It's an alternative to that annual pissing on the First Amendment: The National Day of Prayer.

It's on the same day, but this one encourages something both very good and something all Americans can celebrate: and that is reason.

http://www.nationaldayofreason.org/index.html

Hey Borg.....can you tell me somethin? Doesnt the Pledge of Allegience have some words in there about "one nation, under god, indivisible, with etc. etc. etc.? Am i mistaken on the fact that this nation was Created as a fundamentaly religious nation? And before you go throwing names at me, i am most certainly NOT a bible thumper. I do not preach to other people about what they should or should not do with their lives. But why does the belief in a god strike such anger and resentment in people such as yourself? And forgive me if im wrong, but not all Americans are reasonable. Case in point, a certain someone who posts on these forums who will remain nameless but we all know who im talking about.

The "under God" part was added in June 1954. Which never should have happened: FIRST AMENDMENT.

Point taken. But have you by any chance read a little article called "The Declaration of Independence"?
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. By Creator who do you suppose they were talking about?

1st Am. supersedes any previous laws that conflict. That's why it's called an amendment (though it's amending the Constitution, not the Declaration of Independence). And the DoI doesn't really have any laws in itself, that's why the Constitution was written.

that is not what i was getting at borg........i was backing up my original assertion that this country was FOUNDED on belief in a Creator. A belief in A god. And you still havent answered any of my questions from my first post

Originally posted by HaVoK
Point taken. But have you by any chance read a little article called "The Declaration of Independence"?
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. By Creator who do you suppose they were talking about?

"Creator" certainly does not necessarily mean the Christian God. I'm sure they used to term "creator" to be intentionally ambiguous. The founders of our government were extraordinarily careful with their terminology. For example, they spent a long time trying to decide whether to give the president the power to "make war" or to "declare war." In other words, if they meant "God," they would've said "God."

Can anyone explain me what is the National Day of Prayer ?

Originally posted by Leper
"Creator" certainly does not necessarily mean the Christian God. I'm sure they used to term "creator" to be intentionally ambiguous. The founders of our government were extraordinarily careful with their terminology. For example, they spent a long time trying to decide whether to give the president the power to "make war" or to "declare war." In other words, if they meant "God," they would've said "God." If you will notice my third post on this thread. I said the belief in A creator...A god.....i did not put any name to this god or creator. And anyway, what do YOU think they meant by "Creator"? I mean, these were not the political animals that we have today as our leaders. These were pretty straightforward men.

Well, I think they meant exactly what "creator" means or in other words, it means whoever created you. People have different beliefs about who created them and that's why "creator" is an ambiguous term. "Creator" is not restricted to dieties, even though that's the prevailing belief. Personally, I think nature, or specifically your parents, is our creator. Some people think aliens are their creators.

Anyways, my point is the usage of the word "creator" in the Declaration of Independence is not an endorsement of religion. .

Originally posted by astrapol2
Can anyone explain me what is the National Day of Prayer ?
http://www.nationaldayofprayer.org

Originally posted by Leper
Well, I think they meant exactly what "creator" means or in other words, it means whoever created you. People have different beliefs about who created them and that's why "creator" is an ambiguous term. "Creator" is not restricted to dieties, even though that's the prevailing belief. Personally, I think nature, or specifically your parents, is our creator. Some people think aliens are their creators.

Anyways, my point is the usage of the word "creator" in the Declaration of Independence is not an endorsement of religion. . Once again....my original point was not that the DOI was an endorsement of religion. MY point was that this country was FOUNDED with a fundamental religious belief. Why is this not conveying to you? While respecting your beliefs about the interpretation of "creator" i have to disagree with you. If they had intended "creator" to signify parentage why would they not have simply said so? In most religious beliefs there was a "creator". I do not feel they were being ambiguous. In their time "creator" meant "The Creator".

Originally posted by HaVoK
Once again....my original point was not that the DOI was an endorsement of religion. MY point was that this country was FOUNDED with a fundamental religious belief.

Okay, I guess I'm overly anticipating where you're going with this point so I'll refrain from assumptions. Now, I'm not sure what you mean by "this country was FOUNDED with a fundamental religious belief." I'll concede that many of the founders had fundamental religious beliefs if that's what you're saying.

As for the definition of "creator," let's quote the text to which we're referring.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness."

The one thing I see going for your interpretation is that "Creator" is capitalized. This implies a unique entity. However, I would emphasize that they say "THEIR Creator" not "THE Creator." IMO, that personalizes Creator and grants the term many forms, including but not limited to dieties. From what I gather, you think "Creator" means a god. To that interpretation, I ask "Why didn't they use the word "god?"

But let's assume that you're correct. What do you think the significance of acknowledging that "this country was founded with a fundamental religious belief" accomplishes?

yeah, that is all i meant. that the founding fahters had a fundamental religous belief. And you do make a good point when you were talking about how they worded it "their Creator" instead of "The Creator". And you are correct in your assumption that i believe they meant for "Creator" to equal "God". Actually i think that acknowlegement of my earlier statement means very little. I was just wondering why it was so hard for people to even CONSIDER it. I appreciate you having an open enough mind to debate this with me. Very enjoyable talking to someone who isnt cursing me out just because my opinion differs from them.

According to the NDP site, this event was created in 1952. Am I wrong or wasn't it another manifestion of maccarthysm, like "in god we trust" on the dollar bill ?