It's a long, long way to democracy in Africa.
Yesyerday election took place in Togo - the fraud is supected to be massive and it could result in a bloodbath. Of course nobody cares.



Togo waits for result of violence-marred presidential poll


LOME (AFP) - People in Togo waited tensely for the result of a violence-marred presidential election that left three dead and more than 20 wounded in Lome, where calm was restored but many shops stayed closed.

(...)

An opposition official warned if Faure Gnassingbe, a 39-year-old finance expert and son of the late dictator Gnassingbe Eyadema, who ruled for more than 37 years, was declared winner, there would be street protests.

(...)


However, former colonial power France, on Monday said it "notes with satisfaction that Togo's presidential election took place in satisfactory conditions, even if we've had to take account of isolated incidents."

(...)

As vote counting began on Sunday, young opposition activists strongly criticised France, accusing Paris of supporting Gnassingbe, while the French opposition Socialist Party took a different line from the government's, calling for a whole new election after consultations with the international community, saying "no account should be taken of the outcome" of Sunday's "suspect" vote.



http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/afp/20050425/wl_afp/togovote_050425154039

we wouldnt want to be accused of setting up a puppet regime would we?

Originally posted by astrapol2
It's a long, long way to democracy in Africa.
Yesyerday election took place in Togo - the fraud is supected to be massive and it could result in a bloodbath. Of course nobody cares. The international community barely lifted a finger when people were being massacred in Africa, so this is hardly going to be a blip on the screen. Of course, it would be a completely different story if somthing like this happened in the Middle East.

So like, where's the oil?

in case you forgot we went to somalia and lost a hundred guys only to have it go right back to where it was when we got there.

Originally posted by Travh20
in case you forgot we went to somalia and lost a hundred guys only to have it go right back to where it was when we got there. And I applaud the effort. At least we tried. But if the world hadn't chickened out when it came to Rwanda, 800,000 innocent people might have still been alive today. And the situation in Darfur apparently wasn't important enough for the UN to get off its rear and do something worthwhile.

I agree, you dont have to sell me the idea the UN if completly worthless when it comes down to it. They can all assemble and say how much they care, but if they dont get any boots on the ground what good is it? and considering most of the uN thinks the US is an imperial menace, why would we go anywhere for them? so they could turn around and accuse us of installing puppet regimes?

Good points astrolpol2. This shit goes down all the time in africa and never gets reported.

Trav, you seem to be suggesting the US avoids doing good because others might accuse them of selfish intentions.

Hardly a sound foreign policy, imo. You'd also think they'd have deliberately avoided their do-gooding antics in Iraq, which has freed up oil and generated a lot of contracts for american based companies.

Besides, neo-cons explicitly state their wish to spread american ideals. How is this inconsistent with establishing puppet regimes?

you can not accuse a country of being expansionist imperialists and of not doing enough good in the world at the same time.

I agree that the U.N. is completely worthless and more of a problem starter than problem fixer.

The idea behind it is good, unfortunately(as the league of nations was before it) it is too political and undecisive.

Originally posted by Travh20
you can not accuse a country of being expansionist imperialists and of not doing enough good in the world at the same time.
And to avoid those accusations is the sound basis for US foreign policy?

the best way to avoid baseless accusations is to avoid them. the US, being the lone world super poer is ina position of Damned if we do, damned if we dont". we cant try to make everyone happy, becasue it is simply impossible. we cant continue to be the whiping boy of the UN and have them depend on us at the same time. We have just as much right to look out for our best interests as does every other nation on earth. Whne we do we are labled evil and every other name in the book.

We have just as much right to look out for our best interests as does every other nation on earth.By installing puppet regimes and following a neo-con imperialist agenda, perhaps.

BTW, I'm neither pro nor anti american. But your position seems muddled.

For example the following comment suggests that US foreign policy should be based on pandering to negative perceptions within the UN:
and considering most of the uN thinks the US is an imperial menace, why would we go anywhere for them?

Originally posted by Travh20
you can not accuse a country of being expansionist imperialists and of not doing enough good in the world at the same time.

I agree with you in reference to hypocrites who jump the U.S. for invading countries, then jump on the U.S. for failing to invade a day later.

However, I don't think any major country in the U.N. has ever referred to the U.S. as "imperialist" in an official statement.

As was unfortunately predictable :

Mr Gnassingbe won 60% of the vote in Sunday's election, but the opposition said the polls had been marred by irregularities.

"We call on the people to resist," said Jean-Pierre Fabre, secretary general of the opposition Union of Forces for Change. "This regime must understand that we will never accept Faure Gnassingbe as president of the republic because neither his father nor him could win a normal election in Togo," he told Reuters. The main opposition candidate, Bob Akitani, took 38% of the vote, or 841,000 votes against 1.4m for Mr Gnassingbe.

Togo's new president was minister of mines in his father's government. The army installed him as leader hours after his father's death to prevent a "vacuum of power".

The tally of votes does not include those cast at about 700 polling stations which were destroyed during violent clashes on Sunday. While votes were being cast the opposition presidential candidate alleged widespread voting fraud.

"The stuffing of ballot boxes is occurring on a large scale and we haven't heard of a single polling station where everything is going well," Mr Akitani said.

Hours before polls closed armed men raided the headquarters of Togo's opposition and seized computers the opposition planned to use to collate and check the poll results.

On Monday night the Nigerian government sought to broker a deal under which both sides would form a government of national unity.

But opposition leader Gilchrist Olympio, who was barred from standing because he lives in exile, said his party would not serve as a minority partner in any coalition. He said there had been massive fraud in the poll.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,,1470865,00.html

No wonder Gilchrist Olympio does not want to be in a govt with Gnassingbe.
Gnassingbe is the son of former dicattor Eyadema, who admitted in killed with his bare hads Olympio's father, first president (and democratically elected) in 1963 !

Of course Chirac's govt has been saying the elections were right.

Originally posted by Leper
I agree with you in reference to hypocrites who jump the U.S. for invading countries, then jump on the U.S. for failing to invade a day later.

However, I don't think any major country in the U.N. has ever referred to the U.S. as "imperialist" in an official statement.

Being a hypocrite myself, i totally agree with trav and leper (Dr Smith: 'evil... knows evil').

However (don't you just love that word)

no one has suggested the US, or anyone else go visiting in Africa (specifically, Darfur) either. Apparently the UN, as a group of 'united nations' decided not to send troops into Darfur which could have potentially saved hundred of lives:


Draft Security Council Resolution on Sudan (February 14, 2005)

The US has circulated a draft resolution, calling for the establishment of a UN mission in Sudan (UNMISUD) to monitor the Comprehensive North- South Peace Agreement, and for the imposition of measures against those “who impede the peace process [and] constitute a threat to stability in Darfur and the region.” The draft resolution fails to address the question of impunity in Darfur and a possible ICC referral, simply stating, "perpetrators […] must be brought to justice through internationally accepted means."

Resolution 1591 (March 29, 2005)

In response to the failure of all armed parties in Sudan to comply with previous Security Council resolutions, the Council has ordered a travel ban and a freeze on all assets for human rights violators in Sudan. The resolution does not include an oil embargo, which China would almost certainly have vetoed. The document is a modified version of an earlier US draft resolution, which called for the establishment of a peacekeeping mission as well as sanctions, including a freeze on the country's "economic resources."


http://www.globalpolicy.org/security/issues/sudanindex.htm

right box. but when the UN fails to act its the US fault, when the UN does anything good, its the UN's doing. remember the UN sanctions agaisnt Iraq? to this day when the number of children who died when saddam didnt use the money to but food for his people they are called "US sanctions.

the US is the UN's new whipping boy: (was it you who said that earlier? can't remember) it's to be expected. it was the same thing with germany after WW1 (reparations), then again with the UK after WW2 (no more colonies) and now, after gulf war 2, its your turn. don't worry, trav. i believe russia's up next.

I certainly agree that if the US sent troops to Darfur many would still cry "american imperialism". I wouldn't though. Neither do I complain about the intervention in the former yugoslavia.

But that doesn't mean there are not examples where the US has indeed abused its military superiority, sometimes illegally, for its own benefit. The Iran-Contra affair would be a well known case in point.