I think it is time we discuss this under history not news or politics where it gets me a little mad.


Beirut (http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/AMH/XX/MidEast/Lebanon-1982-1984/USMC-Lebanon82/USMC-Lebanon82-6.html)

I will add to this with personal events later.

Ok this is going to be a little tough for me but I need to do this.

I arrived in Beirut onboard the USS Portland LSD-37 as a part of MARG 2-83. When we arrived just prior to sunrise all appeared quiet and would remain that way until we began to offload the Marines we had carried to this sandy hell.

I am only going to discuss a few events in minor detail, thigs that you cant read or get all the info in history books.

We came under occasional fire, mostly stray or harrassment. I manned a picket boat which was to protect the Portland when anchored. We were armed and had very different orders than the Marines, if fired upon we were to return fire without hesitation. The Marines werent allowed to have their weapons loaded.

On October 23rd I was sent into recover bodies after the bombing destroyed BLT HQ. During those 5 days we were fired upon but we never stopped our efforts to recover our fallen brothers. Things were found that I can not speak of yet, things still classified or maybe a little bad for national security.

All of the Beirut survivors who set foot on that sand live with the memories of their time under fire etched in their minds forever.

Please as with all of American history, take the time to study it before you condemn America. The country or the flag have never made a mistake, only those we elect have. We must all learn history or we will be doomed to repeat it.

I know you have all heard that and it made some of you groan, but it is true. The mistakes made today are because we do not know our own history.

In closing I want to ask all of you who despise what this country stands for to remember why we went to Beirut. We were there to stop the Israeli slaughter of an enemy, not for oil, not to overthrow an Islamic Nation but to save the lives of the PLO. IN doing so we lost 273 Servicemen Between August 82 and February 84.
We are not all bad, nor is every conflict on foreign soil to perserve a democratic way of life, sometimes we just put ourselves in harms way to protect the helpless.

Originally posted by Beirut_Veteran
In closing I want to ask all of you who despise what this country stands for to remember why we went to Beirut. We were there to stop the Israeli slaughter of an enemy, not for oil, not to over through a Islamic Nation but to save the lives of the PLO. IN doing so we lost 273 Servicemen Between August 82 and February 84.
We are not all bad, nor is every conflict on foreign soil to perserve a democratic way of life, sometimes we just put ourselves in harms way to protect the helpless.
========================================

Some people seem to believe Israel is right no matter what they do.

Beirut Vet

Rest assured that at least some of us honor your service and thank you for it.

Beirut_Veteran, know that there are many of us who know that the mistakes of our leaders do not tarnish the sacrifices and heroism of those who carry out the plans.

I have a question, Vet.

When you first went in, why weren't the Marines allowed to have their weapons loaded?

First of all Dan you are right, Israel knew about the attack but never gave us a direct warning, well one that I will speak of yet.

Thank you all for your kindness.

The Marines were not allowed to load their weapons because we were a peace keeping force, so along those lines they could not appear to be an offensive force. We had to rely on the LAF to protect us and that was a problem. This is the reason our motto is "They Came in Peace."

Few more little known facts, the morning of the bombing the always manned LAF check point was unmanned. THis check point was the security point for the entrance to the parking lot the bomber used.

Thanks for yr reply, Vet.

I should have said this earlier, but myself and my family thanks you for your bravery.

I am not a veteran but come from a long line of vets going back to King Philip's War, 130 years before this country was founded. I am proud of them all. And my son is joining th Navy to keep this tradition alive.

Thanks again.
:)

Rendova thank you but I wasnt brave just did my job as every Vet has since the begining of time. This is why I get so mad when people who have a problem with the politics take it out on the men and women in uniform. They are only doing a job, one they have chosen (now) and if the training stuck they will do it well.

Your son has made a wise choice, the Navy is the best branch.
Sorry to my Marine brothers from Beirut, but goit to stay loyal.

:)

Originally posted by Beirut_Veteran
Your son has made a wise choice, the Navy is the best branch.
Sorry to my Marine brothers from Beirut, but goit to stay loyal.

:)

I couldn't agree more BV. My dad was a Navy man and he made sure we knew about it. :D

Nice to have you back BV.

THanks Vile, good to be back. I do miss intelligent discussions.

Even though it appears I typed goit for got, wow I suck at typing :)

Navy, Schnavy.

Artillery is the king of battle.

Infantry is Queen and Artillery lays its balls where the Queen lies.

Second/Ninety Second Field Artillery.

Go Red Devils. Brave Cannons all the way.



http://www.bravecannons.org/main/coatarms3.jpg

Well frogger I learned a leson in Beirut, we are brothers in combat, but if you want to speak about Arty, then lets talk NGFS and the 16 inch guns of the BB's.

I have stood shoulder to shoulder with Marines in combat and guess what? We are the same, we all bleed and we all feel fear.

I am loyal to the Navy because I spent 9 years of my life in it, but my dad was 82nd airborne and most of my friends are Marines.

all of our military is honorable not just navy marines army NG airforce etc... it's all the branches serving our nation.

Beirut; thanks for the part about the leaders being the twisters of fate. Or men and women serving are fighting for something they believe in, their country. It is not their fault when our government forgets who we are an what our flag stands for.

Originally posted by Beirut_Veteran
The Marines were not allowed to load their weapons because we were a peace keeping force, so along those lines they could not appear to be an offensive force.

Here Joe take this unloaded weapon and go over there but make sure you look peacefull. Sorry but I never could understand this, kind of a stupid way to play with soldiers lives. Who ever came up with this brain fart idea? I'm not trying to be disrespectfull but if a dog has teeth it should be allowed to bite.

Mad the ROE ( rules of engagement) were written by the U.N. as when we first got there we were a part of a UN sanctioned MNPF then we became just a MNF. The lack of loading weapons I never understood either.
Now let me shake you up a bit more.

Lets say CP 76 was under fire from a defined position and you had permission to return fire when the terrorists left their position with their AK slunk over their shoulder you could NOT shoot them. You had to sit there and watch them place sand bags to shoot at you from and only when they shot at you could you fire.

We depended on the LAF for protection as to not interfere with the on going civil war, but the Syrian forces had Soviet advisors with them, I know this because of items found after a night of our Naval Gunfire Support.

When we resupplied the LAF so they wouldnt collapse with the MNF stuck in the middle we became targets and thus started the September War.

I was in Germany playing Army from '80 - '87. Many of the same rules of engagement applied. Even when there were protestors outside the gates & the Poleizi hosing them down with water cannons, our soldiers at the gates were only permitted to carry their clips inserted in the weapon, but no round in the chamber without specific orders. I can't imagine the same being applied where you were.
They sure never pulled that kind of crap on us while I was in 'Nam.

Hell it was clip in pouch not even in weapon.

thanks for the info Beirut :)

Es I was in Germany in 88-89{?} reforgier {I believe that is what it was called}. Watched a German guy have a tree fall on his head, he was out drinking some of that good German beer. I got to say Germany has some of the nicest country{castles also} that I've ever seen.

I ask all of you who support our troops to remember Beirut. Never forget what these men sacrificed their lives for. We protected what some would call a terrorist group and they died by the very same people whom we came to save.

Stayin' too long in Lebanon PROVED our boy's could git into...



...SYRIA'S trouble!




www.as-fer-iraq?.edu



well.dubbya-ta-go-climb-under-"won".edu




www.missin'-accomplished,even-as-bush-took-flight.edu