for those that don't know.
stigmata- bodily marks or pains resembling the wounds of Christ and sometimes accompanying religious ecstasy.

I watched a show about this on DC, and it leaves alot to be questioned. Many folks were proven to be fake but there are others that could not be investicated etc... Do you believe it is true or just another atempt at attention? Could it be brought on by the brain, done unconsciously , or is there a higher power involved?

I think in all cases where it isn't faked, it's done by the brain. It can do some crazy shit when you're high like that.

We saw this show too.
My opinion--the people with stigmata appear to be sincere.
Key word--appear.
I would say that they're hoaxes, either advertently, or inadvertently.
Especially the Korean woman, who's made millions off her "affliction."
The Mexican woman seemed much more sincere but then again, she has never been seen before her bleeding started. So we don't know if she's doing this to herself or not.
It's an odd thing, no doubt, but the show did little to really answer the questions--at least mine!

I agree it didn't answer anything really just made it more open to the public.

I guess this is the same show I saw a while back.
I can not comprehend that this is truely some miracle, I look for a scientific explanation for such things.

Kind of like the bleeding statue thingy you hear about occasionally.

I do not believe any of this stuff has a supernatural origin.
I put it along with the picture of Christ on the toast. Just something that happens.

Why would a supposedly loving god want to be reminded of the worst time in his life. I think if Christ really lived he would be pissed off by people wearing crosses, or religiously excited about bleeding hands, etc.

Kind of like saying, we nailed you to a cross and worship any reminder of such, seems somehow like a lasting insult.

Originally posted by Dan Fussell
Why would a supposedly loving god want to be reminded of the worst time in his life.

I will try a whack at this question...
Going from a theological standpoint, that was the pinnacle of his life, and reason for his existence, functioning as a sacrificial lamb to pay for the sins of humanity. In Jewish tradition, a pristine lamb would be taken to the back of the temple and slaughtered as reconciling the sins of the congregation, but it would require a human, the perfect human, to pay for the sins of Man in a true sense.

It was through the crucifixion that his purpose was fulfilled, and it was then that the beginnings of understanding by the apostles began. That being the ganglion of the faith, that he was the Agnus Dei, those reminders provide basis for being steadfast in belief and practice. Just my take on it.

Originally posted by mad dog
Many folks were proven to be fake but there are others that could not be investicated etc... Do you believe it is true or just another atempt at attention? Could it be brought on by the brain, done unconsciously , or is there a higher power involved?

In these sort of cases, this affliction is most likely going to be brought on by conscience or unconscience creation of the markings, and working in tandem with some sort of off-beat mental state of the individual. I would like to see all these supposed victims be scrutinized by scientific investigation to determine the cause and what it is.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Evakian
[B]I will try a whack at this question...
Going from a theological standpoint, that was the pinnacle of his life, and reason for his existence, functioning as a sacrificial lamb to pay for the sins of humanity. In Jewish tradition, a pristine lamb would be taken to the back of the temple and slaughtered as reconciling the sins of the congregation, but it would require a human, the perfect human, to pay for the sins of Man in a true sense.
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I understand what you are saying.

Why do you think that murder of animals and humans would be required for reconciliation?

I understand that some people believe that the Son, Father and Holy Ghost were one. That seems like god was sacrificing himself to appease himself.

Supposedly Jesus was killed to wipe out the sins of man.
But, if he was a god, he was never really killed. He merely returned to heaven. I could see the sacrifice if he was to be obliterated from existance forever.

Originally posted by Dan Fussell
Why do you think that murder of animals and humans would be required for reconciliation?

I don't.

Supposedly Jesus was killed to wipe out the sins of man.
But, if he was a god, he was never really killed. He merely returned to heaven. I could see the sacrifice if he was to be obliterated from existance forever.

Well, there is the matter of the physical purgation, as well as the duration in hell to be assessed in that story. The idea that it is a triune god leads one to say that it is not him returning to his heavenly form, but his carnal form is being killed, the Son is being killed. So this case of deicide did not obliterate all the forms, but one.

But enough about that, onto stigmata.

Originally posted by Evakian

But enough about that, onto stigmata. [/B]
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But you see, these are some of the things that lead to stigmata.
Mental conditioning to acceptance of stories as a persons reality can lead to manifestations of reasurance.

I would like to know if a person that is proven, without a shadow of doubt to have never heard of Jesus, has ever been known to have a stigmata happen to them.

Originally posted by Dan Fussell
I would like to know if a person that is proven, without a shadow of doubt to have never heard of Jesus, has ever been known to have a stigmata happen to them.

But if this stigmatization were somehow true, why do you think it would effect someone outside that faith?

The entire basis of the occurance comes from the idea that the person is exceptionally faithful in Jesus and so zealous that they identify with the pain of the crucifixion, which comes out of the condition. With that in mind, it technically could not happen to someone that did not 'believe in' Jesus.

And to answer that request, I may be wrong but to my knowledge I believe that there were roughly 500 stigmata victims, 62 of whom are recognized as saints, and all of which are related to the Catholic Church in some manner. Some instances were found that it was faked, either by the person confessing or the wounds healing, as "true stigmata" supposedly does not heal.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Evakian
[B]But if this stigmatization were somehow true, why do you think it would effect someone outside that faith?
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I don't. This is the point I am making. Not that it is some type of religious miracle reward for belief, but that it is a mental condition brought about by a brain full of propaganda.

Originally posted by Dan Fussell
I don't. This is the point I am making. Not that it is some type of religious miracle reward for belief, but that it is a mental condition brought about by a brain full of propaganda.

I think we're in agreement on this issue, but no one else appears to be interested.

Originally posted by Dan Fussell
I do not believe any of this stuff has a supernatural origin.
I put it along with the picture of Christ on the toast. Just something that happens.

Yeh, I have to laugh at the toast things also, How do we know it was a picture of Jesus when we don't even know what Jesus looked like ;)


If a stigmata, did happen in a scientific setting would it prove that there is a Jesus? Or maybe it would be the work of the devil, after all why would a loving God inflict pain?