 1/13th of its population to be working at increasing their GDP. It would be very easy for them to double or triple your economic output in a very short amount of time. By gaining Iran's oil exports just recently....they're well on their way to usurping the U.S. in a short period of time.

The fact that you don't see China as a concern, and that we're financing their economic dominance, only proves your naivety.

You are dreaming. The have 1.3 billion people of mainly uneducated people. To support a high growth rate you need highly skilled workers. China's growth is around 10% and that is problematic for them as it is starting to create inflation. Too rapid a growth will crash their economy & they know it. China's target growth level is 7% a year to create sustainable growth.

So, again, do the math.

I have university education in macro & micro economics I know what I'm talking about. You on the other hand have really no clue about economics, as evidenced in your wacko posts involving anything related to economics.

She-Devil asks ................."If it took 47 years before a man could retire very wealthy...does that mean that his children will have to wait 47 years to be wealthy?

This shouldn't even be a question ..........however .....it has become an issue in liberal socialist countries that have "the death tax" .............or communist countries that don't believe in private property.

I suspect that Canada is in this list.

Thankfully .......here in the United States this is becoming a non issue ..............and ......an estate is allowed to transfer property to it's heirs ......without having to account for double taxation upon a persons death.


Slim

Originally posted by DrewM
You are dreaming. The have 1.3 billion people of mainly uneducated people. To support a high growth rate you need highly skilled workers. China's growth is around 10% and that is problematic for them as it is starting to create inflation. Too rapid a growth will crash their economy & they know it. China's target growth level is 7% a year to create sustainable growth.

So, again, do the math.

I have university education in macro & micro economics I know what I'm talking about. You on the other hand have really no clue about economics, as evidenced in your wacko posts involving anything related to economics.

So, in your world, it takes 50 freakin' years to get an education???:rolleyes: Do you think China cares about inflation? China toys with it's currency as it sees fit and other nations are too chicken shit to take a stand against it.

Again, do the math. You're relying on past growth rates. The future is uncertain....which means, you can't use past numbers to calculate the future rates of growth! :rolleyes:

Oh no! Not a university education!!!! I'm scared and shaking in my boots now! :eek: You certainly haven't proven your superior intelligence in this discussion so I think you probably just skimmed by in university.

Originally posted by slim
She-Devil asks ................."If it took 47 years before a man could retire very wealthy...does that mean that his children will have to wait 47 years to be wealthy?

This shouldn't even be a question ..........however .....it has become an issue in liberal socialist countries that have "the death tax" .............or communist countries that don't believe in private property.

I suspect that Canada is in this list.

Thankfully .......here in the United States this is becoming a non issue ..............and ......an estate is allowed to transfer property to it's heirs ......without having to account for double taxation upon a persons death.


Slim

Perhaps you should do some research on Canada, before you simply make stuff up to make yourself seem ignorant.....there is no estate tax in Canada.

Originally posted by She-devil
So, in your world, it takes 50 freakin' years to get an education???:rolleyes: Do you think China cares about inflation? China toys with it's currency as it sees fit and other nations are too chicken shit to take a stand against it.

Again, do the math. You're relying on past growth rates. The future is uncertain....which means, you can't use past numbers to calculate the future rates of growth! :rolleyes:

Oh no! Not a university education!!!! I'm scared and shaking in my boots now! :eek: You certainly haven't proven your superior intelligence in this discussion so I think you probably just skimmed by in university.

It takes 50 years at least to create the infrastructure to educate 1.3 billion people. Plus, people have to go through education from a young age, you can't create an educated worker from somebody who is already past education age. Only a moron like yourself would fail to understand that point & assume I meant it would take 50 years to educate 1 person. What a fool you are.

Yes I think China cares about inflation. China is very careful to control it's economic growth.

Yes, of course I'm relying on past growth rates - but here's a tip for you - should help, given your obvious low IQ. Percentage's go from 0 - 100. What level do you think China is going to grow at in the future 50% a year? What are you - some kind of Canadian retard? I think we all know the answer to that.

Originally posted by DrewM
It takes 50 years at least to create the infrastructure to educate 1.3 billion people. Plus, people have to go through education from a young age, you can't create an educated worker from somebody who is already past education age. Only a moron like yourself would fail to understand that point & assume I meant it would take 50 years to educate 1 person. What a fool you are.

Yes I think China cares about inflation. China is very careful to control it's economic growth.

Yes, of course I'm relying on past growth rates - but here's a tip for you - should help, given your obvious low IQ. Percentage's go from 0 - 100. What level do you think China is going to grow at in the future 50% a year? What are you - some kind of Canadian retard? I think we all know the answer to that.

It doesn't take 50 years to create the infrastructure to educate people! It takes months to build a school, and a couple of years to train teachers. That's all you need. By the way, I guess you're forgetting that a large percentage of American workers are uneducated and illiterate. Only a moron like yourself would fail to understand that point. I never assumed you meant one person. However, do you think China doesn't have schools??? I thought you said you'd been there. In case you didn't realize it, lots of Canadians and Americans are teaching in China, Korea, etc. They teach them in English. As well, the ones who can afford it, send their kids to school here.

Yeah, I'm a Canadian retard. :rolleyes: Only a retard would suggest that a country's growth rate stays at the same level over a 50 year period! Newsflash, did the American economy grow at the same percentage rate in the 20 years from 1930 - 1950? Now, add another 30 years to that....did it grow at the same rate from 1930 - 1980? No, of course not you dimwit! However, America is the special, superior exception though right? Not! Answer the same question for Canada if that's how dumb you are.

Yeah, you all know that I'm a retard....that's why you waste so much of your time responding to me. If I truly were a retard and everybody thought so, you'd ignore me the way you ignore my very valid points.

You are simply clueless.

Originally posted by DrewM
You are simply clueless.

Yeah, I'm so clueless that I hold my own on a subject about economics, against a microeconomics university major such as yourself. :rolleyes:

I can always tell when you've been stumped....instead of rebuttals and insults, you only have insults.

Originally posted by She-devil
I can always tell when you've been stumped....instead of rebuttals and insults, you only have insults.
Either that, or like everyone else here, he's sick and fucking tired of responding to your nonsense. Outside of insulting you, there's nothing more to say. Deal with it.

Originally posted by The Praetorian
Either that, or like everyone else here, he's sick and fucking tired of responding to your nonsense. Outside of insulting you, there's nothing more to say. Deal with it.

Spoken by someone who responded to my so-called nonsense....:rolleyes: LOL, gee you must truly be tired of me to go out of your way and respond to me like that.:D

He's right. No matter what anybody said, it'd make no difference - you have to be one of the most annoying people ever to post on this forum (except maybe for me :)) - you simply ignore every valid argument presented to you. If you want to delude yourself into thinking that means you presented valid points that nobody can refute and 'hold your own' then go with it - if that makes you happy. You've shown me without any doubt that you are a moron & that's all I can say about your posts. Sorry.

Originally posted by She-devil
Spoken by someone who responded to my so-called nonsense....:rolleyes: LOL, gee you must truly be tired of me to go out of your way and respond to me like that.:D
That's not the issue, you snide windbag. You came here to DISRESPECT our nation because you and your ilk frown upon any sign of nationalism in this country. IOW, we're not allowed to love our country without a constant reminder of how we've never really accomplished anything on our own (from our culture to our technology, etc.). We can't say look how great NASA is without you mentioning Canadian involvement. The issue here is your insecurity, not ours. People can love their nation all they want, but it's anathema for them to hear ANYTHING positive about America unless you want to get yelled at. I think we're all sick and tired of your incessant bitching and moaning. Feel free to exit stage left at any time, SD.

In most of the greatest accomplishments that have occured worldwide there is involvement with many countries and people from many countries who work together to accomplish this goal. However whenever we bring up something the United States did whith a huge and large role, and had more impact then any other country in that accomplishment we are pounded with any involvement from another country in that achievement to make it look like we really suck as a nation. Lord.

Just take a look at the US economy - 12 trillion $ - far and away the biggest economy on earth. That is a huge accomplishment - it didn't just create itself. It was created by the hard work of generations of people. Sure, some Canadians may have been involved, the US is a country of immigrants - but there are even more Canadians in Canada - why didn't they do the same in Canada? Because the US is a place where people can make change & drive growth. That is what makes America great. It took only 66 years between the 1st American flying in a plane for the first 12 seconds, 540 feet of manned flight to the first American landing and walking on the moon a quarter million miles away in space. That is an incredible achievement in only 66 years. NO other country on earth even comes close in terms of achievement.

Originally posted by DrewM
NO other country on earth even comes close in terms of achievement.
England does.

Originally posted by Overdose
However whenever we bring up something the United States did whith a huge and large role, and had more impact then any other country in that accomplishment we are pounded with any involvement from another country in that achievement to make it look like we really suck as a nation.

Really??

Could you provide a couple of examples that would illustrate what you're talking about?

Thanks.

The advent of mass production, NASA/the space program, jumbo jets, the computer, the Internet (American/British), GPS, the telephone (arguably), big business (American/British), Oil refining (American/British), and the list goes on.

It's a pointless endeavor to go any further because shitwits like Shedevil will only find solace in mentioning how Canada provided the nuts and bolts for our Space Shuttle.

Originally posted by Freethinker
Really??

Could you provide a couple of examples that would illustrate what you're talking about?

Thanks.
I have in a few threads already. But I would say during World War II America could have defeated Japan on our own without help from other countries. Yes, we had help in a few battles and inventions but the vast majority of the defeat of Japan was due to the United States and the United States alone. I'm sure you can find examples of how we had help but if you look at it on an overall scale we were the main country who took the offense against Japan.

Originally posted by The Praetorian
The advent of mass production, NASA/the space program, jumbo jets, the computer, the Internet (American/British), GPS, the telephone (arguably), big business (American/British), Oil refining (American/British), and the list goes on.

You are entirely missing the point.

I have NO doubt whatsoever that the list of things in which the US had a large role or the primary role in creating is immense.

I wanted to hear an example or two illustrating the SECOND qualifier in Overdose's allegation, that whenever one of those accomplishments is brought up, the U.S. is .........(to quote Overdose)....""pounded...over that achievement to make it look like we really suck as a nation""

Originally posted by DrewM
He's right. No matter what anybody said, it'd make no difference - you have to be one of the most annoying people ever to post on this forum (except maybe for me :)) - you simply ignore every valid argument presented to you. If you want to delude yourself into thinking that means you presented valid points that nobody can refute and 'hold your own' then go with it - if that makes you happy. You've shown me without any doubt that you are a moron & that's all I can say about your posts. Sorry.

You mean "every valid argument presented to" me like this one of yours: "You are simply clueless"?? I loved how you ignored my obviously valid point to make that rebuttal. :rolleyes: That's how it is with you, time and time again. I started off being very civil to you....to which, you eventually got frustrated and started the name calling. I of course tossed it right back at ya.

What makes me fully aware of the fact that I made valid points, is your change of subject and lack of a rebuttal. I'm anything but a moron and you know it. It pisses you off.

Originally posted by The Praetorian
That's not the issue, you snide windbag. You came here to DISRESPECT our nation because you and your ilk frown upon any sign of nationalism in this country. IOW, we're not allowed to love our country without a constant reminder of how we've never really accomplished anything on our own (from our culture to our technology, etc.). We can't say look how great NASA is without you mentioning Canadian involvement. The issue here is your insecurity, not ours. People can love their nation all they want, but it's anathema for them to hear ANYTHING positive about America unless you want to get yelled at. I think we're all sick and tired of your incessant bitching and moaning. Feel free to exit stage left at any time, SD.

Give me one example of how I disrespected your nation. I spoke the truth about the vile acts of terrorism your nation has committed after someone suggested that Iran shouldn't have nukes because of their vile behaviour. DrewM even said that my examples were correct. So, do you have a problem with acknowledging America's mistakes? I acknowledged Canada's vile treatment of the Indians and then the Japanese Canadians in WW II. You see, a nation can't progress and learn from its mistakes, if it wants to deny events and sweep them under the carpet. So what's your problem with me telling the truth about the U.S. when it's relevant to the topic at hand?:rolleyes:

I'd also like you to give me an example of when I insulted the U.S. to the degree you guys have insulted Canada. I have absolutely no problem allowing you guys to list America's accomplishments.....the problem is, you don't simply list the accomplishments; you have to list them and then insult Canada in the process. :rolleyes: For example, you ignore the obvious fact that Drew didn't simply mention America's NASA accomplishment....he added this beauty afterwards: "What happened to Canada - why did it it evolve to be such a worthless and weak nation with nothing to offer the world? Filled with people like you perhaps?" :rolleyes: Was that necessary? No! Was me adding the facts about the many Canadian engineers who participated in the success of NASA essential after that insult? Absofreakinlutely! Him complimenting the U.S. by insulting Canada and suggesting that Canada never does anything, made it very relevant for me to mention Canada's contribution to the things he mentioned. If you can't see that, you're a numbnut.

Also, find one time when I said anything about the U.S. like these other quotes from you guys: "you belong to a weak nation of followers". This one too...."Canada has no accomplishments at all."..."Canada is an arctic wasteland with a small population of drunks crying about how they are better than the US. What a sorry joke."....."Canada sucks - get over it."...."They're not even a real country anyway"..."You'll be waiting a long time before you see any significant news item with mention of Canada. You should see the US mentioned about 100 times a day. Why is that? Because the US is significant & Canada is an arctic wasteland filled with drunks who never created a country like the US and never will."..."The reason Canada hasn't been attacked is because they have no spine to stand up and do anything.....Canada follows, it does not lead."....."Canada hardly does shit to help the world community."..."They don't have any foreign policies !"...."Canada does nothing apart from sit on the sidelines, criticise & tell anybody who will listen how important they are."..."Mexico is 100x more interesting than Canada."...."Lets face it Canada is an irrelevant & sparsely-populated country where up to 98% of the citizens are alcoholics. Most Canadian citizens have government jobs where they are paid to say "Eh?" all day long."...."She-devil has helped us prove quite conclusively what the whole world already knows - how worthless Canada is. Canada does have a unique role to play in the world - to be the butt of Americans jokes & laughter."..."We own the Canadians."....."If Canada did nothing in the world nobody would even notice. "..."I mean, let's be honest: the only good things to come out of Canada were John Candy and titty bars."..."Canada will be last in the world in every action."...."People in the US don't generally take canada very seriously & the running joke is Canadians are a strange breed." :rolleyes:

So, when I gave examples about Canada, that proved those asinine quotes false...and offered up examples of Canadian accomplishments, after I was asked to do so....how exactly does that mean that I'm insecure and have to deny you your patriotism?

Originally posted by Overdose
However whenever we bring up something the United States did whith a huge and large role, and had more impact then any other country in that accomplishment we are pounded with any involvement from another country in that achievement to make it look like we really suck as a nation. Lord.

Actually, you guys asked me to provide examples of Canadian accomplishments....and the only times I corrected you and mentioned Canada's and other countries' involvement with the things you mentioned, was when you incorrectly declared your examples as American only accomplishments. If you say something false, you should expect to be corrected. I expect you guys to correct me when I say something wrong.

Originally posted by DrewM
Just take a look at the US economy - 12 trillion $ - far and away the biggest economy on earth. That is a huge accomplishment - it didn't just create itself. It was created by the hard work of generations of people. Sure, some Canadians may have been involved, the US is a country of immigrants - but there are even more Canadians in Canada - why didn't they do the same in Canada? Because the US is a place where people can make change & drive growth. That is what makes America great. It took only 66 years between the 1st American flying in a plane for the first 12 seconds, 540 feet of manned flight to the first American landing and walking on the moon a quarter million miles away in space. That is an incredible achievement in only 66 years. NO other country on earth even comes close in terms of achievement.

I've never denied that the U.S. economy is the biggest on earth. I never took anything away from that accomplishment. All I did was show you how Canada is equal per capita....and it is, so what the hell is your problem with that?

I also gave examples of Canadian achievements and companies that did find success in Canada without having to leave.

However, you again have to suggest that no other country can even come close to America's achievement....that's totally false. You can be patriotic without having to be ignorant and deny other nations their due respect.

Still waiting for Overdose to provide an example or two illustrating the second qualifier in his claim that whenever any of the accomplishments or acheivements of America are brought up, it is then....""pounded...over that achievement to make it look like we really suck as a nation""

Just curious.

Shit,if a people/country cant laugh at itself,whats the point.Theres gotta be some 'stupid american' jokes out there somewhere.We irish have been the butt of english jokes for years,so what.i laugh at them myself,canada should just keep sending actors like:jim carey,william shatner and michael j fox to US tv,thatll sicken the yanks,if nothing does...

All Hail The Mighty Necromancer!