If your religious belief makes your life pleasant or more meaningful than that’s great! But if it also makes someone else’s life more difficult then I say we ought to tear your church down, brick by brick and give your leaders a good, swift kick in the …….

:mad: :mad: :mad:

WELLLLLLLLL then!!!!

Originally posted by mad dog
WELLLLLLLLL then!!!!
How-dee do. You know, I'm new here and I had to think of something to write just to get myself on the score-board! :D :D :D

There are quite a few people who forget God is a God of love. All to often people get God and religion confused. Don't get me wrong you need religion to have God but there are a lot of religions out there that God doesn't want to be associated with, more then likely.
This in of itself keeps people from finding out what God is all about.
The bible says to find the church that is right for you. I suggest looking for one that makes you happy, because all God wants for you, is for you to be happy.

Originally posted by Catch 3
If your religious belief makes your life pleasant or more meaningful than that’s great! But if it also makes someone else’s life more difficult then I say we ought to tear your church down, brick by brick and give your leaders a good, swift kick in the …….

:mad: :mad: :mad:

Couldn't you have posted something a bit more thought out to get yourself on the score board?

Look at what you posted.

Religion brings some people joy and makes them feel good.

Religion makes some other people feel bad.

We should ignore the people who feel good and destroy that which makes them feel that way simply because other disagree with them.

By what reasoning are the rights of the faithless of more worth than those of the faithful?

I enjoy eating a steak every once in awhile. There are people in PETA who find eating steak distressful. Using your logic we should tear down all the steak houses.

I enjoy eating a steak every once in awhile. There are people in PETA who find eating steak distressful. Using your logic we should tear down all the steak houses.
YES! Tear down the....*cough*..nevermind.

I know tons of people that hate my religion and are trying to convert me back to "certain religions" because they are misinformed. They think that my religion is about hate, but its truly not.
Don't cut down religions, cut down ignorance!

Originally posted by Inviolable
There are quite a few people who forget God is a God of love. All to often people get God and religion confused. Don't get me wrong you need religion to have God but there are a lot of religions out there that God doesn't want to be associated with, more then likely.
The bible says to find the church that is right for you. I suggest looking for one that makes you happy, because all God wants for you, is for you to be happy. Don't get me wrong you need religion to have God


I don't quite understand this, why do you need religion to have god?
So according to this, only people with a religion can pray to God?
Pleas explain.

Catch 3, welcome to All Forums where the best ways to get on the scoreboard is to post with logic and intelligence.

Originally posted by MotherKali
YES! Tear down the....*cough*..nevermind.

I know tons of people that hate my religion and are trying to convert me back to "certain religions" because they are misinformed. They think that my religion is about hate, but its truly not.
Don't cut down religions, cut down ignorance!
I wouldn't have such a problem with your religion (and religions in general, really) if you didn't try to shove it down everyone's throats and have it taught in public schools in lieu of science.

MotherKali happens to be Wiccan, Borg. When was the last time you had a Wiccan trying to shove their religion down your throat?

Originally posted by Napsterbater
MotherKali happens to be Wiccan, Borg. When was the last time you had a Wiccan trying to shove their religion down your throat?
Yesterday. She informed me that she thinks all science classes should be taken out of public schools and replaced with "meditation" and other bullshit that hey, if it floats your boat, pursue it on your own, but I shouldn't have to put up with it.

Hmm, interesting. Does this happen often?

Originally posted by thetruth05
Don't get me wrong you need religion to have God


I don't quite understand this, why do you need religion to have god?
So according to this, only people with a religion can pray to God?
Pleas explain.

Catch 3, welcome to All Forums where the best ways to get on the scoreboard is to post with logic and intelligence.

Of course anyone can pray to God and you don't need religion to find God.
However to keep him and to get closer to him, to have him you need religion.
The only way to understand God better is through religion. The more you understand something the closer you are to it.
Finding and having are two different things. Just because you found something doesn't mean you have it.
Wanting what you found can and does lead to having. It's all in the way you go about having it.

Originally posted by Frogger
Couldn't you have posted something a bit more thought out to get yourself on the score board?

We should ignore the people who feel good and destroy that which makes them feel that way simply because other disagree with them.

I enjoy eating a steak every once in awhile. There are people in PETA who find eating steak distressful. Using your logic we should tear down all the steak houses.
You need to read my post again because you are making analogies that have nothing to do with it.

I’m not talking about “disagreements” and “eating steak” ……. Not unless your religion wants to force me into its’ belief or compel me into eating steak.

I think you’re trying too hard to find fault in what I wrote rather than trying to find the sense in it. Relax, open your mind, read it again, and see what it is about my post that makes your own personal religious belief a good one. But if you can’t, then give me a sledgehammer and the address of the church.

Originally posted by thetruth05
Catch 3, welcome to All Forums where the best ways to get on the scoreboard is to post [b]with logic and intelligence[b].
That's precisely what I've done ..... in additon to creating a discussion.

Originally posted by BorgHunter
I wouldn't have such a problem with your religion (and religions in general, really) if you didn't try to shove it down everyone's throats and have it taught in public schools in lieu of science.
Now there is a complaint worth making.
Originally posted by BorgHunter
.... if it floats your boat, pursue it on your own, but I shouldn't have to put up with it.
Exactly!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Inviolable
[B]Of course anyone can pray to God and you don't need religion to find God.
However to keep him and to get closer to him, to have him you need religion. (Quote)
==================

Dan: Religion appears to be a method of worship. What evidence leads you to believe god requires worship or a closeness to him/it?
---------------------------------

The only way to understand God better is through religion. The more you understand something the closer you are to it. (Quote)
===================

Dan: Of the hundreds of religions, how would one now that you are being given the proper information to understand? The religion you choose could be completely wrong.
-----------------------------------

Originally posted by Catch 3
How-dee do. You know, I'm new here and I had to think of something to write just to get myself on the score-board! :D :D :D

Welcome

Inviolable; I noticed you kept calling God a him, do you have his picture? I also would like to say you do not need a religion to keep a God, you need a belief.

EVERYONE especially BORG; Jesus loves you so;

this I know;

because TV religion tells me so :p

:bike: :hitout: :confused:

I just woke and I still need my daily dose of coffee so I may make a better reply at a later date.

I am going to answere Mad dog and Dan Fussel at the same time, or at least try to.

Religion, any religion requires faith. Thats a fact. Everyone understands that.
It's also a fact that to have faith there must first be an absence of facts.
However faith can be based on trueth and once you understand the trueth you know it as fact. Thats another fact. How can trueth not be fact?
I get all my trueth from the bible that God wrote with some help from Jesus. It tells me what religion is right and what religion is wrong. Theres lots of good trueth in the bible. Thats also a fact, anyone who reads it can see the trueth in it doesn't matter what you believe. The sad trueth is though, that you can read the bible as much as you want and not understand the trueth in it until you find God.
Even if I had a picture of God would you believe me? Doubt it. That would require faith and you don't seem to have any.

Yesterday. She informed me that she thinks all science classes should be taken out of public schools and replaced with "meditation" and other bullshit that hey, if it floats your boat, pursue it on your own, but I shouldn't have to put up with it.
Ok, first of all I never said "meditation" and if I did then show me because it shouldn't be phrased that way.
Second, I think most science is bullshit. Period.
Third, the reason why I said we shouldn't have science in early education is because it boxes people in and I think its important to know thyself before you have "facts" shoved down your throat so that you can make your own opinion.

Borg: you can bite me, i don't give a shit about your perception of me.

Everyone have a nice day and welcome to allforums Catch 3!

"MotherKali: Science should be taken out
MotherKali: and replaced with a meditation and self discovery class"

Originally posted by Inviolable
However faith can be based on trueth and once you understand the trueth you know it as fact. Thats another fact. How can trueth not be fact?
I get all my trueth from the bible that God wrote with some help from Jesus. It tells me what religion is right and what religion is wrong. Theres lots of good trueth in the bible. Thats also a fact, anyone who reads it can see the trueth in it doesn't matter what you believe. The sad trueth is though, that you can read the bible as much as you want and not understand the trueth in it until you find God.
"Truth"...

MotherKali: and replaced with a meditation and self discovery class"
Hmmm, ok so I may have said that, bad wording. And meditation is in no way connected to one religion. Its relaxing breathing, or at least can be.

Originally posted by BorgHunter
"MotherKali: Science should be taken out
MotherKali: and replaced with a meditation and self discovery class"


"Truth"...

Well, I did just wake up when I wrote it.
Aren't we all entitled to a typo here and there?

THANK YOU!...grammar nazi:rolleyes:

Originally posted by Inviolable
Aren't we all entitled to a typo here and there?
It's not a typo if you make the same mistake eight times in eight sentences.

Originally posted by Catch 3
If your religious belief makes your life pleasant or more meaningful than that’s great! But if it also makes someone else’s life more difficult then I say we ought to tear your church down, brick by brick and give your leaders a good, swift kick in the …….

:mad: :mad: :mad:


Catch 3, you said I misread your post. Let's parse it and see if I misread it or if you posted something you didn't really mean to come out as it did.

If your religious belief makes your life pleasant or more meaningful than that’s great!

Here you admit that religious belief can bring people joy and make their lives more meaningful.

it also makes someone else’s life more difficult

Here you talk about it, meaning religion, making other people's lives more difficult. You do not say, if you force it down their throats, if it causes you to be less tolerant, if you discriminate against people with other religions or no religion. There are people who feel their lives are made more difficult simply because other people are religious.

Your solution is to, tear your church down, brick by brick and give your leaders a good, swift kick in the …….

Please tell me who you are to tell me that since my religion does not please everyone and in fact might cause some people discomfort and even make their life somehow more difficult my churches should be torn down brick by brick and my ministers should be phsically accosted?

There is a name for what you are suggesting...........religious
intolerance.


Oh, yeah, and welcome. You sure did make a bit of a splash with your first post.



It is necessary to be religious to believe in God. It is not necessary to have a particular faith or practice a particular creed but it is necessary to be religious since religion is defined as a belief in a higher power.

You sure did make a bit of a splash with your first post.

You should have seen my first few threads.

Originally posted by BorgHunter
It's not a typo if you make the same mistake eight times in eight sentences.

It is if you are groggy and just dont care to see if you are typing true or truth.
Either way you may keep arguing it if you want to, I wont hold it against you.
We are all only human after all.

I just discovered myself an hour ago. Ill tell you one thing...it definatly shouldn't be done in school much less public.
:D

"Man will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest."
-Denis Diderot

Originally posted by Inviolable
It is if you are groggy and just dont care to see if you are typing true or truth.
Not really, but whatever, just admit your mistake (making excuses isn't really necessary) and move on...
Either way you may keep arguing it if you want to, I wont hold it against you.
We are all only human after all.
This sounds extremely condescending to my ears (eyes?).

How is that condescending? It seems like fact to me. Maybe you have issues with power...:slap:

500th POST!! w00t!

Originally posted by BorgHunter
Not really, but whatever, just admit your mistake (making excuses isn't really necessary) and move on...

This sounds extremely condescending to my ears (eyes?).

I suppose there has to be a few people who think they know exactly what other people may or may not be thinking when they make a mistake, like a typo.

You're not what is commonly known as a troll are you? Just for future reference so I know who to avoid or ignore.

Moderators tend not to be.

Originally posted by Inviolable
You're not what is commonly known as a troll are you? Just for future reference so I know who to avoid or ignore.
Um, wow. Yes, I'm a troll, that's why I have over 7000 posts and am one of the admins on this forum...

Thats good to know, normally admins try to keep order not disturb it. Thank you, from now on I will ignore you.

Originally posted by Frogger
There is a name for what you are suggesting ........... religious
intolerance.
It’s interesting that you use just that very phrase.

I can understand that you misinterpret my intro to this thread. No problem. But the crux of this thread is precisely that: INTOLERANCE.

EXAMPLE ONE: Catholicism says that it is only Christians who can enter the gates of heaven. It also says that once married in the Catholic church you may never be granted a divorce nor marry another, thus making your relationship to another man/woman adultery and a “burn in hell” offence. Until recently, a Catholic would also burn in hell for eating meat on a Friday. Apparently is was the Pope who made the revision!!!?? :eek: :eek: Those married in the Catholic Church must sign a document that makes you bound to christening all of your children Catholic. Not doing so will give you a one-way ticket to hell to burn for eternity. As far as I know, Jesus never said any of those things; DOWN WITH THE BRICKS!

EXAMPLE TWO: According to Islam, a Moslem may not criticize Islamic beliefs. If someone does so it is the duty of every Moslem in the world to murder him (or her). Solomon Rushdie’s situation is one example. A Moslem woman may not marry a non-Muslim man. If she does, it is the responsibility of male members of her family (her father, her uncle, her brother, etc.) to murder her, and there have been several cases in my country. However, as far as I know, Mohammad never said any of that; DOWN WITH THE BRICKS!

I wonder ….. is it intolerant of me to have no tolerance for such intolerance? Could be, but my conscience is clear.

Originally posted by Inviolable
Thats good to know, normally admins try to keep order not disturb it. Thank you, from now on I will ignore you.
Have fun with that.
As far as I know, Jesus never said any of those things; DOWN WITH THE BRICKS!
Why? Just because a religion is intolerant doesn't mean you have the right to demand it not exist.

Originally posted by Catch 3
It’s interesting that you use just that very phrase.

I can understand that you misinterpret my intro to this thread. No problem. But the crux of this thread is precisely that: INTOLERANCE.

EXAMPLE ONE: Catholicism says that it is only Christians who can enter the gates of heaven. It also says that once married in the Catholic church you may never be granted a divorce nor marry another, thus making your relationship to another man/woman adultery and a “burn in hell” offence. Until recently, a Catholic would also burn in hell for eating meat on a Friday. Apparently is was the Pope who made the revision!!!?? :eek: :eek: Those married in the Catholic Church must sign a document that makes you bound to christening all of your children Catholic. Not doing so will give you a one-way ticket to hell to burn for eternity. As far as I know, Jesus never said any of those things; DOWN WITH THE BRICKS!

EXAMPLE TWO: According to Islam, a Moslem may not criticize Islamic beliefs. If someone does so it is the duty of every Moslem in the world to murder him (or her). Solomon Rushdie’s situation is one example. A Moslem
woman may not marry a non-Muslim man. If she does, it is the responsibility of male members of her family (her father, her uncle, her brother, etc.) to murder her, and there have been several cases in my country. However, as
far as I know, Mohammad never said any of that; DOWN WITH THE BRICKS!

I wonder ….. is it intolerant of me to have no tolerance for such intolerance? Could be, but my conscience is clear.

Jesus did say you must be born again of water and the spirit (John 3:3) - Peter tells us what this means in Acts 2 & 1st Peter 1:23 and it's not by christening babies. Jesus also said,"He who is without sin may cast the first stone." He also said, "Moses wrote the bill of divorcement because of the hardness of the Jews heart."Mark 10:5
He also said, " Whosoever shall put away his wife, save for fornication,causes her to commit adultery; and whosoever shall marry her commits adultery." Matthew 5: 31-32 Read the Bible not the pamphlets! I'm not taking up for the Catholics - they have some things totally wrong, in the name of money.

Originally posted by Inviolable
I am going to answere Mad dog and Dan Fussel at the same time, or at least try to.

Religion, any religion requires faith. Thats a fact. Everyone understands that.
It's also a fact that to have faith there must first be an absence of facts.

What if God showed himself to the world and answered all questions would it still be okay for someone to have a different faith/God?

However faith can be based on trueth and once you understand the trueth you know it as fact. Thats another fact. How can trueth not be fact?

would this be truth or a personal feeling/believe, big difference.


I get all my trueth from the bible that God wrote with some help from Jesus.

I got some bad news for ya the Bible was written by humans, not God or Jesus.

It tells me what religion is right and what religion is wrong.

Now I'm going to hit you with one of your "facts", People wrote the bible so that means people have told you what is right or wrong. Fact #2 people make mistakes and are quite often wrong especially when it comes to religion.

Theres lots of good trueth in the bible. Thats also a fact, anyone who reads it can see the trueth in it doesn't matter what you believe. The sad trueth is though, that you can read the bible as much as you want and not understand the trueth in it until you find God.

I'm sure there was a boat built that could hold every animal{NOT}. I'm sure a man could be swallowed by a whale and live{NOT}. The Bible may have a message but it is far from total truth.


Even if I had a picture of God would you believe me?

I would definatly want to see it, and know how it was taken made etc...

That would require faith and you don't seem to have any.

Hmmmmmmmm, how nice of you to assume{you shouldn't because it make an a** out of u & me}. I am a learning Shaman Druid, with alot more spirituality then most other folks in a religion.

Oh, don't worry about the spell Nazi he gets all of us, he has a reason for this{power monger :D just kidding} We all make mistakes just go with the flow.

[i]Originally posted by mad dog

What if God showed himself to the world and answered all questions would it still be okay for someone to have a different faith/God?

It says in Revelations that people deny God even after he does so, doesn't make it right with God but it happens.

would this be truth or a personal feeling/believe, big difference.[/B][/QUOTE]

[i]Truth.


I got some bad news for ya the Bible was written by humans, not God or Jesus. [/B][/QUOTE]
[i]
Jesus was human and what happened in the bible happened to prove Gods point. So God wrote it.

Now I'm going to hit you with one of your "facts", People wrote the bible so that means people have told you what is right or wrong. Fact #2 people make mistakes and are quite often wrong especially when it comes to religion.[/B][/QUOTE]
[i]
Read the above.

I'm sure there was a boat built that could hold every animal{NOT}. I'm sure a man could be swallowed by a whale and live{NOT}. The Bible may have a message but it is far from total truth.
[i][/B][/QUOTE]
Watch the History channel or Discovery some time.


I would definatly want to see it, and know how it was taken made etc...[/B][/QUOTE]
[i]
Like I said, you lack faith.

Hmmmmmmmm, how nice of you to assume{you shouldn't because it make an a** out of u & me}. I am a learning Shaman Druid, with alot more spirituality then most other folks in a religion.[/B][/QUOTE]
[i]
Yes, Druid shaman, not born again christian.

Oh, don't worry about the spell Nazi he gets all of us, he has a reason for this{power monger :D just kidding} We all make mistakes just go with the flow. [/B][/QUOTE]

Couldn't figure out how to get the quote to work the way I wanted it to.

Originally posted by Inviolable
It says in Revelations that people deny God even after he does so, doesn't make it right with God but it happens.


so a book written by humans would not have a mistake? If Bush writes a book today about how great war is and it tells how he is speaking straight from God. It is found 1000 years later by a warmonger, the war monger says this is the word of God so it is truth, would it be? Did God tell anyone to go to war or kill, if so then who is suppose to live and who should die?


would this be truth or a personal feeling/believe, big difference.

[i]Truth.

I think most people would disagree, a faith/believe has no facts to make it truth. It may be the way you see things but that does not make it absolute truth. example I love spinach my truth is that it is the best food ever. You hate spinach the worst food ever. What or who is holding the truth???


Jesus was human and what happened in the bible happened to prove Gods point. So God wrote it

Nope Jesus was either the son of or God himself he may have played the part of human but he was never human if that is what one believes. Jesus did not write the Bible either, where did you here this? Also if God is all, then why would he even need a book written for humans? Even if it were for teaching then why couldn't the knower of all just pre-program all of us to know him/it in the 1st place? The bible was used for power it was a book written with some good points but its overall purpose was for power and gain.


Watch the History channel or Discovery some time.

Do all the time, have you? the stories on there are trying to find facts and learn what might have happened. There is more then one story about a boat saving things during a flood in a certain part of the world. BUT there is no facts showing the entire world being flooded at one time and a boat with every single type of animal aboard.

Like I said, you lack faith

LIKE I SAID YOU ARE VERY WRONG!!!


Yes, Druid shaman, not born again christian.

So does this mean your sh** don't stink :)? I'm confused here are you saying if someone doesn't believe in what you do then they don't have a faith? That is kind of simple minded, no? I believe there are many faiths out there and who am I to say one faith is wrong without solid proof. Christians may have something but from what I have seen{raised in a strick Catholic home, went to sunday school etc..} they have proven nothing more then anyone else. Don't underestimate the power of a church they need followers otherwise they fade away into the sunset.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Inviolable

I am going to answere Mad dog and Dan Fussel at the same time, or at least try to.

Religion, any religion requires faith. Thats a fact. Everyone understands that.
It's also a fact that to have faith there must first be an absence of facts.
However faith can be based on trueth and once you understand the trueth you know it as fact. Thats another fact. How can trueth not be fact?
I get all my trueth from the bible that God wrote with some help from Jesus. It tells me what religion is right and what religion is wrong. Theres lots of good trueth in the bible. Thats also a fact, anyone who reads it can see the trueth in it doesn't matter what you believe. The sad trueth is though, that you can read the bible as much as you want and not understand the trueth in it until you find God.
Even if I had a picture of God would you believe me? Doubt it. That would require faith and you don't seem to have any.(Quote)
====================================


You say faith is based upon truth.
All religions are based upon faith.
Therefore I must conclude that you believe all religions are true.

Yet, of hundreds of religions each faithful member seems to believe that only their religion is true.

Someone has to be wrong.

To base one's total opinion upon the writings in one book is blind faith.
I would suppose that some of the people that put their faith in the world being flat, also put their faith in the Bible as the only true religion.

How do you know that when you read the Bible you found god?
Is it true that you have faith you found god or is it true that you believe you found god.

We sit upon a speck of dust in a galaxie of thousands of suns and planets. We seen to have the audacity to think that we, as individuals, are so important to some mythical supreme being.
One day our sun will nova, the earth will burn to a cinder, the universe will continue without us. Unless of course, we travel to the stars and meet millions of other civilizations with millions of religions. Each believing his/hers is the only truth.

Originally posted by mad dog
so a book written by humans would not have a mistake? If Bush writes a book today about how great war is and it tells how he is speaking straight from God. It is found 1000 years later by a warmonger, the war monger says this is the word of God so it is truth, would it be? Did God tell anyone to go to war or kill, if so then who is suppose to live and who should die?




I think most people would disagree, a faith/believe has no facts to make it truth. It may be the way you see things but that does not make it absolute truth. example I love spinach my truth is that it is the best food ever. You hate spinach the worst food ever. What or who is holding the truth???



Nope Jesus was either the son of or God himself he may have played the part of human but he was never human if that is what one believes. Jesus did not write the Bible either, where did you here this? Also if God is all, then why would he even need a book written for humans? Even if it were for teaching then why couldn't the knower of all just pre-program all of us to know him/it in the 1st place? The bible was used for power it was a book written with some good points but its overall purpose was for power and gain.




Do all the time, have you? the stories on there are trying to find facts and learn what might have happened. There is more then one story about a boat saving things during a flood in a certain part of the world. BUT there is no facts showing the entire world being flooded at one time and a boat with every single type of animal aboard.



LIKE I SAID YOU ARE VERY WRONG!!!




So does this mean your sh** don't stink :)? I'm confused here are you saying if someone doesn't believe in what you do then they don't have a faith? That is kind of simple minded, no? I believe there are many faiths out there and who am I to say one faith is wrong without solid proof. Christians may have something but from what I have seen{raised in a strick Catholic home, went to sunday school etc..} they have proven nothing more then anyone else. Don't underestimate the power of a church they need followers otherwise they fade away into the sunset.

There are 2 really big differences between you and me.

One you are a druid who claims to understand faith.
Two you are trying to tear down my beliefes where in I have said nothing to undermine druids through out this whole conversation.

Anyone with a religion and a strong faith understands that another persons religion should not be mocked as you so blatantly have done thus far to mine.

I could have said I know Landscapers who can do the same as a druid any day. They build big stone walls to.
Or
I could have asked you if you are a Shaman in Ever Quest or World of Warcraft?

I didn't because I respect what you believe, please try to return the same respect to me.

Spinach can be hated or loved by anyone that is the truth and fact.
That is what I am trying to say.
If you love spinach and it is true then it is a fact that you love spinach. If I hate spinach and it is true then that makes it fact. If you understand the truth in the bible and through understanding you see the fact in the truth then it becomes fact.
Jesus was in fact a man, the son of God and God. The father, the son and the holy ghost are one in the same.
Noah, lived roughly 6 to 8 thousand years ago. The whole of the world to them back then was in one spot and not all over the entire planet.
So to Noah the whole world was covered in water and he had enough room for 2 of every animal.
It has been theorized that all breeds of dog came from one breed to start, same with horses. How would it be that far fetched that Noah made a arc big enough for what was living near and around the civilized world 6 to 8 thousand years ago?
You may have all the faith in the world for druids but for christian faith you have none what so ever. You yourself have proved that on more then one post in this thread.
So for me to simply show you a picture of God would be like you showing me a pin up of mother nature.

Originally posted by Dan Fussell
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Inviolable

I am going to answere Mad dog and Dan Fussel at the same time, or at least try to.

Religion, any religion requires faith. Thats a fact. Everyone understands that.
It's also a fact that to have faith there must first be an absence of facts.
However faith can be based on trueth and once you understand the trueth you know it as fact. Thats another fact. How can trueth not be fact?
I get all my trueth from the bible that God wrote with some help from Jesus. It tells me what religion is right and what religion is wrong. Theres lots of good trueth in the bible. Thats also a fact, anyone who reads it can see the trueth in it doesn't matter what you believe. The sad trueth is though, that you can read the bible as much as you want and not understand the trueth in it until you find God.
Even if I had a picture of God would you believe me? Doubt it. That would require faith and you don't seem to have any.(Quote)
====================================


You say faith is based upon truth.
All religions are based upon faith.
Therefore I must conclude that you believe all religions are true.

Yet, of hundreds of religions each faithful member seems to believe that only their religion is true.

Someone has to be wrong.

To base one's total opinion upon the writings in one book is blind faith.
I would suppose that some of the people that put their faith in the world being flat, also put their faith in the Bible as the only true religion.

How do you know that when you read the Bible you found god?
Is it true that you have faith you found god or is it true that you believe you found god.

We sit upon a speck of dust in a galaxie of thousands of suns and planets. We seen to have the audacity to think that we, as individuals, are so important to some mythical supreme being.
One day our sun will nova, the earth will burn to a cinder, the universe will continue without us. Unless of course, we travel to the stars and meet millions of other civilizations with millions of religions. Each believing his/hers is the only truth.

All religions have some truth to them. That is common knowledge.
Almost all religions use the same basic standards and morals as well.
Be kind to one another, don't steal, don't kill, so on.
You can agree or disagree with any of them. Im not trying to stop you. I am only trying to tell you what I believe and why I believe it because you asked.
What I said before is this.
I found God and then looked for a way to keep him in my life. Now I have him.
Understanding something as much as possible isnt the defenition of being blind to it. Blind faith is popularly known as jumping head long into something with out thinking about it first.
In order to understand something you need to think about it.
You understand that "We sit upon a speck of dust in a galaxie of thousands of suns and planets." Is this blind faith or did you think about? Does understanding it make it true? Is it fact because you understand it?
You can say it's fact because it's there.
But you understand its there and that makes it the truth, it makes it fact.
That is how I feel about God. I understand what the bible says and the facts of my understanding have givin me more faith.

Originally posted by Inviolable
That is how I feel about God. I understand what the bible says and the facts of my understanding have givin me more faith.
I'm not sure I quite believe that understanding leads to faith. I understand the Bible perfectly, and I think it's a nice story, but not much more. I understand what it says, I just reject various premises that it makes.

Originally posted by BorgHunter
I'm not sure I quite believe that understanding leads to faith. I understand the Bible perfectly, and I think it's a nice story, but not much more. I understand what it says, I just reject various premises that it makes.

Not to nit pick but nothing man does is perfect. People have different opinions about every book they read and even though one person may understand something, someone else may be able to explain it better to them. Doesn't matter if its the bible or not.

For all you non-believers, God has already manifested Himself in the flesh,
read John 1:1-14. I'm sorry you don't believe it and I think you may be too,
John 3.

Originally posted by newdsagent3
For all you non-believers, God has already manifested Himself in the flesh,
read John 1:1-14. I'm sorry you don't believe it and I think you may be too,
John 3.

I been wanting to say this sinse I seen your name.

Hold the milk put back the sugar, there are powers to concern.

Originally posted by Inviolable
I been wanting to say this sinse I seen your name.

Hold the milk put back the sugar, there are powers to concern.

What does this mean?!:confused:

Theres a group called News Day and that is a sentence from one of their songs.

Originally posted by BorgHunter
Just because a religion is intolerant doesn't mean you have the right to demand it not exist.
Where did I "demand that religion not exist"?

In any case, what makes you think my "right" is any less than theirs'? Don't you think that's a contradictory double-standard in itself?

Their right to intolerance demands that non-Christian/non-Islamic citizens not exist on socially equal terms so I hope that a copy of the criticism you sent to me was sent to them as well.

Originally posted by newdsagent3 I'm not taking up for the Catholics - they have some things totally wrong, in the name of money.
DOWN WITH THE BRICKS.

Originally posted by Catch 3
In any case, what makes you think my "right" is any less than theirs'? Don't you think that's a contradictory double-standard in itself?
I never said it was. But you're just as free to practice whatever religion you want as they are.
Their right to intolerance demands that non-Christian/non-Islamic citizens not exist on socially equal terms so I hope that a copy of the criticism you sent to me was sent to them as well.
I don't see how that's relevant. We're not discussing other people; we're discussing you and your views.

Originally posted by Inviolable
There are 2 really big differences between you and me.

One you are a druid who claims to understand faith.

I understand how I feel just has you may understand how you feel. Did you not say "I lack faith"? reread what you have written. I've also got some news that you may find interesting Druids can be Christian infact there is a Druid bishop in office right now. Like I also told you many of the 1st Christian monks were Druids. This is what they believe{not truth, but belief}, but if they did find out that Christianity was false they would have no problem walking away.


Two you are trying to tear down my beliefes where in I have said nothing to undermine druids through out this whole conversation.

Bull hockey, I have been debating and asking for solid proof. You tell me the Bible is proof but yet I fail to see it. You also said I am a Druid not a Born again, I took it that was/is a bad thing I asked about this?

Anyone with a religion and a strong faith understands that another persons religion should not be mocked as you so blatantly have done thus far to mine.

Come on now either you want to debate or you want to be a day time soap show drama queen. I have not mocked your religion I have asked for proof which so far you have showed none, but you say you have the absolute truth? Anyone one can preach but it's funny how upset preachers get when they are asked for any type of evidence.

I could have asked you if you are a Shaman in Ever Quest or World of Warcraft?

Fair enough, I don't play games, I'm assuming that is what these are? I am trying to get back to nature as much as possible{shaman} I believe nature has what humans need. I don't believe in materialistic garbage. This doesn't mean I don't own certain things I am modern but I don't need a heated seat in my car.

I didn't because I respect what you believe, please try to return the same respect to me.

I respected you enough to feel that maybe you had an answer instead of just a preaching maybe I'm wrong. If you are taking my questions as insults maybe your faith isn't as strong as you think it is? Tell me that druids are hippys that go around hugging trees for all I care. I will still try to answer your question, instead of playing drama queen. The reason this is, is because I have a strong belief and will try to back it up. I am also not throwing myself to the wolves and claiming to know a God that I have never seen or met. I find it funny how so many people know everything about God, but when asked to show some sort of evidence they get upset.

Spinach can be hated or loved by anyone that is the truth and fact.
That is what I am trying to say.
If you love spinach and it is true then it is a fact that you love spinach. If I hate spinach and it is true then that makes it fact. If you understand the truth in the bible and through understanding you see the fact in the truth then it becomes fact.

False it becomes a belief for you it has nothing to do with truth or fact it is only a belief. If it were a fact then it could be proved to everyone which in turn would make it turth.


Jesus was in fact a man, the son of God and God. The father, the son and the holy ghost are one in the same.

A father can not be a mother even with surgery he is still the same thing he was from the start. An apple is an apple even if we color it and call it an orange. IF God was Jesus the son of and played the roll of human that is fine but the fact remains he is 1st and allways was GOD!!!


Noah, lived roughly 6 to 8 thousand years ago. The whole of the world to them back then was in one spot and not all over the entire planet.
So to Noah the whole world was covered in water and he had enough room for 2 of every animal.

So do you agree that the Bible may have a message but not total truth? I agree that there may have been a flood in a part of the flat{;)} world, but it was not the entire world. Is this what you are saying?


It has been theorized that all breeds of dog came from one breed to start, same with horses. How would it be that far fetched that Noah made a arc big enough for what was living near and around the civilized world 6 to 8 thousand years ago?

Do you have a clue how many animals would have existed back then? Don't try to narrow it down to just a dog or horse that could have evolved into many other types. Lets also not forget food fresh water disease etc........


You may have all the faith in the world for druids but for christian faith you have none what so ever. You yourself have proved that on more then one post in this thread.

I didn't have to prove it through many post I came out and said it point blank. This does not mean you are wrong it just means that my life requires more then some person preaching at me. I quess the difference between us is that you'll just go with the flow where I want to understand why. I have asked many, including preachers, who was Jesus show the proof that he even lived, so far NO ONE has done this. We can find a lost tribe of 3' tall people but we can't find anything about Jesus{God or the son of}.


So for me to simply show you a picture of God would be like you showing me a pin up of mother nature.

You want to see mother nature, okay, take a trip up into the mountains sit next to a stream and just look listen smell touch and taste. There I gave you proof now can I see the picture of God? I can see God every where because I have not put IT into a shoe box and made it mans idea, you have, this is why I am asking for proof of a man called God?

Originally posted by Inviolable
There are quite a few people who forget God is a God of love. All to often people get God and religion confused. Don't get me wrong you need religion to have God but there are a lot of religions out there that God doesn't want to be associated with, more then likely.
This in of itself keeps people from finding out what God is all about.
The bible says to find the church that is right for you. I suggest looking for one that makes you happy, because all God wants for you, is for you to be happy.

Inviolable;
I think this is the post that started everything, you speak of God like you are the one that understand him and knows everything about him{why does it have to be a HIM?} You also did put down others religious beliefs, as soon as you said "the bible says to find a church that is right for you". There are many here that don't believe in the bible but according to what you printed the only real religion is the one that comes from the Bible.

Originally posted by newdsagent3
For all you non-believers, God has already manifested Himself in the flesh,
read John 1:1-14. I'm sorry you don't believe it and I think you may be too,
John 3.

Lets go back even furthure in time and see what the Greeks or the Eygptions had to say/write. Must be their religion is more true after all they were 1st? Show proof not what some human had to write in a book, please?

Originally posted by mad dog
Lets go back even furthure in time and see what the Greeks or the Eygptions had to say/write. Must be their religion is more true after all they were 1st? Show proof not what some human had to write in a book, please?

Oh stuff it Mad Dog!!! Believe what you want - I'm not arguing.:cat:

There we have it from another preacher without proof, believe what I say or go to hell. Or in this case just plain stuff it, bwhahahahahahahahaha :D thank you for the intelligent debate, you really got me thinking :D

Originally posted by BorgHunter
We're not discussing other people; we're discussing you and your views.
Oh. I see. You want a clean, simple, personal, and non-diplomatic answer. All right. I’ll reply to your statement again.

Originally posted by BorgHunter Just because a religion is intolerant doesn't mean you have the right to demand it not exist.

I think that my right (as a citizen of a more civilized world) to demand that the encouragement of violence, the teachings of intolerance and the righteousness of murder not exist is much more worthy than those entities that want it to continue.

Originally posted by mad dog
you really got me thinking :D

:D :D :D

Originally posted by Catch 3
I think that my right (as a citizen of a more civilized world) to demand that the encouragement of violence, the teachings of intolerance and the righteousness of murder not exist is much more worthy than those entities that want it to continue.
I think their right to freedom of speech precludes your "right" to be tolerated.

Originally posted by BorgHunter
I never said it was. But you're just as free to practice whatever religion you want as they are.

I don't see how that's relevant. We're not discussing other people; we're discussing you and your views.

OK I would like to take a vote here and see who thinks who has been answereing questions and who has been trying to push what they believe down peoples throats. Who has been the drama queen born and raised in Catholic schools and who has been trying to explain over and over again what they have been trying to say.

If you have been reading this thread please take a vote.

All I have been trying to say through out this whole thread, that you have desperately missed the entire time, is that it is up to the individual to find God and then up to that same individual to understand him better. I explained it how it happened to me several times.
How did you become a druid?
What proof do you have that being a druid is the right thing?
Is ignornace bliss? I only ask that question because you miss the point time after time.
God is in fact real to me becasue I have seen him in my life. What I was saying
in its simple form and hopefully you understand it this time is that.
You got trees and nature I got God.
Only I explained exactly why I have God, can you explain the reason why exactly you got trees? What did you do to get close to the trees? How in your life did a tree reach out to you and let you know trees were the way?
How in your life did you get closer to trees?
Do you sit in the forest or woods and chat with them?
I pray to God all the time.
Do the trees inrich your life with wisdom?
Do the trees give you faith?
How do the trees give you faith?
I answered these questions to you about God, not once did I say to anyone they must listen to me or repent, that what I beleive is right for them.
All I did was explain what happened to me. Thats how a conversation works.
If I was preaching I might have said you were wrong and I was right.
Kinda like what you are doing.

I quoted the wrong post. I apologize.
I was trying to quote Mad Dogs last reply to a post I made and hit the wrong button.

My vote is that Inviolable is being a drama queen just by asking for this vote.

Originally posted by mad dog
Inviolable;
I think this is the post that started everything, you speak of God like you are the one that understand him and knows everything about him{why does it have to be a HIM?} You also did put down others religious beliefs, as soon as you said "the bible says to find a church that is right for you". There are many here that don't believe in the bible but according to what you printed the only real religion is the one that comes from the Bible.

First off I do understand God. Just like you understand trees. Second I did say "I suggest" because I do understand God and where I got that understanding from is the bible. So I used it as reference.
Where do you get your reference?
I read another thread where in you said it all came from word of mouth.
Do the trees tell you?
Third, I did say to find what is right for you. Not, find what is right for me.
According to you trees are all knowing and there are no exceptions.

As a staunch grammar Nazi myself I have to go with Borg hunter.

Besides, Inviolate, you only have a handful of posts here. I'm not sure it's a good idea to challenge a regular to a vote of support.

Oh, and welcome to all forums!

Thanks Blob =) ... Good to be here. hehe.

You're welcome.

Oops, got your name wrong. Inviolable. (Better correct myself before some bloody spelling fascist points it out for me. ;) )

Originally posted by Blob
You're welcome.

Oops, got your name wrong. Inviolable. (Better correct myself before some bloody spelling fascist points it out for me. ;) )

Well its my name and I dont care how you spell it. Just don't call me Bill.

I'm gonna go with Inviolable. Oddly... :)

Borg is being, as he always is, too strict and he is above all being a drama queen. Get over yourself!

Originally posted by mad dog
I understand how I feel just has you may understand how you feel. Did you not say "I lack faith"? reread what you have written. I've also got some news that you may find interesting Druids can be Christian infact there is a Druid bishop in office right now. Like I also told you many of the 1st Christian monks were Druids. This is what they believe{not truth, but belief}, but if they did find out that Christianity was false they would have no problem walking away.




Bull hockey, I have been debating and asking for solid proof. You tell me the Bible is proof but yet I fail to see it. You also said I am a Druid not a Born again, I took it that was/is a bad thing I asked about this?



Come on now either you want to debate or you want to be a day time soap show drama queen. I have not mocked your religion I have asked for proof which so far you have showed none, but you say you have the absolute truth? Anyone one can preach but it's funny how upset preachers get when they are asked for any type of evidence.



Fair enough, I don't play games, I'm assuming that is what these are? I am trying to get back to nature as much as possible{shaman} I believe nature has what humans need. I don't believe in materialistic garbage. This doesn't mean I don't own certain things I am modern but I don't need a heated seat in my car.



I respected you enough to feel that maybe you had an answer instead of just a preaching maybe I'm wrong. If you are taking my questions as insults maybe your faith isn't as strong as you think it is? Tell me that druids are hippys that go around hugging trees for all I care. I will still try to answer your question, instead of playing drama queen. The reason this is, is because I have a strong belief and will try to back it up. I am also not throwing myself to the wolves and claiming to know a God that I have never seen or met. I find it funny how so many people know everything about God, but when asked to show some sort of evidence they get upset.



False it becomes a belief for you it has nothing to do with truth or fact it is only a belief. If it were a fact then it could be proved to everyone which in turn would make it turth.




A father can not be a mother even with surgery he is still the same thing he was from the start. An apple is an apple even if we color it and call it an orange. IF God was Jesus the son of and played the roll of human that is fine but the fact remains he is 1st and allways was GOD!!!




So do you agree that the Bible may have a message but not total truth? I agree that there may have been a flood in a part of the flat{;)} world, but it was not the entire world. Is this what you are saying?




Do you have a clue how many animals would have existed back then? Don't try to narrow it down to just a dog or horse that could have evolved into many other types. Lets also not forget food fresh water disease etc........




I didn't have to prove it through many post I came out and said it point blank. This does not mean you are wrong it just means that my life requires more then some person preaching at me. I quess the difference between us is that you'll just go with the flow where I want to understand why. I have asked many, including preachers, who was Jesus show the proof that he even lived, so far NO ONE has done this. We can find a lost tribe of 3' tall people but we can't find anything about Jesus{God or the son of}.




You want to see mother nature, okay, take a trip up into the mountains sit next to a stream and just look listen smell touch and taste. There I gave you proof now can I see the picture of God? I can see God every where because I have not put IT into a shoe box and made it mans idea, you have, this is why I am asking for proof of a man called God?

OK I would like to take a vote here and see who thinks who has been answereing questions and who has been trying to push what they believe down peoples throats. Who has been the drama queen born and raised in Catholic schools and who has been trying to explain over and over again what they have been trying to say.

If you have been reading this thread please take a vote.

All I have been trying to say through out this whole thread, that you have desperately missed the entire time, is that it is up to the individual to find God and then up to that same individual to understand him better. I explained it how it happened to me several times.
How did you become a druid?
What proof do you have that being a druid is the right thing?
Is ignornace bliss? I only ask that question because you miss the point time after time.
God is in fact real to me becasue I have seen him in my life. What I was saying
in its simple form and hopefully you understand it this time is that.
You got trees and nature I got God.
Only I explained exactly why I have God, can you explain the reason why exactly you got trees? What did you do to get close to the trees? How in your life did a tree reach out to you and let you know trees were the way?
How in your life did you get closer to trees?
Do you sit in the forest or woods and chat with them?
I pray to God all the time.
Do the trees inrich your life with wisdom?
Do the trees give you faith?
How do the trees give you faith?
I answered these questions to you about God, not once did I say to anyone they must listen to me or repent, that what I beleive is right for them.
All I did was explain what happened to me. Thats how a conversation works.
If I was preaching I might have said you were wrong and I was right.
Kinda like what you are doing.

This is the correct quote and reply to the above Borg quote that was meant for Mad Dog.

Also, if you are trying to say that even though you like spinach but you cant prove it, then you are correct. However what I was saying is even though you can not prove you like spinach that doesn't mean it isnt fact to you.

I really need to have my coffe before I read these threads.

Originally posted by BorgHunter
I think their right to freedom of speech precludes your "right" to be tolerated.
"Freedom of speech"? Who the fuck is talking about "speech"? :@@: :@@: :@@:

Inviolable I'll vote for you just because it must mean so much to you. I also withdraw from your political run so there now you are the 100% winner. Go have a cookie and com down before you pee your pants :D Also would you mind if I answer your post like I have been or are we just going to keep wasting time with who or what is more popular. Sorry but I am not in high school anymore and I never did really give to craps about being the Valley Girl{or boy}. I have been trying to have a deabte with you, when people debate there is often disagreement if you can't handle it just let me know and I'll drop any more post towards you.

Originally posted by Inviolable
There are quite a few people who forget God is a God of love. All to often people get God and religion confused. This in of itself keeps people from finding out what God is all about.
The bible says to find the church that is right for you.

Originally posted by Inviolable
I am going to answere Mad dog and Dan Fussel at the same time, or at least try to.


I get all my trueth from the bible that God wrote with some help from Jesus. It tells me what religion is right and what religion is wrong.

Theres lots of good trueth in the bible. Thats also a fact, anyone who reads it can see the trueth in it doesn't matter what you believe. The sad trueth is though, that you can read the bible as much as you want and not understand the trueth in it until you find God.

Doubt it. That would require faith and you don't seem to have any.

liked the last line

Originally posted by Inviolable
It says in Revelations that people deny God even after he does so, doesn't make it right with God but it happens.


Jesus was human and what happened in the bible happened to prove Gods point. So God wrote it.

Like I said, you lack Yes, Druid shaman, not born again christian

Originally posted by Inviolable
If you understand the truth in the bible and through understanding you see the fact in the truth then it becomes fact.
Jesus was in fact a man, the son of God and God. The father, the son and the holy ghost are one in the same.

written by Newdsagent;

For all you non-believers, God has allready manifested himself in the flesh, read john 1:1-14 I'm sorry you don't believe it and I think you may be too, john 3


Originally posted by Inviolable
I been wanting to say this sinse I seen your name.

Hold the milk put back the sugar, there are powers to concern.

There a few post that you wrote this way you can't say I did it. If you want to twist things then atleast try not to twist what you wrote, looks silly don't ya think?

I don't quite get what you are saying I am doing. I think you are saying, that because I am explaining myself that I am asking for a debate. Either way it looks as if you really want to debate. Are you sure you know how a debate works? I only ask because you have only answered one of my questions about your religion so far.
Where in I have I have answered several of your questions.
So sinse it is what you want let us debate.
Whos religion is better? Or Whos religion has more facts? What is the point of your debate? That mine is wrong and yours is right? Please make it clear to me so we have something to debate.

This is only a debate and I apologize if I say something that may seem insulting to anyone who may or may not think differently then I do. I beleive in order to have a proper debate we ust first explain to each other what our respective religions are, or at the least what we believe.
I do not believe the same way Catholics do. I do not wish to offend any Catholics, this is strictly what I believe and does not mean I think any less of you for thinking you are a Catholic. I point this out because you have used the Catholic beliefe system as a point of reference to make your point clear to me that you understand my religion more then I think you may.

Here is what I believe.

It is not my job to bring you to God. God has only said that it is my job to explain to you what he has done for me. Each of us have free will and an understanding to find something to fill any emptyness in our lives with whatever we find fulfilling.
That means that God is looking for each of us and my job as a christian is just to inform you that he is looking, not direct you to him.
That is one way I believe how the Holy Ghost works.
I also believe that once God finds you the only way to him is through Jesus.
To be in the presence of God we must be free of sin. This does not mean that I commit no sin, this means that Jesus forgives me of my sin and makes me sin free.
That is how I believe Jesus works.
I also believe that God is the creator of everything. God created the heavens and the earth and everything on it so this makes him the father. God made us all the same, we are all people and no one should be thought less of or greater then anyone else. Everyone should be treated with the same respect.
The respect does include what other people believe or want to believe. Once I've told you that I am saved and why I believe I am saved my job is done.

Now that I have explained my belief please explain your beliefs to me. This will help in our debate.
I will start the debate by arguing a point I have seen you make several times on these boards.

You say that word of mouth is more accurate then the writin word. If that isn't what you say then I apologize, however I have heard you state more then once that the bible is false because it is a book.
Several philosophers and scientist along with a few rulers believe or have believed, that the writin word is more then likely mans greatest achievement.
Are you to tell me that they are wrong and you are right?
Are you also to tell me that word of mouth can not be misleading?
What do you do if you have questions?
Do you ask the person who told you?
What if that person doesn't have the answeres you are looking for?
Do you go to the person they got their answeres from?
Eventually someone had to die so your info is lost in that person, is it not?
What if the person who died didn't tell the next person everything they were suppose to?
How do you know for sure what you know about your beliefes are fact?

I'll vote with Invioable.

Originally posted by mad dog
written by Newdsagent;

For all you non-believers, God has allready manifested himself in the flesh, read john 1:1-14
I suppose I'll have to consider myself a "non-believer" by default, as you haven't really included anything that describes my convictions in metaphysical affairs. So I'm very curious to know what it is in what you've written above that would make me any more "a bleiever" than I was before I read your post?

If you read John 1:1 -14 and you don't believe it then you ARE a non-believer.
I won't convince you in your meta-physical world. "The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much." So it's up to you to know Him and the answers to your questions. David said in Psalms. "Taste and see that the Lord is good." Now why would he say that if it weren't true? Just because you don't know doesn't mean those of us who do know, are wrong. I think you're just repeating and not looking. You're probably satisfied with your meta-physical world and don't feel the need to look any further but the word of God will renew your mind!

Originally posted by newdsagent3
If you read John 1:1 -14 and you don't believe it then you ARE a non-believer. I read it and didn't believe it. What a miserable universe that the meaning of life boils down to what one makes of those 14 sentences.

the word of God will renew your mind!

Do I get a money-back guarantee?

Originally posted by Napsterbater
Do I get a money-back guarantee?
:thumbs: :thumbs: :thumbs: :D

I miss-spelled Written and spelled it Writin. I was going to ask the spell Nazi's about that when I replied to whatever mad dog said, but he hasnt replied yet.

Inviolable
I miss-spelled Written and spelled it Writin. I was going to ask the spell Nazi's about that when I replied to whatever mad dog said, but he hasnt replied yet.

Don't you mean...

I misspelled Written and spelled it Writin. I was going to ask the spelling Nazis about that when I replied to whatever mad dog said, but he hasn't replied yet.

:D

Shouldn't "Written" and "Writin" be in quotes? :)

Fuck, yeah. Thanks Napsterbater.

I misspelled "Written" and spelled it "Writin". I was going to ask the spelling Nazis about that when I replied to whatever mad dog said, but he hasn't replied yet.


Also, I notice the original occurance of "writin" was without a capital letter. Thoughts?

Yes I think I did mean misspelled?
I remember now its nazis and axis is just axis? But alliance is just alliance, right?

Well, if the original occurance of "writin" wasn't capitalised, than neither of the quoted parts should be either. There is no reason to capitalise it, seeing as it isn't a proper noun or the start of a sentence.

And it's "Nazis", "Axis", and the "Allies", or "Allied Forces". They are proper nouns

So it's only "Alliance" when the "Allied forces" are "Allied'? Like with the Russians and everything? Like the "Nazis" were "Axis" only when they were with Italy, right?

I believe the term refers to Britain, France, and the United States. I think Russia was considered on its own, as it really didn't coordinate much with the rest of the West. I could be wrong though...

For the most part you're right. However Russia was the first to Berlin. Stalin really wanted to declare ownership and getting there first was his way of peeing on that tree. He was stopped from completely taking over the whole of Germany by the alliance he made with the "Allied forces".

That's the spirit! Welcome to the wonderful world of grammar pedantry, Inviolable! ;)

For the most part you're right.

If you already knew, then why did you ask?

I needed some phonics.

Originally posted by Inviolable
So it's only "Alliance" when the "Allied forces" are "Allied'? Like with the Russians and everything? Like the "Nazis" were "Axis" only when they were with Italy, right?
I suppose that "allies" sounds more like a bunch of nice guys pulling together to defeat the nasties, whereas "axis" sounds like evil itself!

You've certainly noted that Saddam Hussein, Ossama bin Laden, and Ayatollah Khomeini are collectively an "axis of evil". It wouldn't do to call them "evil allies", would it? It sounds like such a contradiction :D :D :D

Originally posted by Catch 3
You've certainly noted that Saddam Hussein, Ossama bin Laden, and Ayatollah Khomeini are collectively an "axis of evil". Hey, don't leave out glorious atheist comrade Kim Jung Il.

Originally posted by Napsterbater
I think Russia was considered on its own, as it really didn't coordinate much with the rest of the West. I could be wrong though...

The Russians co-ordinated plenty. Russia fought nearly single-handedly while Britain (with newly arrived American troops) geared up for the second front. There was much discussion between Roosevelt, Churchill, and Stalin on how Russians soldiers could tie up as many Germans as possible in the east so that gaining a bridgehead in Normandy would claim less casualties for the American, British, French, Polish, Czech, Dutch, Belgian, etc. landing. It was well calculated but the Russians got the short end of the stick, losing millions of men as the bulk of German forces were thrown at Soviet troops. It was assumed that time wasn’t optimal for an invasion in the west so Hitler had “everything” he had trying to hold the Russians back.

Russia was first to Berlin for two, main reasons: They had less of a distance to cover and they had the Germans on the run.

As far as dividing up the whole of Germany goes, the allies (U.S. – Britain – France – Russia - and remnants of free-fighting Dutch and Belgian troops) stayed put where they found themselves when the war was over. Doling out Berlin city between Russian, American, French, and British sectors was a friendly gesture by Stalin himself. Berlin was rightly Russian booty and Stalin wasn’t obliged to give over sections of the city to the other allies but he was in a generous mood. He was soon to regret it.

I lived in West Berlin during the Cold War, by the way.

Originally posted by Blob
Hey, don't leave out glorious atheist comrade Kim Jung Il.
Oh! Sorry! How could I forget? :)